Cost per m2 with minimal tradesmen

[deuce22]

Thanks all for the input.

 

The last thing I want to do is to spend 50k and then realise I've built it to big and need another 200k to finish it. I am planning on this taking around 3 years, so I can use my own money rather than borrowing any. I'm not taking the plot or any other costs into account other than the actual construction as those amounts have already been set aside.

The plot is just over 1/4 of an acre, so there should be minimal amounts of earth to get rid of. I know muck away lorry costs soon add up to 1000s.

 

I've been on some of these sites where they calculate everything for you, but it seems a generic calculation and doesn't take into account factors in my circumstances. I think I'm just going to have to work things out from the ground up individually and get some idea from that.

 

Thanks.

 

 

[newhome]

So if I strip out everything but the raw materials used to construct the house (the vat claim essentially) I get circa £500 m2. So no plot, labour, services, hire of equipment, etc etc. 

 

Thats based on a 350m2 house with detached garage with the floor space of the garage not counted in the m2 figure. Also note that the build was started in 2009 so prices may have changed since then.

[deuce22]

Thanks mate.

 

That's what I'm after, almost everything you can claim the VAT back on (the majority of the actual construction).

 

How much work did you do yourself?

[deuce22]

I've just calculated what the slab and foundations will cost roughly. This is just materials only.

 

The footings have a linear meterage of 56m and the slab has a floor area of 130m2.

 

I've calculated the footings as a 750mm trench fill. I've included 150mm scalpings, 50mm sand, 100mm Insulation, DPM and 150mm concrete. This has come to around 8k. Does that sound about right.

[PeterW]

Other than swapping the insulation and concrete depths I would say not far off although don’t forget you will needs to get rid of the spoil and also lay one or two courses of blocks internal and external walls to put the slab down. 

[newhome]

6 hours ago, deuce22 said:

How much work did you do yourself?

 

My OH did lots of the internal fit work himself so all the electrics, first fix plumbing, kitchen fit, UFH pipes, all painting, wood flooring, internal doors, sanitary wear (but we had a plumber to connect up), and a variety of other tasks until he got sick and I needed to get trades in to finish things off that he had planned to do. The labour and everything else pushed it up to £760 m2 (excluding the plot price). 

 

 

Edited May 31, 2018 by newhome

[deuce22]

PeterW.

 

I did forget the block work. Probably around another £1000 - £1500 (inc labour).

 

Just checked and you're right, it's 140mm insulation for 0.11 U value. That's another £1100, so that's around 10k for the slab.

 

£760 is a big drop from some of the others, but then they may be adding in everything. 

 

I'm glad I asked as I realise now that I need to get a budget that's more accurate, before I get this designed.

 

Thanks.

[Crofter]

Of course if you have the time, and you know the detail of the build, you can do a very detailed QS exercise. I did this for my project and was amazed to find that it worked out within a few hundred pounds of the actual cost (ignoring some optional extras that weren't in the original budget). There was an element of luck involved, as some things cost more than expected, and some things I didn't even realise I would need until well into the build, but this was largely balanced out by my major materials costs coming in lower than estimated. This happened because I had simply phoned the nearest BM for one off prices for OSB, timber, etc, but at purchase time was able to get a much better deal due to the size of the order.

[deuce22]

Thanks Crofter.

 

That's exactly what I'm going to do. I think the majority of people doing this for the first time will have everything that's needed accounted for and like you say, certain things will cost more and (hopefully) other thing less.

[newhome]

51 minutes ago, Crofter said:

There was an element of luck involved, as some things cost more than expected, and some things I didn't even realise I would need until well into the build, but this was largely balanced out by my major materials costs coming in lower than estimated

 

We came in largely on budget until my husband got sick and then it probably cost about 20k in labour costs more than anticipated but not too terrible in the great scheme of things. We also had an element of luck involved as some things did indeed cost more than expected and we had some unexpected items too, but it was balanced by some things coming under budget (like the roof - we were amazed at how cheaply we got the roof done TBH, as in the labour that was half what we anticipated and the guy and his team did a great job), and scaling back the budget on areas like the kitchen and bathroom fittings. My relatively large initial kitchen budget scaled back dramatically to compensate but it still looks fine TBH and I still managed to keep the granite island and worktops. I don't regret scaling back the cost TBH because when I come to sell I will get back at least what it cost to build and it's very easy to pay out more than a house is worth here. Of course there are things that I wished I had done differently but I don't think there are many people who can say that everything worked out perfectly. 

