New build floorplans - opinions welcome

[Indy]

10 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

Why are they wasting time drawing up Georgian facades if they don’t match the area and have eves that are too high? (Hope that was free lol)
Will what you have now even get planning at that height? 

 

At my behest. My love for all things Georgian was pricked up again when seeing the examples in this thread. And they were very quick to draw up a few options to demonstrate exactly why it wouldn't work. 

 

Planning at the current height is a 'risk' but a calculated one. My original idea was to replace the bungalow with a full 2 storey house including a habitable loft, which was not going to happen. The street is also on a slope, so we've managed to create a bit of height by aligning with the houses 'above ours'. Technically its higher than the current ridge height but visually it seems to fit in. 

10 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

The objective should be get planning on something buildable and within budget. For the price you are paying it should be attractive. I’m not sure you’re there yet on any of those.

What styles are appropriate for your area? Can they give you better guidance?

Yes, this is what we're going with. A lower risk option (though not risk free) that has the best chance of getting planning. 

 

The street is quite long, and the stretch we're was originally a series of 5 bungalows and 3 x 2 storey houses built by the same developer in the 50s. We're located right at the entrance of the village (2nd house on the street), and as you move up - the houses are all mostly 2 storey ones. Its a mix in terms of construction type really, 30s, 50s, mock tudor, a lot of houses that have been redeveloped recently so include contemporary finishes.

 

Not a lot of Georgian within this part, though there are certainly several multi-million neo-georgian mansion set on private roads on the other side of town that we share a postcode with. And more importantly, can't afford.... yet!

 

[CharlieKLP]

Ah I see.

 

Well maybe you can get neo-Georgian - ask them. However it’s hot garbage if you do it wrong as I’m sure you probably see in your local McMansions! 
 

Usually ‘drawing things to prove it’s wrong’ is considered pandering, don’t bother with it just take their word for it. It also makes it kind of sad and ‘let she what you could have won’ *shows speedboat*.
 

sorry if I’m being harsh but I see this every day and the clients rarely get anywhere. I’d suggest they need to tell you clearly what will get planning permission, ie, the style and size. 
 

Then you need to go on the internet and pick something nice that fits that criteria. Then let them make something similar style for you.

 

and yes the roof… there’s hopefully a better way to do that.

[Thorfun]

5 hours ago, Indy said:

 

At my behest. My love for all things Georgian was pricked up again when seeing the examples in this thread. And they were very quick to draw up a few options to demonstrate exactly why it wouldn't work. 

 

Planning at the current height is a 'risk' but a calculated one. My original idea was to replace the bungalow with a full 2 storey house including a habitable loft, which was not going to happen. The street is also on a slope, so we've managed to create a bit of height by aligning with the houses 'above ours'. Technically its higher than the current ridge height but visually it seems to fit in. 

Yes, this is what we're going with. A lower risk option (though not risk free) that has the best chance of getting planning. 

 

The street is quite long, and the stretch we're was originally a series of 5 bungalows and 3 x 2 storey houses built by the same developer in the 50s. We're located right at the entrance of the village (2nd house on the street), and as you move up - the houses are all mostly 2 storey ones. Its a mix in terms of construction type really, 30s, 50s, mock tudor, a lot of houses that have been redeveloped recently so include contemporary finishes.

 

Not a lot of Georgian within this part, though there are certainly several multi-million neo-georgian mansion set on private roads on the other side of town that we share a postcode with. And more importantly, can't afford.... yet!

 

I never understand planning departments decisions/requirements to "fit in with the local vernacular". what's the point of modern architecture if no one is allowed to use it? why not allow a modern architectural house to stand out in the environment and to start a new trend. why do all houses have to be stuck in the past just to fit in?

 

it's all b******s if you ask me.

[Indy]

Ok, have had a bit of back and forth with the architects but struggling now to come up with more changes to the front facade, including the porch design. 

 

These are the changes we've already made:

1. Incorporate velux roof lights to bring in more light to the centre of the house.

2. Increased window size on the 1st floor to match the ground floor one.

3. Keystone effect above the windows to provide a bit of detailing/design

4. Colour of bricks changed to red, windows and general details to white. Roof will be grey as it gives us a nice classic colour theme that we've seen and like.

5. Porch design - struggling a bit. 

 

The ideas that I have are:

1. Reduce the height of the porch to a standard sized rather than 2 storey - as the light is not being transmitted to the house and feels like wasted money on glazing. Even the double height space will not really be used for much. A standard sized porch will have shoe storage, coat storage and benches for seating.

OR

2. Porch walls replaced with glass to give it a bit of a wow factor?

3. Some sort of design on the hipped roof between the 2 gable windows on the 1st floor ? A porthole seemed like a good idea but worried it would look like a 3rd eye somehow. 

