Nickfromwales

Seen some wall mounted external Givenergy units recently, seemed to not project too far from the wall, but Tesla prob worth a look too. I guess just googling the dims of various units is your best bet.

Taken from the ‘other’ thread, for completeness. Beelbeebub Posted 1 hour ago · IP This sort of should be in the "green building" section - except my point is that it shouldn't be a "green" issue. To cut along story short I've not included links but can provide if anyone is interested. The UK urgently needs to reduce of consumption of fossil fuels - and it has absolutely nothing to do with the climate. The UK is highly dependant of fossil fuels for 2 areas: - Transport (petrol & diesel) - Domestic heating (mainly gas) For the above uses we currently import 50% of what we use. This leaves us vulnerable to price shifts in the global market and outright coersion should someone sanction/embargo/blockade our supplies and the majority of the suppliers of those vital resources are not friendly states and have to travel via long sea routes. By 2035 - just 10 years away - we are predicted to need to import 75% of oil and gas (if demand stays the same). At this point someone usually says "ah! That is why we must drop this net zero nonsense and drill for oil and gas to become self sufficient!" The problem with this argument is that figure of 75% imports is from the oil and gas industry's most optimistic projections. It assumes that: - we are able to extract the maximum predicted amount out of our existing fields - we are able to extract the maximum predicted amount out of all the fields awaiting licences - we are able to extract the maximum predicted amount out of all the fields we know about - we are able to extract the maximum predicted amount out of some fields we haven't yet discovered In short this is like predicting our future income assuming we get promoted, get a bonus, a distant uncle leaves us his fortune and we win the lottery. If we use the more sober assessment then in 10 years time we will need to import 90% of our consumption (assuming it stays the same). In short UK oil and gas production will fall every year even in the most optimistic predictions. In order to avoid this major vulnerability to our economy and sovereignty we need to reduce our demand for fossil fuels. 1) Reducing our demand for gas heating in houses by insulation and moving away from gas boilers would reduce our gas demand - yes, even if we generate the extra elecreicty needed by burning gas. 2) Reducing our demand for oil by (amongst other things) reducing the number of fossil fuel vehicles To support the above we need to increace our electrical generation and distribution capability by building new wind farms, solar farms, rooftop solar, transmission lines etc In short all of the "Net zero" things that usually sit in the "green" forum and regularly get trashed by people saying "ah all this green nomsense! Just woke crap a making us poorer! Bloody Greta etc etc" But really it should sit in the national security and economic forum. Quote MikeSharp01 Posted 1 hour ago · IP I guess that has always been part of the thinking although its not very joined up is it, we are not building the skills to make this transition, not educating the public so they understand why they should get behind the programme and much of the 'gear' is imported. Quote JohnMo Posted 51 minutes ago · IP As with most things in this country everything is a political football. Not even sure the decision makers have a clue about most things, they just do what the whips tell them to do. Add to this with, how much money comes from industry with vested interest, in not making sensible decisions easy or even correct. We just need a new political structure, nothing simple Quote ProDave Posted 47 minutes ago · IP I have said before, if Energy security was the stated reason for more renewable energy (because we are coming to the end of our own fossil fuel reserves) then I am sure more people would agree with it. Quote SteamyTea Posted 36 minutes ago · IP I was pondering how many people are employed in the oil and gas industry in the UK. Found this https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2020-0036/CDP-2020-0036.pdf (bit old now) This is the 1.1 summary. Summary: UK Offshore Oil and Gas Industry • The UK oil and gas industry (both onshore and offshore) employed 31,000 people directly and a further 121,000 in relevant supply chains in 2019, according to estimates from the industry body Oil and Gas UK. Overall, employment in the industry has fallen by 35% since 2013.2 • In 2016/17, government revenues from oil and gas production were £1.2 billion. This was a slight increase on previous years, but overall, tax revenue from oil and gas has declined sharply over the past decade.3 • Drilling has generally been in decline. In 2018, a total of 102 wells were drilled. Other than an increase in development wells from 2017, the number of exploration and appraisal wells commenced in 2018 fell to 8 of each; for development this was the lowest number of new wells since 1965. • Capital investment has also been falling, with investment of £5 billion in 2018, compared to £16.3 billion in 2014. The industry expects investment to stabilise in 2019 at around £5-5.5 billion per year. • The cost of decommissioning was increasing to £1.7 billion in 2018, and is expected to level out and cost £1.5 billion per year to 2027 Quote 1 min Nickfromwales locked this topic Nickfromwales Posted just now · IP @Beelbeebub, please refrain from starting two identical threads in two different forums! Its like watching a game of chuffing tennis. Members who wish to reply, please continue to do so in the other thread found here:

Just cover all the pipes with a couple of turns of either duct tape or pvc electrical tape to stave off corrosion. You can then back fill the chases with dot & dab board adhesive etc or just foam them in, but best to cover the bare copper imho.