[deuce22]

That's exactly right. My uncle who has completed about 10 self builds still misses out important things and over spends. There's no point asking him as he doesn't do much of the work and because he's got a bit of money his budget is very flexible.

[Hecateh]

3 hours ago, newhome said:

My relatively large initial kitchen budget scaled back dramatically to compensate but it still looks fine TBH and I still managed to keep the granite island and worktops. I don't regret scaling back the cost TBH because when I come to sell I will get back at least what it cost to build and it's very easy to pay out more than a house is worth here. Of course there are things that I wished I had done differently but I don't think there are many people who can say that everything worked out perfectly. 

 

I'll second that your kitchen is definitely fine (more than fine in my opinion)   Including 2 full height fridge/freezers and A drawer fridge,  That drawer fridge on its own would be enough for me LOL

[joe90]

Bit late to this one but my build, 240sq m, came in at £500 per sq m. Builder did founds, blockwork and brickwork, plastering, roof, drains, Supplied doors and frames, stairs skirting etc. I did plumbing, windows and doors, fitting doors, skirting etc etc, I upgraded stairs and doors to oak and paid the difference. As I have said before my builder was brilliant and nothing was too much trouble. During my build I became ill and originally I was doing all the woodwork but found myself unable to do floors/ joist and build roof structure so he just stepped in and did it for me ( at a very reasonable cost). I am happy to pass his name on to anyone building in North Devon ( but he is booked up till next summer?).

Edited June 1, 2018 by joe90

[deuce22]

Thanks joe90 for letting me know this.

 

It's crazy how it differs from one project to another. I realise that quality comes into play, but going from £500 to £1900 perm2.

 

Thanks again.

[PeterW]

36 minutes ago, deuce22 said:

Thanks joe90 for letting me know this.

 

It's crazy how it differs from one project to another. I realise that quality comes into play, but going from £500 to £1900 perm2.

 

Thanks again.

 

I think you also need to buy smart. For example I’ve just sourced 12m of 28mm solid wood worktops at £15/m and the quality is pretty good. They will get a light sanding at 120 grit and then finished with 2 coats of Osmo oil - probably adding £40 to the cost. That makes it less than £20/m for a product that I could have easily paid £40-50/m for which was all by smart buying. 

 

You need to focus on cost but also bear in mind that time has a cost too. I could buy green oak at £28/cuft but by the time I’d converted that into worktop it would be 3 times the price. 

[Crofter]

Buying smart is definitely worth the time and effort.

I'm still a bit annoyed with myself for letting the electrician source most of my fittings- when I saw the itemised bill I was gobsmacked at how much things cost him. E.g. £35 for an isolator for the hob... When a 13A socket would have done the job at about £1 (it's an induction job and came with a plug on it). I managed to stop him buying me a £70 immersion controller and am using a simple timer instead that cost £10. It all adds up.

[Guest28]

I came across this old thread when looking up build costs. Interesting to see how things from 2018 compare to today.

 

I live on the Isle of Skye and I've been hearing that some builders are quoting £6k per m2 to build houses. I think that these prices are for timber clad houses with sheet roofing that are 'easier' to build than a house with block walls and a slate roof.

 

Personally I don't think these timber clad houses are suited for a wet damp climate, some that are only 15 years old have a lot of problems with rot and water ingress, but it is easier for builders to put them up so they promote that option to customers. Sheet roofing is also easier than a slate roof, but not as impermeable. Some of the screw holes will eventually leak with time. A house with block walls and slate roof is a far better option, some on Skye have lasted over 100 years, the timber ones will have rotted away a long time before then.

 

The price of tradesmen is extremely expensive. Even handymen who don't have any formal training charge about £50 per hour + VAT for their services. Some of them are good at what they do, but for that kind of money you would expect someone who has formal training.

[Square Feet]

Jeezo. £6k sqm!  That's insane. 