 

Kind of stuck now and would really appreciate any help or suggestions as to what we can do within the current design to make it more visually appealing.

 

[Simplysimon]

57 minutes ago, Indy said:

Kind of stuck now and would really appreciate any help or suggestions as to what we can do within the current design to make it more visually appealing.

i've read this thread since it started and kept my peace, but since you've asked,? start again with a blank sheet, it's a pigs ear of a design, stop with the wow factor and build something that looks nice, is pleasant to live in and is energy efficient. as it's been mentioned before https://mcmansionhell.com/ 

[Dave Jones]

10 hours ago, Indy said:

Ok, have had a bit of back and forth with the architects but struggling now to come up with more changes to the front facade, including the porch design. 

 

These are the changes we've already made:

1. Incorporate velux roof lights to bring in more light to the centre of the house.

2. Increased window size on the 1st floor to match the ground floor one.

3. Keystone effect above the windows to provide a bit of detailing/design

4. Colour of bricks changed to red, windows and general details to white. Roof will be grey as it gives us a nice classic colour theme that we've seen and like.

5. Porch design - struggling a bit. 

 

The ideas that I have are:

1. Reduce the height of the porch to a standard sized rather than 2 storey - as the light is not being transmitted to the house and feels like wasted money on glazing. Even the double height space will not really be used for much. A standard sized porch will have shoe storage, coat storage and benches for seating.

OR

2. Porch walls replaced with glass to give it a bit of a wow factor?

3. Some sort of design on the hipped roof between the 2 gable windows on the 1st floor ? A porthole seemed like a good idea but worried it would look like a 3rd eye somehow. 

 

Kind of stuck now and would really appreciate any help or suggestions as to what we can do within the current design to make it more visually appealing.

 

 

sorry its horrific.

[CharlieKLP]

That actually emphasises the worst parts of the design, it’s quite the worst design I’ve ever seen, and I’ve seen some very bad designs.

 

So these changes and ideas are coming from you? 
 

What are you paying a designer for exactly?
 

Scrap this terrible design. Make them design you something nice and for heavens sake, stop letting them waste your money because sounds like they will quite happily. Your 1st floor windows need to be 1200 or else you won’t be allowed to open them.

 

Quote

A porthole

No. I’m starting to think you are just trolling us at this point.

Edited February 5, 2022 by CharlieKLP

[Iceverge]

Someone is certainly been led up the garden path here. 

 

If you are genuine, I think you've either constrained the designer so much on your criteria they can't do a good job or else they're just swallowing your cash in the full knowledge that you're only going to learn by buying your education. 

[Thorfun]

there's always the option to put these drawings on hold and go and find another architect to get basic concept drawings done. shouldn't cost too much and might be cheaper than multiple iterations of redesigning this one?

[shuff27]

3 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

That actually emphasises the worst parts of the design, it’s quite the worst design I’ve ever seen, and I’ve seen some very bad designs.

 

So these changes and ideas are coming from you? 
 

What are you paying a designer for exactly?
 

Scrap this terrible design. Make them design you something nice and for heavens sake, stop letting them waste your money because sounds like they will quite happily. Your 1st floor windows need to be 1200 or else you won’t be allowed to open them.

 

No. I’m starting to think you are just trolling us at this point.

I misread that as a portal, presumably to a parallel world where all the houses look like this design. 

[Indy]

Ok, quite hard reading all these comments but there's no trolling. Only our inexperience showing here as I freely admit we're not designers and our vision is very heavily influenced by what we've seen so far. Which has been mostly developer built exec boxes so I guess that's coming through. 

 

I didn't really set out to build something that has 'architectural merit', and tbh - didnt really set out to build anything at all. The original plan was to refurb but the costs and complexities have led us down this path - so its a learning curve and a steep one at that.

 

I will take the comments into view but will still admit that I still like the overall frontage and can't see what's so horrifically wrong with it. We've already established we can't build a Georgian style house or a full 2 storey house, so its a compromise at this point and I'm trying to find the best way forward. Junking the existing design and starting from scratch seems like quite a big overreaction... 

 

[Pocster]

Ffs get a new architect.

If the architect can’t glean from you what you like and take that into account to please the a hole planners then he is just happily taking your cash .

Remember you are the boss - you are paying him . Go in your local planning portal find approved planning designs you like - usually you’ll find an architect mentioned multiple times .

Also / or ( at more cost ) look which architects design for the wealthiest areas in your town - talk to them . Will they cost more ? Yes . Is it worth it ? - probably.

A fantastic but expensive design is better than a crap cheaper one .

[CharlieKLP]

Ah Indy… I think people are saying it for your benefit, and I hope it’s constructive criticism. This is fixable, don’t worry. I’ve fixed far worse than this and I’m sure you will get it sorted once you get a plan in place.

