Will I be eligible for ASHP Grant?

[richo106]

Hi All

 

Later in the year during my bungalow conversion I will be installing ASHP, I am hoping to get the £5k grant for this

 

However the property I bought has not been lived in for over 10 years, really old system that I have ripped out. looking at the info on the grant it needs to be applied for by the contractor installing it. It also states I need an EPC with no outstanding improvements on it? I haven't got an EPC as I am basically treating it as a new build

 

Would I be eligible for the grant?

 

Any advice/information on this topic would be greatly appreciated

 

Many Thanks

[JohnMo]

Approved install only for the grant.  Assume they would organise the EPC

[HughF]

If your comfortable enough to be ripping out the old and doing your own work then I’d forget about the grant. Ashp- £3k ish, uvc- £1k ish, rads and pipework £1k…

 

Fit it yourself and get bco to sign off the uvc.

[richo106]

I have just had the costs back from the contractor I have been dealing with

 

The costs have come back at £17k (£12k minus the grant) to supply and install 12kw Nibe ASHP, controllers, Expansion vessels, Buffer tank and 300L DHW tank

 

Do this seem on the high side? The only problem I am having is getting people to get back to me and these and have been really helpful throughout

 

They have also quoted £12k for supply and install of MVHR system

[Tom]

Given that materials are probably no more than 6 or 7k then he's charging at least £10k for a weeks work - I'm in the wrong job!

[HughF]

9 hours ago, richo106 said:

I have just had the costs back from the contractor I have been dealing with

 

The costs have come back at £17k (£12k minus the grant) to supply and install 12kw Nibe ASHP, controllers, Expansion vessels, Buffer tank and 300L DHW tank

 

Do this seem on the high side? The only problem I am having is getting people to get back to me and these and have been really helpful throughout

 

They have also quoted £12k for supply and install of MVHR system

That seems positively crazy money…. Take their heat loss calcs, specify a suitably sized ashp and pay a local plumber to install it all. It’s not rocket science this stuff.

[ReedRichards]

11 hours ago, richo106 said:

I have just had the costs back from the contractor I have been dealing with

 

The costs have come back at £17k (£12k minus the grant) to supply and install 12kw Nibe ASHP, controllers, Expansion vessels, Buffer tank and 300L DHW tank

 

Do this seem on the high side? The only problem I am having is getting people to get back to me and these and have been really helpful throughout

 

They have also quoted £12k for supply and install of MVHR system

At the end of 2020 I paid roughly the same for a 12 kW ASHP (LG), controllers, expansion vessels, buffer tank, 300l DHW tank, 12 radiators, radiators completely replumbed via the loft (instead of underfloor pipes).  The vast majority of the time taken (2 people for over a week) was fitting the new pipes for all the radiators.  My local plumber quoted more than this!

[SBMS]

12 hours ago, richo106 said:

I have just had the costs back from the contractor I have been dealing with

 

The costs have come back at £17k (£12k minus the grant) to supply and install 12kw Nibe ASHP, controllers, Expansion vessels, Buffer tank and 300L DHW tank

 

Do this seem on the high side? The only problem I am having is getting people to get back to me and these and have been really helpful throughout

 

They have also quoted £12k for supply and install of MVHR system

We had exactly the same setup (including the Nibe 12kw) specified for our build. Was priced up in January and came to 11k for supply and install. Yours seems high but I know that ASHP have gone up. Be careful re lead times - we had to order our Nibe in April and earliest deliver is September. 
 

FYI At 11k less the 5k grant I think the equipment cost is more than the net £6k.

[PhilT]

On 15/06/2022 at 09:48, richo106 said:

I have just had the costs back from the contractor I have been dealing with

 

The costs have come back at £17k (£12k minus the grant) to supply and install 12kw Nibe ASHP, controllers, Expansion vessels, Buffer tank and 300L DHW tank

 

Do this seem on the high side? The only problem I am having is getting people to get back to me and these and have been really helpful throughout

 

They have also quoted £12k for supply and install of MVHR system

Seems very high indeed. Last year we got 11.2kW ashp, dhw tank, expansion tanks and 6 new rads for £15k, less RHI £9k over 7 years. Suppliers should be moderating their huge margins to fit the new £5k grant otherwise ashp sales will dry up.

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, PhilT said:

Suppliers should be moderating their huge margins to fit the new £5k grant otherwise ashp sales will dry up.

That is the idea of these grants.

But if the market can stand a higher price, and suppliers are wanting to have financially sustainable long term business, the paying public have to pay the going rate.

It is not right that we have a race to the bottom on prices as that does no one any favours: company's vanish and consumers get sub standard goods and services.

[AliG]

1 hour ago, PhilT said:

Seems very high indeed. Last year we got 11.2kW ashp, dhw tank, expansion tanks and 6 new rads for £15k, less RHI £9k over 7 years. Suppliers should be moderating their huge margins to fit the new £5k grant otherwise ashp sales will dry up.

