Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Fischer's niche marketing is to target those who fall for their pitch about comfort, the environment etc, and who don't question things too closely. They advertise in publications aimed at senior citizens in the main (hence the reason I got targeted!). They never give away the price of anything, but insist that potential customers must have a "free survey". Inevitably this "free survey" is really double glazing type sales stuff. It works, and lots of people have bought their electric heaters filled with magic clay etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, Barney12 said: who the hell is going to (correctly) install and support all these units? They have their own installation teams .... Read for yourself ... https://www.aspokesmansaid.com/energy/company-10965/fischer-future-heat/1 And they have an interesting way of handling negative feedback on TrustPilot..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 I can't believe that Sunamp weren't aware of the way this company behaves; I thought it was common knowledge, as they've been using the same sales model for years now. The basic premise is to sell stuff that's "reassuringly expensive" to people who believe that paying more gets a better product. In the case of the Sunamp, to some extent that's true, but we don't know how much of a markup is being applied, as, just like double glazing companies, they never publish prices and tell every customer they are getting a "special deal". The customer comments on that link above should be compulsory reading: Quote Complaint against Fischer Future Heat I had four heaters installed last year, all of a sudden my bill has rocketed, I have asked for an engineer to call several times to check the heaters and thermostats out but no response to emails... terrible customer service.i am supposed to have a 10yr guarantee.. I would advise anyone to steer clear of this company. - I have the same problem. Bills sky high. Doing everything I should but unable to use one heater as the bills would be even higher. I feel the product was miss sold. - I’ve now been told to put them all on as it will heat the bricks!! And the complaints Dept have said that’s the British Gas smart meter that’s at fault, British Gas say it isn’t! - Same here. I’ve turned mine off and can’t wait to get rid of them! This company is a disgrace and a scam! Keep away from them!!! - Yes they really areFischer Future Heat has not yet responded Complaint against Fischer Future Heat I had my heating installed in December last year for a future heating have been back three times to repair re-occurring fault. The heater does not shut down when the set temperature is reached, and in order to avoid overheating, I must manually turn it off. Also ensure it is turned off when I leave the property and at night. I reported this fault on 11 December, the date I was given the repair was 11 January. This was later brought forward to 22 December and then again brought forward to 15 December on the condition that I took down the negative review placed on trust pilot, the offer of the 15th was withdrawn when I did not take down the negative review. I therefore waited 11 days for the engineers to turn up, they replaced both the thermostat and the receiver and now 10 days later, exactly the same problem exists. I have today sent an email to Fischer future heat reporting the fault. We now await to find out what they are going to do and when. Watch this space. - You are lucky you have been able to speak to somebody. I can’t believe this company. I should never have bought their product. It stinks!Fischer Future Heat has not yet responded Complaint against Fischer Future Heat A few months on from my previous complaint and my Fischer heaters are still not working. No response from the Fischer team even though they replied to a complaint saying I had not contacted them. They have been closed over Christmas so as you can imagine no working heating in part of the house has not been ideal. My recommendation is not to have Fischer.Fischer Future Heat has not yet respondedComplaint against Fischer Future Heat We bought two heaters after a survey, the salesman assured us they ran off both day and night rates as we are all electric and have two fuse boards. On fitting we found them both wired into the day rate fuse box! Therefore making them expensive to run, we have been trying since the 23rd April to get someone to speak to us regarding getting them taken out as they were mis sold, were still waiting!! Disgusting serviceFischer Future Heat has not yet respondedComplaint against Fischer Future Heat My new radiator was installed on 8th March and stopped working on Sunday 18th March - 9 days of use. My flat is now cold and I have had to borrow an inefficient small heater to get any warmth at all. I have had an unofficial report that the earliest I can have an appointment with an engineer is 11th April and this is only because I have phoned a lot. The engineers have not phoned and I am not sure if this will happen! The only thing I seem to be able to do is make a complaint! AND while I was waiting to speak to people I was played this message about how efficient the company is. Not very tactful!! Please, please do something about my situation. I thought I was investing in a cheaper system, but now I will have to spend a small fortune on heating my flat in this way. I was told I was not a vulnerable person because I have hot water. Perhaps I should point out that I am 73 years old and need to keep warm. Cold can kill older people!Fischer Future Heat has not yet respondedComplaint against Fischer Future Heat After paying for very expensive heaters to be installed, I found that some electric points and my bathroom blow heater was no longer working. After checking the fuse box, all looked OK except the storage heaters switch had been turned off, and as I no longer had these I didn't touch them. I called Fischer, who advised I would need to pay £150 to them to come and check the electrics. When the engineer came he said that they should have been switched back on by their installer. I have now been advised they