Engineered wood flooring, Yay or Nay?

[Grian]

Hello, ages I've been on here and as I type my SIPs panels are going up! House will have wet underfloor heating and I'd decided on porcelain tiles in the open plan kitchen-dining-living space. Also wondered about engineered wood, but other forums had a number of horror stories about it failing, peeling, bending, warping, rotting and generally being a poor idea. I reckon you guys will have a realistic sense of how robust it is - so, would you fit it in your kitchen? I'd like to put this to bed once and for all, so I can get back to the gazillion paint charts I'll examine before choosing magnolia   Thank you! 

[ProDave]

What do you think will cause your wood flooring to warp / peel / rot or otherwise fail?  Are you concerned about wet areas (kitchen) or the UFH?

 

We have engineered Oak wood flooring throughout the living room, part of the entrance hall, and the kitchen / diner. When choosing it, we specifically said to the supplier recommend a product that will work with UFH and they came up with the large format planks we have, 180mm wide and up to 2.1M long.

 

In the kitchen we just have a mat in front of the sink and hob area to protect the floor from spillages.

 

So far (2 years in) it is all very stable with no issues.

 

 

[Nick1c]

Our main room is open plan & the original intention was to have engineered boards in the living area & tiles in the kitchen. We were told by the retailer (waxed floors) that he had customers with his flooring in kitchens for over 10 years. 2 1/2 months in & ours is still looking good, I’ll give you a definitive opinion in 9 1/2 years!

Ours was factory sealed, laid & then I put another 2 coats of osmo on it. 

[Grian]

The posts I'd read describing these problems didn't always give an obvious cause, it just seemed as though it could happen, and some mentioned the more high end manufacturers as being prone to fail in these ways. In my own case I can foresee that keeping it clean could introduce a lot of moisture on a regular basis, I have a working sheepdog who's main role in life is to bring the outdoors in several times a day, so mop frequently!

 

 

 

[Bitpipe]

We have engineered wood in all the upstairs and it's rock solid. Decent quality obviously.

[patp]

Well @Grian what did you decide and are you happy with it?

[Temp]

We have engineered oak in many rooms over wet UFH. In my view the key is to have JUST engineered wood over the UFH. Some people buy 14mm thick engineered wood then discover the  Building Regs (?) require 18mm minimum. So they end up laying 18mm chipboard first and 14mm engineered wood on top making 32mm. Its much better to use 18-21mm Engineered wood directly on joists or battens with UFH between.

[Temp]

PS. We got our 21mm x 200mm engineered oak from Woods of Wales. It came precoated with Hardwax Oil.

 

Shop around as some engineered wood i picked up at the shows was a very strange colour when I got it home. You need to see it in natural light.

[Faz]

I put down a really expensive (£100/m!) engineered floor in our last major scheme 88 flats which was lovely - Kahrs Oak Berlin it was.  In the flats bought to live in it has been spot on - a few of the flats bought by Buy to Let investors not so.  These floors need oiling twice a year and generally looking after.

[Russell griffiths]

@Grian, I think your problem might be to change your cleaning routine, the word mop needs chucking out and you need to look at cleaning practices and products suitable for the flooring you choose. 

 

I laid a floor  for a friend and it failed terrible, we had the rep out to try and find what had gone wrong, my mates wife had been cleaning it with a mop and water, splashing it everywhere, unaware that she was meant to use a certain non wet product and a micro fibre duster thing on a pole. 

 

Operator error, she thought as it was allowed in kitchens and bathrooms that it was fully waterproof.  

[Temp]

Our floor has been down 13 years. Only had to recoat the WC. Have occasionally mopped the floor but only with a damp mop.

[daiking]

I’ve got a 14mm Havwoods engineered wood in a few rooms for 5-6 years. They get weekly (sometimes more) damp mopping and they are fine. Didn’t know they need treating ?

 

So happy I’ve bought some more for my new shed.

[Russell griffiths]

How many of you lot who are happy with your floors have UFH under it. 

 

[ProDave]

  On 06/04/2021 at 17:07, Russell griffiths said:

How many of you lot who are happy with your floors have UFH under it. 

 

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Happy with mine.  Engineered Oak, 20mm thick 180mm wide planks laid as a structural board over UFH laid in a biscuit mix. 