Thos prices are crazy.

 

For my parents' place the same work for the ASHP was quoted at 11500 (9kW Panasonic ASHP, but same size tank, expansion vessel etc). 12kW is only slightly more expensive.

 

MVHR including ducting for a 180sq metre house was 7,000.

[PhilT]

On 23/06/2022 at 10:55, SteamyTea said:

That is the idea of these grants.

But if the market can stand a higher price, and suppliers are wanting to have financially sustainable long term business, the paying public have to pay the going rate.

It is not right that we have a race to the bottom on prices as that does no one any favours: company's vanish and consumers get sub standard goods and services.

Up front cost is cited as the main barrier to the widespread adoption of heat pumps. The grant recently dropped to £5k so heat pump installations have gone up by between £4k and £6k plus accelerating inflation (evidence the £17k price mentioned by richo106), possibly as much as doubling the overall cost of installation. That is a big issue.

[Dreadnaught]

I have hust been quoted £12,000 (zero VAT)  to install a 5kW monobloc ASHP (R290) and matched fully-plumbed un-vented cylinder for my new build. 

 

Elsewhere I've been quoted £4,300 ex VAT for the same AHSP and cylinder, supply-only. So that's £7,900 on top for labour and minor sundries. Oh, and I'm eligible for the £5,000 from the Boiler Upgrade Scheme ("BUG") too.

 

I know MCS has a lot of overheads and ASHP installers are in short supply. He may well have all the work he needs for months ahead. And there are costs for guarantees, overheads, etc. But I still assume the installer has a parrot on his shoulder and a tricorn hat.

 

Everything is in place for the install. UFH & manifold. Insulated pipe from outside to inside. Even the external temperature-compensation wire. Its as simple an install as you're likely to see. 

 

Disregard the £5,000 from the BUG, could a normal G3-registered plumber install this instead? YouTube shows it being a relatively simple install and commissioning seems understandable. Anybody taken this route and can provide encouragement?

[Nickfromwales]

2 hours ago, Dreadnaught said:

Oh, and I'm eligible for the £5,000 from the Boiler Upgrade Scheme ("BUG") too.

Could I ask how you are eligible for this, as a new build?

[SBMS]

12 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

Could I ask how you are eligible for this, as a new build?

The boiler upgrade scheme eligibility includes self builders. 

[HughF]

Why are you even considering going down the mcs/bus grant with this?

All it does is inflate the costs for everyone.

 

Just buy a unit (personally, not r290 based, siting them is a faff) and pay a plumber to install it.

 

It’s a pretty simple plumbing exercise really.

[joe90]

On 06/07/2022 at 21:10, SBMS said:

The boiler upgrade scheme eligibility includes self builders. 

Sounds good but how do you upgrade something that did not exist?

[ProDave]

On 13/06/2022 at 16:14, richo106 said:

It also states I need an EPC with no outstanding improvements on it?

Does ANYONE actually have one of those?  Even my new build EPC A94 recommends I install a wind turbine at very high cost and impossibly long payback period.  So that would not qualify would it?

[Radian]

49 minutes ago, HughF said:

(personally, not r290 based, siting them is a faff)

Are there any additional restrictions on Propane?

[SteamyTea]

29 minutes ago, joe90 said:

Sounds good but how do you upgrade something that did not exist?

I often upgrade my thoughts and opinions.

Not as often as I downgrade them though.

 

In my mind, I have upgraded my car to a Porche, in reality, it is a rattle C-Max (which is in the garage at the moment to cure the rattle).

Reality kicks in when I take a corner too fast.

[Radian]

First time driving a C-Max I couldn't believe how well it cornered.

[SteamyTea]

2 minutes ago, Radian said:

First time driving a C-Max I couldn't believe how well it cornered.

Yes, it is not bad, not are surefooted at my old 309s.

And nowhere near the grip in the wet.

 

It does have an A2AHP in it, just to get the thread back on topic.

[Dreadnaught]

1 hour ago, Radian said:

Are there any additional restrictions on Propane?

This will give you a flavour, at least for the AroTherm Plus model:

 

Operational clearances:

Propane related fire-risk clearances, especially from drains:

 

[ProDave]

That's pretty much the same clearances for LPG bottle storage.

[Dreadnaught]

Interestingly, if read the manual correctly, the weight of Propane contained in the ASHP is just 0.9kg, which is rather smaller than the smallest usual gas cylinder (see below). And which, in liquid form, would, if my conversion is correct, would be just under 2 litre and so might fit in your kettle. This in turn would evaporate to form 520 litres of gaseous propane.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 8, 2022 by Dreadnaught
Edited to note that: Moreover, 2 litre of LPG converts in to 520 litres of gaseous propane.