will be keeping my £150 for someone to come in for 10 minutes to switch them back on and advise me they should not have been left switched off by them. I am disgusted with this! Not only is it astronomical call-out charge, but I should not be paying for their mistake!Fischer Future Heat has not yet respondedComplaint against Fischer Future Heat We had 2 heaters installed last year, It is just over a year. One of the heater stopped working and I noticed that the plug is burnt, fortunately the heater stopped before any major problem. I called the company they said that the electric installation is not covered after 1 year. This is not mentioned anywhere in their brochure and we were not informed. The heaters were installed by the company itself. Now I been told that if they come out they will charge £200 plus, an it would be cheaper to get local electrician. It would entail putting a fused spur. If that was the case why they did not use fused spur in the first place. Now I am also worried as I have a other heaters in the house.Fischer Future Heat has not yet respondedComplaint against Fischer Future Heat My father in law who is elderly and is suffering with terminal cancer was mislead into signing up for a heating system that was not fit for purpose and told lies that it was covered by a life time guarantee it was only that i was at his home when the engineer came to do pre installation check and he said it wont fit and is way more than need for size of bungalow that i got involved and contacted fischer on my in laws behalf to be told it would be cancelled and deposit refunded i told them that on my in laws instruction to go through me as i now look after his affairs .the salesman rang my in law same day and tried to get him to reconsider and offer a alternative product that is suitable. My in law says he only signed initially because the salesman would not leave and was persistent. Avoid at all cost these entering your home.Fischer Future Heat has not yet responded etc, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 ASA 2014 https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a14-268600.html 2015 https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a14-288734.html https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a15-307811.html 2016 https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a15-314169.html 2018 https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a17-403578.html https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/fischer-future-heat-uk-ltd-a18-450176.html It comes up every year .. nearly like Christmas. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 I can't believe that Sunamp weren't aware of Fischer's long history of misleading advertising. They've been pretty well known for this for years, and continue to play the same game year after year, seemingly without anyone doing anything to stop them. 2014: 9 issues raised with the Advertising Standards Agency, 8 upheld 2015: 5 issues raised with the Advertising Standards Agency, 5 upheld 2016: 3 issues raised with the Advertising Standards Agency, 2 upheld 2018: 3 issues raised with the Advertising Standards Agency, 3 upheld Reading through the ASA complaints, they are all much of a muchness, relating to misleading claims/content. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 11 minutes ago, JSHarris said: I can't believe that Sunamp weren't aware of Fischer's long history of misleading advertising. They won't care. It's a business decision. Whatever shifts most units. Short term gain mindset imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Onoff said: They won't care. It's a business decision. Whatever shifts most units. Short term gain mindset imho. I suspect you're spot on, as the quote from Sunamp makes it clear that shifting a large number of units seems to have been their priority. I can't help feeling they will live to regret this, though, if they end up with a reputation as bad as that of Fischer/Premier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted June 17, 2019 Author Share Posted June 17, 2019 Quote High Quality German Engineering All Fischer Elektrostore™ dynamic Heaters are manufactured by our Master Craftsmen in Germany. In the light of recent posts in this thread, I'll try and do a bit of digging into the nature of the relationship between the UK owners and the Master Craftsmen. .... (Reiner Quatsch! Ich wette dass die Firma uns auf den Arm nehmen wollt.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Just had a quick look on eBay and there are a few Fischer radiators for sale. Asking price seems to be around £500 to £800 for second hand ones. At a guess I'd suggest that new they must be over £1000 each. That's pretty expensive for an electric heater. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Been trying to pin down prices for the electric radiators, and it seems that the above guess may be an underestimate. It looks like a 1.9 kW unit is around £1,400, or was a few years ago. The same capacity night storage heater, with modern controls (as required to meet building regs now, I believe) would cost about £600. The night storage heater would run on E7, or an equivalent cheap rate off-peak tariff, the Fischer radiator would run on peak rate electricity, so for the same heat output the Fischer would cost around 50% to 60% more to run. A bit of a double whammy really, with the capital cost well over double that of a decent storage heater and a running cost at least 50% higher. