CC45

Respect to all professional tilers

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Spent the last week floor tiling - still a bit left to do (need to get hold of more adhesive).  When I get home I'm whacked - I'm sure you would get tiling fit eventually but respect for those who do it for a living.  Grouting today had the sweat dripping off me.

 

Perhaps we don't appreciate the trade boys and girls enough sometimes.

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2 hours ago, CC45 said:

Spent the last week floor tiling - still a bit left to do (need to get hold of more adhesive).  When I get home I'm whacked - I'm sure you would get tiling fit eventually but respect for those who do it for a living.  Grouting today had the sweat dripping off me.

 

Perhaps we don't appreciate the trade boys and girls enough sometimes.

I’ve been tiling framing plastering for 40 years now 

It was a lot harder years back 

We used to lay a screed in the morning and go on it with. boards in the afternoon Neat cement No fancy flexible adhesives 

All plasters hand mixed with a rake 

A lot has changed 

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I don’t think any trades get the recognition they deserve, or the wages

i would not recommend being self employed anymore to any young person. 

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The way this country treats its trades people is shameful.

We don't even give them a proper training scheme - one that gives successful trainees parity of esteem with their university graduate colleagues. And you don't have to look far to see a country that does.

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I think the tide is turning @recoveringacademic

University degrees losing a lot of credibility in my eyes.

Young tradesman out there earning a grand a week with no debt and some students saddled with debt working in a supermarket as jobs market is saturated with degrees. Obviously the two extreme sides of coin but not heard many trades moaning lately it's rich pickings at present. 

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45 minutes ago, Oz07 said:

 

I think the tide is turning

 

 

I agree. Even companies like mine who have traditionally only employed grads for trainee IT roles have started to look at the person more and not the certificate. After taking on a mix of grads and non grads we found that the grads were no more equipped to hit the ground running than those without a degree. They all needed the same support and training, and in fact some of the non grads have been amazing (and for balance some of the grads have too). Thus going forward we are looking at school leavers / those who want a career change more than we ever did in the past. Apart from specific jobs where a degree is mandated I don’t see a need for one in the vast majority of jobs. 

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Silicone applicators....let's not forget them!

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I used to be part of the work exsperience scheme

But I’m no long affiliated as most sites wont allow under 18s now 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Oz07 said:

University degrees losing a lot of credibility in my eyes

 

Completely agree. In fact I’d go as far as to say that the higher education system in this country is morally bankrupt. 

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One might suggest that uni fees are just a revenue stream for the Government eager to milk those of the electorate who can pay. 

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My sister has taught at Harvard 

and in China and is head of dartment at a large U.K. uni 

But concedes many degrees are a waste of time

As they are not relevant to employers needs

But fun to take  

 

 

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5 minutes ago, nod said:

My sister has taught at Harvard 

and in China and is head of dartment at a large U.K. uni 

But concedes many degrees are a waste of time

As they are not relevant to employers needs

But fun to take  

 

 

 

Bet she can spell "department"! 😂

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Bet she can’t type and drive though 

😂

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Posted (edited)

I don't really like how you are pushed along a particular route. If you get good GCSEs, okay go and do A levels, then on to University. Why can't you get good GCSEs and consider a trade? When your sixteen you don't really think about it, you just follow your pals or advice of the teacher/career adviser.

 

I was one of the lucky ones, I went to a good University before the tuition fees went up and have a student loan linked to interest rates which have been low since I graduated in 2008. Left with around £12k of debt, now if I did the same degree it would cost £45k and the interest would be ridiculous.

 

With that debt I would definitely consider an apprenticeship. 

 

 

 

  

Edited by Thedreamer

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12 hours ago, nod said:

I’ve been tiling framing plastering for 40 years now 

It was a lot harder years back 

We used to lay a screed in the morning and go on it with. boards in the afternoon Neat cement No fancy flexible adhesives 

All plasters hand mixed with a rake 

A lot has changed 

 

Watching a plaster work as i was doing things along side, really open up my eyes to the physicality of that trade, especially the amount of force applied to get a wet render on a brick wall. That said board work isn't exactly easy going (saying that as someone who has only boarded a ceiling).