What he said.

You can turn the T and still get a thin rod up to the bath, so no worries there. Water will come out of the WC pan before it gets anywhere near that high, but rule of thumb is as you show. 200mm is plenty, but you can go higher, just no point afaic.

This!! A decent (👀) architect will be doing the brunt of this, and basically NOT designing a house that they know would rock the boat. If you push the envelope then the planning consultant is your new friend. But not until then.

I do like this forum. Some very useful information , and real life feedback here. Thanks for the additional detail @TerryE Tres bien. 👌.

Boilers usually have the trap inbuilt . I’ve fitted more gas boilers than I care to remember, and we’ve never had to fit a 3rd party trap. And yes, your pic is spot on.

The pipe off the 110mm should be 50mm up to where it heads in to the bath, turning in on a T with a rodding access (cleaning eye) for maintenance. From the 50mm T you reduce to 40mm to get to the bath T, and then the 40mm pipe continues to the boiler. That then terminates at a 40mm T with the centre of the T having a 40 > 21.5mm reducer in it for the boiler condensate, and a 40mm air admittance valve to complete the run. Absolutely ZERO need for a GSR plumber, this will just add wasted expense.

If you’d have said that earlier, I’d have said don’t dab! Metal frame saves the day (or timber) at that depth.

Tough for them. Tell them you’ll be using insulated closers and then they WILL be using brackets, as per the rest of the world! Stop asking them, and tell them. For hefty bifolds this is the standard way to get a solid fixing.

No. The pipe running from the UVC / hot manifold is direct to the outlet. The HRC pump is on the return, at the UVC, so has no effect on the delivered lpm. Sizing the pipework is critical for differing distances from the plant / UVC, and working out which outlets are needed most frequently etc, so needs a bit of thought, but a good design will reap excellent results. As stated above, even taking the return off at a point not immediately behind the outlet has significant penalties, and my thoughts are why the feck go to all this trouble, cost etc and still suffer any kind of compromises?

I was an exhibitor for 5 years, and a huge amount of people got to me, after all the sales BS had been deeply embedded in them, and then (as a consultant) they got to speak to me in an impartial setting. Most left me and shook my hand, saying thanks for showing them how to filter out the crap they’d just been subjected to, by themselves. How can 7 different ASHP or MVHR suppliers all be “the best one on the market”…..? Ask them to prove it, and then they start sweating. I got approached by a mass home developer after I was recommended by an ICF supplier, to support with a ‘new direction’ they were exploring. Building with ICF, going airtight, MVHR as standard (only for exclusive offerings £750k and up iirc), but when I stated Part O, cooling, and that can of worms was placed on a cooperate table somewhere, that all went stone dead; the sausages just kept falling out of the factory and they were being snapped up by folk who didn’t know any different, so they had no interest in changing course or doing things better. If nobody is demanding it, I guess there’s hesitance to supply it.

Scrap the bigger trap, move to a P or bottle trap, enjoy life with a job well done. Traps are easy to ‘self clean’, so it’s no biggy.

I’d just say beware of anyone who is partisan because they’ve used one system. I’ve been fortunate to work with multiples, warts and all, so am giving a balanced and real life overview from hands-on experiences.

Respectfully, nobody puts a 40mm trap on a 32mm sink. Agreed, they should have just said no, but sales always starts with a “yes”, and the let down follows after a lot of laborious provocation.

I wasn’t referring to damp issues, just that during the construction phase there was a lot of rain that made its way indoors, or had soaked into the lower sections of the interior woodcrete leaf. Not an issue with EPS, but it’s less DIY friendly (depending on what block you go for). I'd steer well clear of Velox, had loads of blowouts with that.