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan52 Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Kind of baffling why a supposedly innovative company like sunamp would partner up with another company who has such a bad reputation. It doesn't take much of an effort to Google them and find out the kind of tactics they use. It can only affect them in a bad way long term. How long before BBC watchdog are doing a sting on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Davies Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Maybe if they don't shift some units soon they won't have a long term, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 Not unusual for a development company to rapidly increases sales just before a sell off. It is how venture capitalists make money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 The thing is, a Sun Amp is a technical product. It needs thought as to how you heat it, be that electric, boiler etc. Correctly chosen and installed it is a good product. I see MASSIVE scope here for a poor choice of product, poorly installed, and poor performance. I see massive scope for a lot of unhappy customers and what was a good product being tarnished as "over priced rubbish" Will they still be selling direct or via skilled installers as they are at the moment? It seems the ASA are pretty toothless if the complaints keep being upheld. All they seem able to do is stop a particular advert being repeated if found to be misleading, so they just make another slightly different advert that gets aired for a while until the next complaints are upheld. For "repeat offenders" the ASA need the power to pre vet all adverts before they are allowed to be aired. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney12 Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 3 hours ago, Ed Davies said: Maybe if they don't shift some units soon they won't have a long term, anyway. Exactly what went through my mind! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oranjeboom Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 20 hours ago, JSHarris said: ....my major concern would be whether this sales company are able to provide technical support. My experience, and that of others here, has been that Sunamp have seemed to struggle a bit with technical support at times, and they know pretty much all there is to know about the way their product works. Talking of technical support, does anyone have a contact at Sunamp that they could PM me? People that used to be there aren't there any longer and then when I am told that someone should be in touch, no contact is ever made. The guy who's installing my 12kw eDual units, needs some technical support! Or perhaps Sunamp have sold that part of the transaction to Fischer as well! Sunamp really need to sort out there customer support if they continue to sell direct to the public or even trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K78 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 1 hour ago, oranjeboom said: Talking of technical support, does anyone have a contact at Sunamp that they could PM me? People that used to be there aren't there any longer and then when I am told that someone should be in touch, no contact is ever made. The guy who's installing my 12kw eDual units, needs some technical support! Or perhaps Sunamp have sold that part of the transaction to Fischer as well! Sunamp really need to sort out there customer support if they continue to sell direct to the public or even trade. ‘I’m honestly surprised they have any new customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oranjeboom Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, K78 said: ‘I’m honestly surprised they have any new customers. Well, maybe that is where Fischer come in. Then there's always the likes of Everest Glazing they could push these units through... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K78 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 3 hours ago, oranjeboom said: Well, maybe that is where Fischer come in. Then there's always the likes of Everest Glazing they could push these units through... I’m not to sure the general public would be that interested? It is a niche product imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney12 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 1 hour ago, K78 said: I’m not to sure the general public would be that interested? It is a niche product imo. Ah, but that’s before the liberal dose of snake oil which will reveal a shimmering lump of googoo magic which you’ll be at pains to understand how you didn’t know about such money saving miracles before! ? Heavens above they may even need to add some external LED’s??? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triassic Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 The deal is done https://www.sunamp.com/sunamp-signs-first-uk-head-of-terms-with-fischer-future-heat/ ive not got my Sunamp delivered yet, should I get it delivered before the crash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 Some excellent reviews here for Fischer: https://www.aspokesmansaid.com/energy/company-10965/fischer-future-heat/1 ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triassic Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 Wow, just read this thread and the review site, I’ve got to ask why would Sunamp jump into bed with such poorly rated bedfellows? If I were Sunamp I’d be looking for quality not quantity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan52 Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 My 350l thermal store is usually full with nice warm water but never in my day have I ever experienced cascades of warm water. I must be doing something wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 34 minutes ago, Triassic said: Wow, just read this thread and the review site, I’ve got to ask why would Sunamp jump into bed with such poorly rated bedfellows? If I were Sunamp I’d be looking for quality not quantity! I couldn't agree more. The positive side of this deal would seem to be that the badge-engineered units that Fischer/Premier are marketing won't have any Sunamp labels on them, so most people buying from them won't know who the OEM is. That, together with the volume of sales that Sunamp will gain from this marketing route, will be good for Sunamp. The snag is that it probably won't take long for those who feel that they've not had good value or service from Fischer/Premier to find out who the OEM is, and also find out the price of the Sunamp badged units. If Fischer/Premier market these as they have other products they've badge-engineered then the chances are that they will put a pretty hefty mark-up on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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