Extension- Last Stuff.

[ProDave]

35 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

"Two new boards, waiting to come from germany.." they kept telling me ProDave. Yeah right I thought/ surely not made just for me-? BS.

 

But an issue in all units (afaict) rectified by making new circuit boards, & getting das engleesman engineers to install in all units sold. afaict. Very costly surely. & not very german is it.

Thanks.

 

Worth putting a post about the solution on your rotten heat pump thread so anyone reading it finds that there is a fix.

[zoothorn]

@PeterW ok understood, & I will try now its 'fixed' for as long as is neccessary/ 2 weeks or so.

 

But I have to have a fan heater on as well as the rad in both my kitchen and bathroom: i take the thing from one room to another its essential or I'll freeze my butt off (cannot have a shower without it on at dial 3/4). Now in kitchen here: rad been hot all day (CH set to 20*) & fan on too & running on dial 2/3rds way up.. & Im still in a wooly hat & scarf, my legs cold my nose is cold! So tbh I just dont see the point of having the rad on too.

 

The temp in my bathroom right now is 9.7*C. It was 9.3* stone cold at 8am (no rad on all night, rad only just turned on at 8am due to noise issue). This will not change just bc I leave the CH on for a week. It'll still be 9.5C. My plums are so constantly retreating I'm actually worried my voice has started to go 'a bit falsetto'.

[joe90]

1 minute ago, zoothorn said:

My plums are so constantly retreating I'm actually worried my voice has started to go 'a bit falsetto'.

????????

 

2 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

This will not change just bc I leave the CH on for a week

frankly you don’t know that (now you can have it on longer), my house took weeks to get up to temp because the walls, floors etc needed to get up to temp, once at that temp it was easier to keep it that way. You have very thick stone walls (in the old bit) with no insulation, that will take time to warm up. IF, once up to temp, it won’t stay that way then the system was designed wrongly and (here I go again!) NOT FIT FIR PURPOSE.   give it a chance.

[Onoff]

14 hours ago, zoothorn said:

Aha ok that makes sense. Right hinge here ( not fixed obviously). 10" long the door side: i hope with 3x instead of 2x like my other bedroom doors i think 12" jobs, they'll be sufficient. Door is bit thicker @ 20mm (plus 25mm ledges, chosen just in case I need to put PIR on the back).

 

 

 

@zoothorn, cracking job and duly liked. Can I ask why the hinges are going on the 20mm door and not the 25mm ledges like this one? I'm not 100% sure what way your door is opening, into your new room like this one?

 

Or is it that you come out of the new room, up the couple of steps then the door opens into the old room with the hinges on the left?

 

I tend to draw a light centreline on the ledge and fit the hinges to the ledges first. Then prop/wedge the door in the hole and mark where the hinges go onto the jam. 

 

 

(I could have sworn I posted this exact same question and picture in here the other day. If the mods took it down...why? Could well be me, not been a good week and heads all over the place).

 

Edited January 8, 2021 by Onoff

[PeterW]

7 hours ago, Onoff said:

If the mods took it down...why? Could well be me

Not been edited so would have to go with the latter ... 

[Onoff]

22 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Not been edited so would have to go with the latter ... 

 

I'm losing it clearly! ?

[zoothorn]

@Onoff no sorry my photo is misleading, hinge just plonked on for idea of how far in it should go, and not even on the correct side here (it'll go on the other 'front' side, 3x of them on the ledges.. unless 2x is recommended instead).

 

So in your photo, mine will be different: as you exit new room, up 3x steps the door's ledge & brace side visible (& thumb latch will have to be on the LHS the only caveat), and door will open away into the old bedroom, with hinges on the RHS as you walk thru.

 

The hinges will be in old bedroom side (the architrave side) with the 'front' of the door this side, and the wee latch thing on the RHS.. which will look a bit odd but no choice. So my ledge side of door.. will sit on the plant-ons. This is 'goofy' as it were (snowboard talk, I think).

[joe90]

11 minutes ago, Onoff said:

 

I'm losing it clearly! ?

Join the club ?

[Onoff]

38 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

@Onoff no sorry my photo is misleading, hinge just plonked on for idea of how far in it should go, and not even on the correct side here (it'll go on the other 'front' side, 3x of them on the ledges.. unless 2x is recommended instead).

 

So in your photo, mine will be different: as you exit new room, up 3x steps the door's ledge & brace side visible (& thumb latch will have to be on the LHS the only caveat), and door will open away into the old bedroom, with hinges on the RHS as you walk thru.

 

The hinges will be in old bedroom side (the architrave side) with the 'front' of the door this side, and the wee latch thing on the RHS.. which will look a bit odd but no choice. So my ledge side of door.. will sit on the plant-ons. This is 'goofy' as it were (snowboard talk, I think).