Just reduce 40>32mm at the point these two meet, and fit a smaller trap? That’s what I do, as I never run long lengths of 32mm pipe for basins any more, always 40mm and then reduce at the bend where it turns from vertical to horizontal. I use a 40mm 90° bend with a 40>32mm reducer glued into the bend, and then a short piece of 32mm to an 1.5” trap. Simples. You can even just buy an anti-siphon 1.5” trap.

Is there mastic sealant under the cill? As it appears to be a unit that weeps out of that small shadow gap, onto the top of the cill and away, then I’d say you’ll be better off pumping a load of clear sealant under the cill to appease the BCO. They often don't / won’t comment on solutions or methodology as they get into trouble or can become liable if their suggestion fails. Some BCO’s are helpful and pragmatic, others are clueless, obtuse dickheads. As your builder if the weep / drip from the frame of the unit only comes out above the cill. If so, pump it full of clear frame sealant and you’ll be fine. Out of curiosity, has it been in for long and any signs of ingress to date? FYI, this is your builders problem to solve, not yours, so get them to take over solving the problem but tell them you want to discuss it before they “do something” and you don’t know what it was, plus your BCO will need to say they’re happy with it before it’s done; you could end up having to remove the sealant if they don’t like / approve it.

Kick them to the kerb ffs. This is ever so slightly important, so don’t give poor performance a second chance to romance you back into you using them. Put your efforts in now, and don’t just use them because of this initial familiarity, so far they’re not looking good at all. ”Bin”. Simple as.

Avoid that Sineat(?) adhesive. Was getting sucked dry in no time, and boards weren’t staying stuck to it if any open time had been introduced. Switched back to Gypsum and totally different results. Client bought Sineat stuff as it was the path of least resistance, but even their plasterboards were shit in comparison. If a roller dipped in 50/50 SBR/water solution, put on with a shaggy roller is cheap and simple, then I’d say sizing the walls the day before to bind the surfaces would be a no brainer. Not exactly something you can revisit, is it? Don’t get lazy now, get your finger back out and put in the time and effort 🫡. SBR is cheap enough, and can even be applied with a Hozelock spray bottle that you pump up, but you Siri need to take a soft brush to the wall (hence the roller application as it kills both birds).

Just using a porous block which has a continuous woodcrete bridge from external leaf to the internal leaf, doesn’t bode well. Needs a lot more detailing, such as parge coat for airtightness, but it’s just very poor vs EPS and let’s rainwater through which is annoying and caused delays on a previous project. If you’re rendering, it’s also much more of a process to get it to a point where the walls are flat / smooth enough to flat(single)-coat. Nudura are very good blocks, and are 8’ long so produce much straighter walls and fill area faster. PM me if you need a good ICF installer to do founds / frame / roof / floors & walls etc via one contractor.

….. no comment, lol which is very unlike me! Good that you feel confident doing the filter check, nothing better than that sense of accomplishment and it’s good to get to grips with simple shit you can check yourself (like dipping the oil in the car etc). Quite a few folk on here mention the Heat Geeks for having a decent installer network, so maybe start looking into getting some names and numbers. I think the HG’s are middlemen, so expect to pay them and have a 3rd party subby turn up. That’s what happened on the job I’ve just been on, also felt a little “rushed” on the full install with some schoolboy errors. The boss of the firm that sub’d was a good egg and quite knowledgeable in the cold light of day, but they are very much in and out to make money imho. When asked to do some extras, it was a firm “no thanks”. The lad (+1) that were left on site were nice guys, so as a minimum at least they didn’t offend! Russian roulette it seems, but if you saw the job I’ve been on this week you’d consider yourself bloody lucky. Absolute pile of dogshit, so I’ve ripped the lot out and done it all from scratch. Not one bit could be retained, just a joke, and the previous “engineer” on his mother’s side just left a couple of Boy Scouts behind who didn’t even own pipe clips. I mean not one single pipe was clipped, including the D2 discharge, with the weight of that having broken the sunfish into two halves which were just hanging a few inches from each other. Theres always someone worse off etc, but just an embarrassing offering of people with great websites and shiny new vans paid for by unsuspecting victims of underwhelming cock ends. Choose well!! 🙏

A 20a relay bridging out the 20a DP immersion heater switch will give you the ability to turn the immersion on / off with logic should get you there simply. I am not familiar with your HP, but does the MI’s state it needs to be able to turn on the immersion for weekly purge?