 

No issues with shrinkage, warping or cracking and no issues with finish.

 

We chose one with a matt pre laquered finish.  Could that be what makes the difference?  In a previous house we had engineered Oak with an oiled finish and found it a right pain to have to keep on oiling it and being particular how you clean it.  this laquered finish board we mop perhaps once a month with a well wrung out mop so not soaked, and there are no issues.

[Temp]

Are there different types of oil finish? Our is Hardwax Oil and its more like a matt/silk varnish than a wax or oil. We have it in the hall and are kids went from 5 to 18 years old. Still doesn't need recoating. Only place showing any wear is the edge of the stairs.

[patp]

Would this be slippery for dogs? We are not supposed, now, to let dogs walk on slippery floors as it wears their joints out. 

 

Also does anyone have rugs or carpets? I am thinking that I could have a runner of carpet down the hall. This would minimise noise and help stop the dog from slipping. In the lounge perhaps a large rug/carpet.

[newhome]

  On 07/04/2021 at 17:41, patp said:

Would this be slippery for dogs? We are not supposed, now, to let dogs walk on slippery floors as it wears their joints out. 

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It’s not great for dogs in truth. Mine don’t go on it much as they are generally in the tiled areas but they do slip more than on tiles and it’s also more noisy. The best hard flooring I had for dogs was Karndean in my old house. 

[SimonD]

I'm going to go against the grain on this one. We had some in our last place. We didn't skimp and it was from one of the higher end manufacterers. We were dissapointed as the surface scratched and went hazy and the top oak surface dented very easily (we had two baby boys during this time). The scratching and hazing I think was most likely down to the factory varnish being polyurethane, wax may have been better. Upstairs we had solid pine floorboards we varnished and these floors looked as the day it was done 12 years later. No UFH and surface problems only.

[patp]

  On 07/04/2021 at 18:49, newhome said:

It’s not great for dogs in truth. Mine don’t go on it much as they are generally in the tiled areas but they do slip more than on tiles and it’s also more noisy. The best hard flooring I had for dogs was Karndean in my old house. 

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Which Karndean did you have?

[newhome]

  On 08/04/2021 at 15:16, patp said:

Which Karndean did you have?

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This one 

 

https://www.karndean.com/en-gb/floors/products/rp90-fresco-light-oak

 

Went for the Da Vinci range due to the better wear layer. 
 

[patp]

So when you call it it hard flooring what is it made of? I love the look of it and I see they do it in a parquet pattern!

[Faz]

Karndean is plastic mate.

[patp]

  On 24/04/2021 at 18:55, Faz said:

Karndean is plastic mate.

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Ah! Thanks for that. I would have found out in due course but I can count it out now.

[Adsibob]

 

  On 05/04/2021 at 19:26, Temp said:

We have engineered oak in many rooms over wet UFH. In my view the key is to have JUST engineered wood over the UFH. Some people buy 14mm thick engineered wood then discover the  Building Regs (?) require 18mm minimum. So they end up laying 18mm chipboard first and 14mm engineered wood on top making 32mm. Its much better to use 18-21mm Engineered wood directly on joists or battens with UFH between.

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Hi @Temp which regulation are you referring to here? Presumably this only applies if one is using the the engineered board as the structural floor?

[Temp]

  On 26/04/2021 at 19:11, Adsibob said:

 

Hi @Temp which regulation are you referring to here? Presumably this only applies if one is using the the engineered board as the structural floor?

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The only place I've seen it us in NHBC docs.. 

 

http://nhbccampaigns.co.uk/landingpages/techzone/previous_versions/2011/Part6/section4/sitework.htm

  Quote

Only moisture-resistant, Type P5 chipboard to BS EN 312 should be used for flooring. Joist centres should not be greater than 450mm for board thickness of 18/20mm and 600mm for boards 22mm thick.

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The other situation where it matters is on top of insulation eg..

 

Engineered Wood

Insulation

DPM

Sand Blind

Concrete slab

 

In such cases I have heard of the insulation turning to mush in high traffic areas if the engineered wood is too flexible. Installers frequently recommend fitting battens (the same thickness as the insulation) at doorways to provide support. The type of insulation also matters.