Wood stove

[kendrick]

I am replacing an old fireplace with a wood burning stove. The old fireplace had an external air supply. It is approximately 3 inch pipe running to the outside wall. Is this sufficient enough for a stove? Thanks

[ProDave]

Just about. The air intake duct on my 5kW stove is 80mm diameter.

[bassanclan]

Depends on the size of the stove

[ETC]

1 minute ago, bassanclan said:

Depends on the size of the stove

And the age of the house - airtightness.

[kendrick]

6kw double sided. It is an open plan kitchen/living room 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ProDave]

39 minutes ago, kendrick said:

6kw double sided. It is an open plan kitchen/living room 

 

Find a stove you like then look at the manufacturers instructions to see the diameter of the inlet pipe.  If it is marginally larger than what you have, ask them if it will be sufficient.

[saveasteading]

I found a website that gave the formula,  but I can't find it again.

From memory it is 80mm dia for a 5kW stove with totally external air.

Or the size of a 50p coin per kW.

 

It must be  a very approximate estimate though, as it will depend on the length and any bends in the pipe.

Most kits are of corrugated pipe, further restricting flow, so a bigger diameter like 100mm would be sensible.

We put ours in before the floor slab, so used 110 dia drain pipe, then a smaller connection to the stove.

[SteamyTea]

8 hours ago, saveasteading said:

Or the size of a 50p coin per kW.

Area or diameter?

Will make quite a difference.

[saveasteading]

Area.  The size for 5kW came to something like 67mm dia, and the same website quoted the coin thing.

Hence there seem to be kits at 80mm.

 

[SteamyTea]

30 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

and the same website quoted the coin thing

I am always worried when there are quotes like that.

 

Much easier to not fit a wood burner, going to be banned in the not too distant future.

[saveasteading]

5 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

Much easier to not fit a wood burner

For your opinion, which I read with interest and espect.

We have  fitted a 5kW Woodburner. It is currently being used to burn offcuts from the stud wall construction. Not for tidiness but to warm the place for the workers' comfort and to keep out the damp.

Good or bad?

[George]

They might ban open fires and older stoves. I can't see Ecodesign ones being banned. 

[SteamyTea]

16 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

Good or bad

Bad.

 

The off cuts could be recycled into chipboard, or similar.

Burning them in a Waste to Energy plant would probably be best at the moment.  That way, emissions are strictly controlled, and we all get a bit of electricity, a higher grade, lower entropy sort of energy..

[markc]

Just had a guy in our place who sells and installs wood burning stoves, I mentioned the article and he said it’s burning wet, painted or treated wood they want to control. Apparently timber with a high moisture content burns much cooler and creates a lot of tar that gets ejected or blocks the liner reducing draw and further lowering combustion efficiency. No fears of banning wood burning stoves as they are much more common across Europe and he has a warehouse with 2000 stoves in stock for the increased demand .

just realised the banning wood burning stoves article must be in a different thread or conversation I had with someone 

Edited February 6, 2023 by markc

[SteamyTea]

11 minutes ago, markc said:

I mentioned the article and he said it’s burning wet, painted or treated wood they want to contro

He was talking crap then.

It is the PMs that they are trying to reduce now, there has been legislation for over a decade about treated timber.

Trouble is, without enforcement, it is toothless legislation.

With the reducing in ICE cars, especially in towns and cities, the wood burning brigade will have run out of places to hide behind.

14 minutes ago, markc said:

No fears of banning wood burning stoves as they are much more common across Europe

Did BREXIT pass you by.

[Carrerahill]

21 minutes ago, markc said:

Just had a guy in our place who sells and installs wood burning stoves, I mentioned the article and he said it’s burning wet, painted or treated wood they want to control. Apparently timber with a high moisture content burns much cooler and creates a lot of tar that gets ejected or blocks the liner reducing draw and further lowering combustion efficiency. No fears of banning wood burning stoves as they are much more common across Europe and he has a warehouse with 2000 stoves in stock for the increased demand 

I am fed up with these terribly written articles in the papers and media every other day giving wood burning stoves (WBS) a bad name. I have written to many of the broadsheets "environmental editors" when they run inaccurate articles pointing out the mistakes. The one I love to debate is the often reported, yet highly inaccurate statements about the WBS smoke coming into the room in which it operates. 

 

I collect, pre-season, split, stack and season all my own firewood; softwoods and hardwoods. I reckon I am on about a 36month seasoning process with the firewood I have just now. I use pine kindling and some smaller softwood logs and a piece of hardwood or two to get the stove lit, I manage the start up in that I keep a close eye on it, lots of air, get the fire caught well, you want to get the flue warmed and get a nice draw, at this stage. Usually seen when outside getting an armful of logs, there is a gentle whisp of smoke from the chimney. Once the fire is going well, I close down the air supplies to normal running mode and let it go. I was outside most of yesterday with the stove on inside, I saw no smoke all day. 