 

I live in the Borders and I have been amazed at how cheap trades around here are - but the catch is that they are always busy and so very difficult to get hold of.  There's a lot of very cheap properties around here in need of work and a lot of folk from other areas (mostly south of England) buy them at auction thinking they will just get some locals to do them up for them. They get a rude awakening when they realise how difficult it is to source the skilled labour to do the job.  I have noticed that it is a lot easier to get a plumber, electrician etc to come out for a householder than for a rental or investment property and I have begun to suspect that there is a fair amount of resentment from trades towards those who are just looking to make a profit from property investment, so they chose to prioritise householders which is fair enough.  I wonder if there is something similar going on with the Skye builders who perhaps aren't thrilled at all the rich second home/retiree incomers, and are basically pricing themselves out of the work. 

 

On my current renovation project I had to rewire all the ceiling lights which was an issue that I had missed at purchase (as did the surveyor). I tried for months to get a spark in to do this for me but they were all too busy.  I think it's a bit of a horrible job that none of them wanted either. In the end I found one who was willing to let me basically be his mate and do all the donkey work under his supervision.  So I cut raggles and ran all the cables and he popped in at the end of the day to tell me what I needed to do and where I needed to run the next ones and to check my work.  At the end of it he charged me £210 which I can only think was 7 x £30 an hour which seems crazy cheap. It might have been 3.5 hours at £60 I suppose, but if that's the case then he under-billed me for his time. That didn't include fitting a new trip-switch box and making the connections at that end, but he will do that part later as he needs to do it himself in order to sign it off. So around here the trades are there and they are very reasonably priced, but devilishly difficult to get hold of.

Edited March 10 by Square Feet

[Kelvin]

Timber framed timber clad not lasting is down to how they are built and detailed and not the build method. It’s the predominant build method in Scandic countries after all. The weather patterns are slightly different and the west coast of Scotland is one of the wettest in Europe. Nevertheless built properly there’s no reason why they shouldn’t last. That said, having experienced Skye builders I can see why they aren’t built well. 

[saveasteading]

3 hours ago, MBT6 said:

I don't think these timber clad houses are suited for a wet damp climate

 

3 hours ago, MBT6 said:

Some of the screw holes will eventually leak with time

As Kelvin says. Timber cannot rot unless wet, and a properly built house will keep all the water and dampness out. 

A secret fix roof does not have exposed screws, but there can be other issues especially at cuts and openings. I did steel buildings for decades, never with secret fix, through cost. I think there will be 3 million roof screws. There were problems with about 100 screws at most and that was down to some bodge by the cladder. 

On a modern house roof design you will have a space then a membrane under the cladding so any leak would be harmless.

 

The solution is to design out the need for local skills. A kit timber building would be my choice, onto a simple foundation. also keep the geometry simple, using a proven, standard design if possible.

That's the structure. For fitout others can advise.

£3,000/m2 even on Skye?

[ProDave]

Some types of timber cladding can be really poor, there is a self build with timber cladding near me that in the winter the cladding just soaks in the rainwater, and ends up looking like a cheap soaked garden shed.  I have never been a fan of cladding "left to silver" as it rarely fades evenly and often looks tatty and worn after a very short time.

 

 

[Kelvin]

12 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Some types of timber cladding can be really poor, there is a self build with timber cladding near me that in the winter the cladding just soaks in the rainwater, and ends up looking like a cheap soaked garden shed.  I have never been a fan of cladding "left to silver" as it rarely fades evenly and often looks tatty and worn after a very short time.

 

 

Hence why I had mine treated with SiOO:X to avoid that. So far so good after 8 months. 

[BotusBuild]

@MBT6 Been building new house since 2020, and still going. Current budget sheet is showing a projected cost per square metre of £1183.10. That is based on actual work done and projected future costs. To be done - electrics, plumbing, plastering, upstairs UFH, ASHP (although should get that via grants), sanitary ware, exterior cladding. Kitchen is bought so costed for already.

 

Trades I've had in so far:

• concrete pourers
• steel framer
• window fitters
• GRP roofer
• groundworker

Trades to get in:

• Electrician (but only because it needs certifying at the end)
• Renderer (before stone slip cladding)

[SteamyTea]

4 hours ago, BotusBuild said:

Electrician (but only because it needs certifying at the end)

Can't you get the qualification yourself, may end up cheaper and easier.

[BotusBuild]

It is something I have considered. I got it as part of my degree (15th edition if I recall correctly) and failed to keep it current as my career took a different path. I wonder if I could retrain for free having been made redundant and now unemployed?😁