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2 hours ago, nod said:

they are not relevant to employers needs

But fun to take  

Agree that supply & demand should be the main consideration but there’s also a case that education & the desire to learn (in those who possess it) can be beneficial to society in less immediately tangible ways. 

If usefulness in the workplace was strictly applied then no one would’ve learned Latin for a long time.

14 hours ago, nod said:

A lot has changed

Remember the muck Hod?

I haven’t quite finished the apprehensive gulp of breath I drew first time I was told to carry one up a ladder as a 17 year old :))

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37 minutes ago, Brickie said:

Agree that supply & demand should be the main consideration but there’s also a case that education & the desire to learn (in those who possess it) can be beneficial to society in less immediately tangible ways. 

If usefulness in the workplace was strictly applied then no one would’ve learned Latin for a long time.

Remember the muck Hod?

I haven’t quite finished the apprehensive gulp of breath I drew first time I was told to carry one up a ladder as a 17 year old :))

Took a long time in the shower to get the motar stains out of the side of head,neck,  shoulder and back.  But it does learn you how to mix motar.  

Chimney copings where the worst lift.  Usually 3 ladders to climb and by the time you got to the top of the last ladder the legs where a wobbly mess. 

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7 hours ago, nod said:

I used to be part of the work exsperience scheme

But I’m no long affiliated as most sites wont allow under 18s now 

 

 

if you enquire at the local college you will probably find there are over 18's in a level 2 or 3 looking for work experience. also an excellent place to find an apprentice, lecturers well placed to recommend a student.

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Agree, too many kids just take the easy option.  A healthy chunk of reducing standards help mask the reality curretly - not enough student with drop in birth rates 18 years ago. Ive never regretted my degree - its been essential in my career but would I want 50k of debt - not really.  Above all else I feel that a lot of the younger generation expects things to come to them with not much effort, the good ones I know are fantastic - how do employers cope with the others?

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, CC45 said:

Above all else I feel that a lot of the younger generation expects things to come to them with not much effort, the good ones I know are fantastic - how do employers cope with the others?

 

Employers cope the same way they always have.  I remember my mum and dad talking about the “younger generation” - meaning me and my friends, expecting to walk into a job as MD without getting any experience or qualifications first. 

Edited by Sue B
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22 hours ago, Barney12 said:

Completely agree. In fact I’d go as far as to say that the higher education system in this country is morally bankrupt. 

 

A trifle harsh.

The HE system policy is 'set' (licensed) by its political masters.

I think it's generally accepted that post-secondary education should show and encourage people how to think through, describe, analyse and argue a case clearly. And its been doing that since roughly 1096 (ish). Some argue a similar system was in situ many years earlier - funded by the church(es).

Would that we'd had a properly funded, well-regarded apprenticeship system running in parallel since then. 

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The major problem with HE seems to be that there is a great deal of it that is not aimed at equipping graduates with the skills and knowledge needed to gain useful employment.  The diversification of studies into so many esoteric areas that have little or no value to an employer, but which seemed designed only to attract students, is probably the worse thing that's been happening over the past 30 years.

 

I was lucky; I received a grant and when I left I walked straight into a job.  I had even more luck when a year later I decided I hated chemistry and chose to get a job in the Scientific Civil Service in a completely different discipline, as they sponsored me to do a sandwich course.  The key thing, though, was that all that education was focussed carefully on what employers needed, especially my second stint, which, because it was paid for by my employer was very carefully focussed on what they wanted me to learn.

 

One thing I noticed over the last fifteen or so years of my career was that, as an employer, we were having to spend more and more resources on training graduates in the workplace.  Despite having seemingly good degrees, the majority were ill-suited to the working environment.  I, and many of my former colleagues, were of the view that incorporating part-time education with employment, rather like the old sandwich courses, gave greater benefits to employers.

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