 

The issue is idiots with stoves. 

 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by Carrerahill

[dpmiller]

I get the feeling the UK stove manufacturers are part of the problem. They seem reticent to do much meaningful R&D or add tech, and the response to some of the new regs was just to stop sell, rather then certificate or improve certain models. Hence the total lack of boiler stoves as of last year.

[SteamyTea]

21 minutes ago, Carrerahill said:

issue is idiots with stoves

Same with dogs.

I would ban them as well.

[markc]

18 minutes ago, dpmiller said:

I get the feeling the UK stove manufacturers are part of the problem. They seem reticent to do much meaningful R&D or add tech, and the response to some of the new regs was just to stop sell, rather then certificate or improve certain models. Hence the total lack of boiler stoves as of last year.

Interesting point, the guy did say he gets some stoves from UK, majority from across Europe and a few from NewZealand

[saveasteading]

2 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

The off cuts could be recycled into chipboard, or similar.

Ok we will set up a factory then.

 

OSB is made close enough to see the smoke from the factory...oh ..smoke!!!??

But they only use whole tree trunks. No recycling as  far as I know ( and they would tell us).

 

 

Seriously though, I  was once dismantling  a 1930s shed, made with lots of high quality pine trusses.

First nobody wanted it reclaimed (despite the county council sponsoring a sheltered workshop to take it and sell back.) Just words.

Secondly we couldn't get it taken to the waste incineration plant (20 miles away, but not what they take). Words.

Thirdly , no waste company would take it other than as mixed waste.

Fourthly, I contacted a government quango that was promoting reuse, re- etc.  They had very nice representatives and beautiful brochures (Would I like a few?) I asked them for a sustainable solution. No idea. But it is what you are for, and only that.  Nope.

So we gave up and let a demo company take the lot. It probably went in a field.

 

That was Kent.

Offcuts in Highland?  There is no incineration...all unrecycled goes to tip.

We had perhaps a couple of barrowloads maximum.

So I am still thinking that burning it is pragmatically appropriate..

Saves electricity.

Doesn't rot underground.

No transport.

 

I should also emphasise that, being diy, the cutting is thought out and waste is a miniscule proportion, so fewer trees died than with your average builder.

[saveasteading]

49 minutes ago, markc said:

majority from across Europe

Knowing that Spanish WBS are less than half the price of the same models in the UK, and are very well made, we went to get one for here*.

There were none with direct air.

in passing we noted that there are 3 qualities.

1. Seemed to be from 100 years ago, very rustic and unsophisticated and very, very cheap.  there were lots on display so must be bought.

2. high quality , modern, big name, but not with direct air, yet.

3. very flash indeed.

 

On the other hand there seem to be lots from Scandinavia, which are all direct air and all expensive.

I wonder where Denmark and Sweden stand in relation to banning them. 

 

* It would have been 'used' before crossing the channel, just in case.

[SteamyTea]

2 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

Words

Yes.

This, along with misguided thinking, is really the problem.

There is a council run recycling centre near to where I live.

Trouble is, it only takes a few types of waste, is only open during the day, and then takes the recycling to the commercial waste company, who bundle it up and take it to the W2E site at St. Awful.

Probably easier if the commercial operator, who do the household waste collection, just picked it up from the streets and sent it direct to the bundling station.

[jamieled]

17 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

OSB is made close enough to see the smoke from the factory...oh ..smoke!!!??

 

That's not smoke. It's steam.

 

[Ralph]

In the likes of Sweden they use more wood burners than we do but they produce less emissions. It seems to be a combination of culture and pride, they've had stoves for a long time and no self respecting Swede is going to use unseasoned wood, never mind OSB. They also have better trained and regulated chimney sweeps and you need them to sign off on an installation before you use it.

[Roger440]

2 hours ago, markc said:

Just had a guy in our place who sells and installs wood burning stoves, I mentioned the article and he said it’s burning wet, painted or treated wood they want to control. Apparently timber with a high moisture content burns much cooler and creates a lot of tar that gets ejected or blocks the liner reducing draw and further lowering combustion efficiency. No fears of banning wood burning stoves as they are much more common across Europe and he has a warehouse with 2000 stoves in stock for the increased demand .

just realised the banning wood burning stoves article must be in a different thread or conversation I had with someone 

 

All rather predicatable from a chap that sells woodburning stoves.