 

I understand that fully...which is a first! ? Sounds like a plan!

 

When fitting your plant ons, don't bang the panel pins all the way in to start off with. This way you can just sit them on with the pins banged in ever so slightly. Makes it easy to remove and reposition. 

[zoothorn]

14 hours ago, joe90 said:

frankly you don’t know that (now you can have it on longer), my house took weeks to get up to temp because the walls, floors etc needed to get up to temp, once at that temp it was easier to keep it that way. You have very thick stone walls (in the old bit) with no insulation, that will take time to warm up. IF, once up to temp, it won’t stay that way then the system was designed wrongly and (here I go again!) NOT FIT FIR PURPOSE.   give it a chance.

 

Yup understood. But your house is well insulated (I assume). Mine.. well only 2 rooms are. In theory.

 

I'm not complaining about CH's (in)abilities in rooms other than the 2 new ones. It cannot possibly heat these older 5x rooms (so my main 1830 room big shell [tho it does its best to, helped by a very low ceiling] my 2x 80's extentions ungodly cold). They're just too cold. Look:

 

Today kitchen (CH on 6.30 flow temp 55*!) @ 8.30am = 13.3*. @ 6am it was = 12.7*. I do not blame the CH, if the insulation is non-existant.

My bathroom 8.30am = 9.3*. Now if temp at 5pm is just 9.7* then the Q of having rads on at all (if you can't even feel any difference), in these 2x very cold rooms, is surely worthy to ask. But I'll give your weeks' idea a go, of course.

 

Right, new bedroom [this is the only worthwhile test of the CH, new fairly-well insulated room]. @ 6am = 12.9*. If at 8.30am big rad on since 6.30am: if I measure only 14.6*, then even in here with the benefit in 2hrs @ 8AM of just 1.2*.. asking is it worth it in here too is also a worthy Q surely? Yes it can get warm'ish by 4pm (CH on in day to nominal 18.5*) to say 17.8* lingering well enough to 11.30pm that I'm ok at this part of the day (prooving the room's sufficiently, if not perfectly, insulated). So it works ok.. given 8 hrs rads on 1st!

 

But this is the rub: I need heat primarily/ fundamentally, at 8am. Not 4pm & I do not want to pay out nor have the rads on all hrs overnight to achieve this (I don't like sweating overnight/ I don't like any rad on overnight, nor the wasteful knowledge of many rads on when I don't want them on, nor the funds to run it 24/7).. so its mostly, but not totally, hopeless.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So any complaint I have is --discounting-- these 5x rooms. Because I just dont blame it having a rad nice and hot on for many hours, as is proven, in a tiny bathroom which has such cold walls & floor.. that

[joe90]

Zoot, one of your problems will be the doors from old to new parts are not insulated or airtight so the old will suck heat from the new. Lack of insulation should have been calculated when your system was designed.

[zoothorn]

23 hours ago, joe90 said:

Zoot, one of your problems will be the doors from old to new parts are not insulated or airtight so the old will suck heat from the new. Lack of insulation should have been calculated when your system was designed.

 

Yup, once I fit new door I may get a jot more heat contained in this new bedroom. But the thick blanket's doing a good job, all holes filled with pillows, & I can feel has helped (I even wonder if its doing a better job than the door will tbh). So I'm confident now, finally, I have sufficient loft insulation + sufficient barrier to my adjacent old bedroom to determine how this CH system -can- perform. And it gets to 18.5*C in here. Ok.

 

But not before 3pm ish. Now 11am for eg, its 16.3* in here.

 

So it takes from 6.30 am............ to 2pm to get this new room up near desired temp (set to 18.5*C). Ive tried setting it to 22*C to see if rads get going better, but the same results/ they don't "run any faster". The rest of the 'old' and 'older' house is n/a in terms of how effective the CH can be as I explained (its just too cold) ie @ 3pm in kitchen its 13.3* ..same temp at 9am. It is not capable of getting warm using a 'normally hot' wall radiator.

 

So I will -never- be able to "get the house warmed up". I've run it all day for weeks from 6.30am > 9pm (@ average 19*C desired temp). ONLY the 2x new rooms get warm, & are therefore likely capable of this theoretical "get the house warmed up" situation, to aide my CH system, because, they have insulation. If the rest of the house doesn't, you just cannot expect it to be capable of "getting warmed up" (unless the jet engine introduced idea).

 

There is a possible way to "get the house warmed" of course.. by introducing a massive ammount of heat (a totally hyperthetical idea, like a huge outdoor burner thing flat out for 12hrs). But in reality, there just isn't in most of -this- house.

[joe90]

6 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

So I will -never- be able to "get the house warmed up".

So why don’t you go back to the installer and tell them that, their job was to design a ch system that “works” and yours does not.
 