 

Why don’t you think you can build something with architectural merit? I’ve heard that from other people too and what I hear is ‘I want something rubbish’.

 

Architectural merit just means someone with some skill has thought about it.

 

No one expects *you* to become a designer, it’s actually quite hard and requires skill, practice, knowledge and flair in that area.

 

If you can’t do it yourself (You can’t. And I’m not saying that to be cruel) you need to have someone figure out your taste and make the design decisions on your behalf. That’s the point of the design process … and I blame the designers for giving you what you want and not what you need. 
 

so, get yourself on Pinterest and pick out three 1.5 storey houses you like, a feature porch, a living area that *works* for you (a family needs quiet spaces not open plan.

 

…then find a new architect. Sorry guys if you’re reading. You’re not a good fit for this project and client.

[markc]

@pocster @CharlieKLP ?????

[shuff27]

I find this a tricky one to be helpful without seeming unkind. 

 

In a way I'm rather envious that @Indy has the chance to commission a design from scratch. I bought my plot with full planning, a design done with several compromises to satisfy the planners, resulting in a design that is pleasant but unexceptional. I decided not to spend the time and money trying to come up with something more individual and special,which in a way is a matter of regret.

 

I don't like the design indys architect has produced. But is it up to me to suggest that it shouldn't go ahead if indy is happy with it? 

Edited February 5, 2022 by shuff27
Grammar

[CotswoldDoItUpper]

Ultimately @Indy, if you would love to come home to this design after a tough day the go ahead and build it. It’ll be a safe warm environment for your family, which has to be the most important thing. Everything else is just taste. Not everyone likes Gaudi buildings, but he built them because he liked them. As long as your sensible with glazing/insulation etc. so it’s a comfortable place to live then you build what you want. If this is a design that you like, then go for it, despite what others are saying.
 

Having said that (and caveat with I don’t know what your brief was) it does seem underwhelming for an ‘architect designed’ house. I’m sure you could go from something you like to something you LOVE. 
 

I wish you the best of luck with the project whatever you do, when it’s done I’m sure you’ll be proud of the achievement whatever design you settle on.

[Iceverge]

@indy. I'm glad you're not a troller.

 

How about you just press pause for a few days. Have a solid think about your budget. Get a de- identified Google maps aerial shot and a few anonymous Google Streetview pics of the existing street and throw it open to the forum to have a look and make suggestions.

 

Most of us are really enthusiastic about self builds and just want to see others getting as successful a project as possible.

 

 

 

[Gone West]

3 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

and I blame the designers for giving you what you want and not what you need. 

I don't usually comment on these sorts of threads, and I'm not sure whether you have just worded that comment poorly. If I was paying to have a house designed I would want it to look like I wanted, not what somebody thinks I would like. If @Indy likes this design then what's the problem, he's going to be paying for it and living in it.

[CharlieKLP]

2 hours ago, Gone West said:

I don't usually comment on these sorts of threads, and I'm not sure whether you have just worded that comment poorly. If I was paying to have a house designed I would want it to look like I wanted, not what somebody thinks I would like. If @Indy likes this design then what's the problem, he's going to be paying for it and living in it.

hmm no I mean what I said.
 

I’ll design something of a style I dislike for someone who likes it of course. Not to the extent where I will design something objectively bad and never say anything. I’ll always give guidance. 
 

IMO people don’t need you to design things that won’t get planning, are unbuildable, over budget, overheat, etc etc

 

I have a responsibility to be professional and I try to have integrity. (I’ve done a few stinkers but always tried anyway). 

I think if you want something drawn up without suggestions, thought, question you don’t need a designer/architect. 

[ETC]

@Indy@CharlieKLP

Ground and first floor alternative plans. Line drawing so not totally sure it will fit into the site. Have kept 2m from one boundary and 1.0m from the other. No glazing on 1.0m side boundary. Flat roof to centopart with 3no. large roof lights to bring light deep into the stairwell and family bathroom.

 

Concept only.

 

All copyright ETC.

[ETC]

@Indy, @CharlieKLP

 

Roof Plan.

[ETC]

@Indy @CharlieKLP

[PaddyP]

Well I'm more of a lurker than a poster around here I think this thread encapsulates all the good that this forum has to offer. Lots of valuable feedback here for any self builder to look over. @ETC@etc has provided two excellent designs. While I prefer the first one the one above seems to fit more to your style and is a marked improvement from the architects draft.

[Gone West]

18 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

I blame the designers for giving you what you want and not what you need

 

11 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

I think if you want something drawn up without suggestions, thought, question you don’t need a designer/architect.

I don't think those two comments mean the same.

 

11 hours ago, CharlieKLP said:

Not to the extent where I will design something objectively bad and never say anything.

The problem with design is that it is subjective not objective.

[Andehh]

I quite like it! ?