Have you thought of a wood burning stove to ramp up the heat? (You did mention woods near you!!!). (And chopping the wood will get you warm?).

Edited January 9, 2021 by joe90

[zoothorn]

You wouldn't believe it.. last night woken 3x by the system coming on. 3.20, 4.30, 6.10am. After engineer here on thurs to install these '2 new boards'. Seven months of this. 8x engineer visits. Still doing it. This time its 'live indicator' saying at the time "HEATING. HEAT COMPRESSOR ACTIVE". The moon symbol is there/ the setback temp set as has been to 10*C/ the room temp is 12.5*C at 3.20am. I cannot deal with this anymore. So no hallelujah after all.

 

Can you f****ng believe this wretched thing??

 

I did get the water leak/ low pressure fiasco -finally- fixed on friday. One small result Ive waited 7 months for, installers responsible for this (incorrect linking up to expansion vessel). Massive effort, calls, emails, threats of xyz suggested on here I threw at them. Appalling just this, but nothing compared to this infernal system coming on overnight dabacle. Nothing.

 

Joe you've been 100% right from months ago, it is not fot fir purpise. And if I'd paid for it I'd be in more dismay than I am, and likely have had it removed/ taken Vaillant to small claims court, claimed on insurance? I don't know. But bc its foc, & I have zero funds to replace it I have no choice but keep battling.

 

The dept who oversaw the whole govt scheme, whom Ive made call after call to, (to get him to try putting pressure on installer Co to fix leak) offered to 'have it removed for you' if thats what you want. Not that Im offered anything to replace it tho, it'd have to spend many thousands for something to replace it.. which I don't have. So I'm stuck with it you see.. fot fir porpoise or nit.

[JFDIY]

But you presumably have a contract to provide you with a heating system? Backed by government or local council.

 

If so they should fulfill it, if not they should be forced to re-instate your old system. Don't let them take it out and leave you with nothing.

 

If necessary instigate legal proceedings, or better still take it up with local authority first.

If they just take it out they'll have to put you in emergency accomodation if you lay it on thick enough with them.

 

Edited January 9, 2021 by JFDIY

[zoothorn]

14 minutes ago, joe90 said:

So why don’t you go back to the installer and tell them that, their job was to design a ch system that “works” and yours does not.
 

Have you thought of a wood burning stove to ramp up the heat? (You did mention woods near you!!!). (And chopping the wood will get you warm?).

 

Joe installers months since refused to communicate. So I got onto 1) the dept who oversaw govt scheme, to ask to contact installers (didn't get much joy/ no response back to me).. then & the only plausible way to get leak fixed, by 2) contacting Vaillant for umpteenth time, to pressure THEM to contact the Co (who sub contracted installation, to my installers). This did the trick. Blood from a stone. Huge persistance.

 

So installers didn't want anything to do with fixing leak. So, there was never a hope in hell of explaining it's their 'fault' what they proposed & installed is not performing (let alone demanding x&y): as I say till cows come home, it is not their fault either if this house is SO cold; & its partly my fault I agreed to it, &, I knew 100% it wouldn't be able to heat this 'old' house. I knew no CH system will as its got no insulation (unless a HUGE wallop of heat introduced, wherby a CH system is different & not its purpose). I only ever expected it to heat my 2 new rooms.

 

So (only via Vaillant) this visit on friday by 'installers' was at last agreed to. Actually just a solo plumber came, not part of the install team at all, saw immediately X was connected wrong > tallied with Vaillant (I demanded their notes to have ready prior to his visit, to ensure what he proposed tallied: it did woohoo: fix job well done).

[zoothorn]

Just now, JFDIY said:

But you presumably have a contract to provide you with a heating system? If do they should fulfill it, if not they should be forced to re-instate your old system. Don't let them take it out and leave you with nothing.

 

If necessary instigate legal proceedings

 

JFDIY, my old system comprised of a near rotten mouse ridden tank. That's it. I had no CH, no rads. So this wasn't an option.

 

The only thing I was offered was to remove it, not by installers (will not contact me), but by chap in coucil dept who gave out the contracts to the installers. In other words/ as I felt/ he was pressuring me as a 'last step', almost threatening to take it out. IE leave me with nothing. Thetefore blackmailing me to put up or shut up.

 

I have no fight to go to courts & solicitors etc. Its too stressful, mainly as I can't afford it, also bc I can't understand protocol like this (also I feel a distinct 1x tiny english against many bigger welsh), also doesn't seem right if its foc too. This is why Ive had no option but this protracted try try try with idea of keeping the wretched thing. I just want it to shut the fk up, at night. That's all now I want.

 

I cannot cope with anymore of trying xy&z. Im exhausted with it. But I have to, again, get onto Vaillant.. yet another track to tackle the overnight noise still going on. Once/ if this is/ can ever be resolved so I can leave heating to go on from 6.30am, as I should be able to, whatevever poor results I get from the wretched thing... I have to put up with. In other words, this system I'm stuck with, is infuriatingly noisy & useless until 3pm.

[zoothorn]

1 hour ago, joe90 said:

Have you thought of a wood burning stove to ramp up the heat? (You did mention woods near you!!!). (And chopping the wood will get you warm?).

 

I can get decent heat for a few nice hrs 2x a week, from my log burner. It even pushes a bit of heat into kitchen between 7-10pm.

 

I cant afford more than 2x (my work dried up), logs impossible to buy unless green here, so my stock's 1 thin ash of mine felled here last year.. needs to do all winter. But its a big treat I look fwd to: due to huge house cold (2x rads in main room only ever take the nip off, nothing more) bc it takes sooo many logs to get heat into room, a big fairly heavy basket's gone in 2hrs. 'My' forest felled too so my fab source of foraged softwood gone (or it'd be 4x a week like winters before).

 

So the CH is there to serve one chief purpose: warmth AM, in 1 new bedroom. But it can't even do this (unless you keep rads on overnight which I don't like or want). Its this AM heat that's essential but just elusive here. All other times its not essential, but a bonus.

 

Log burner doesn't help in mornings of course. Takes 1hr to get heat from so not conjusive to light say 8AM, for me, unless I had a mountain of free logs. Yup during beast from east, I had no choice but huge long walks to keep warm/ exercise I know great way to keep cold at bay.

 

 

[Onoff]

Zoot, have you got any South facing windows / walls that get good Sun, even in winter? 

Edited January 9, 2021 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

21 hours ago, Onoff said:

Zoot, have you got any South facing windows / walls that get good Sun, even in winter? 

 

Hi Onoff, yes new top bedroom: fab for light.. actually sun blasting in last 2 days I think does as much as the rad. Got it up to 19.5*C on sat 4pm, best yet in here, whatnot set to 18.5*C.

 

Its this damn CH morning rads performance. Late up today jump outta bed 10.15am hoping some warmth in new room.. but nothing. Temp 14.7*C (12.5*C at 6.30am). This is consistant with it making 1*C of room heat per hour, in this new room, if/ with the rad -only- giving out heat from 8AM (not say from ~6.50am as one might expect). It's hopeless.

 

I talked to Vaillant chief engineer re. this "rad delay 8am start" thing, & he said 'yup, it has a block until 8am.. noise reasons' (Eh?? & I mean the very irony of 'noise').. 'you can change 8am figure' he said. How tho (if true) I call Vaillant team, yet again, who've no idea of what he said.

 

If occasionally I do find rads -are- hot before 8am tho, as I found a few times, then what engineer said isn't wholly true. Urgh. More calls to Vaillant. Un fkn believable how many hours of calls, emails, 8x visits, & essentially same probs as 7 months ago remain.

 

 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff or @PeterW just to change tack (sorry spieling on my CH chaps.. its sooo frustrating I need to vent it out).

 

Ive got black mould, & bad condensation on low panes of my french doors. Pools of water on the big threshold step 1st thing, black mould in reveal corners going up. 3x reveals have insulated pB, step 50mm PIR under/ best I could stuff in.

 

Anything to worry about? I mean what will the BCO say if he notices?

 

thx zH

 

 

Edited January 10, 2021 by zoothorn

[zoothorn]

2pm,  new top room built to hunker down in on cold days like today.. is currently 15.2*C. Seems much worse today.

 

In 4 hrs (heating on since 6.30am) its raised this room temp by 0.5* C. So Im very cold, legs, feet, nose cold, so hat scarf even electric blanket on just to get a jot of heat into my back in a new modern room with a huge rad on. I give up.

[TonyT]

Can I ask if you rent the property or own the property?  Cause I can’t figure it out when you said you didn’t pay for the heating system?

 

maybe some pictures of the heat pump, controller, outside install etc that may help diagnose the problem further.
 

Cheers!

[newhome]

2 hours ago, TonyT said:

Can I ask if you rent the property or own the property?  Cause I can’t figure it out when you said you didn’t pay for the heating system?

It will be on one of those ‘we install and you assign the RHI rights to us’ schemes I imagine. Zoot owns the property. 
 

[Gone West]

18 hours ago, zoothorn said:

In 4 hrs (heating on since 6.30am) its raised this room temp by 0.5* C. So Im very cold, legs, feet, nose cold, so hat scarf even electric blanket on just to get a jot of heat into my back in a new modern room with a huge rad on.

Do you know the temperatures of both of the pipes connected to the radiator and the top of the radiator itself after it's been on for four hours?