Self employed

[nod]

I feel very sorry for the self employed While they will get something They won’t get anything until June at the earliest If the lockdown is extended it could be a long time without any income 

[Moonshine]

It's a relief for us as my wife will get something, and we can last out on my 90% wage until June, so we are lucky in that respect.

 

The problem is she is now in position, of does she try and keep her business going online and work really hard at that, or just jack it in wait for the payment and look after the kids home schooling.

[nod]

3 minutes ago, Moonshine said:

It's a relief for us as my wife will get something, and we can last out on my 90% wage until June, so we are lucky in that respect.

 

The problem is she is now in position, of does she try and keep her business going online and work really hard at that, or just jack it in wait for the payment and look after the kids home schooling.

It’s a tricky one Many are self employed in name only 

So won’t have much backup 

Though if this drags on for months paying the employed may have to be revised 

[Thedreamer]

My wife has some self employed income, but the bulk comes from wages from tourism sector.

 

At moment we don't get any help, as the tourist season usually starts in March.

 

Some self employed people who are able to continue to work will be laughing all the way to the bank as they will get up to £7,500 for nothing.

 

As an accountant I can see what the government has done but too many folk have fallen through the cracks particularly in our area.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ProDave]

3 hours ago, Moonshine said:

It's a relief for us as my wife will get something, and we can last out on my 90% wage until June, so we are lucky in that respect.

 

The problem is she is now in position, of does she try and keep her business going online and work really hard at that, or just jack it in wait for the payment and look after the kids home schooling.

There is an expectation in accepting the government grant, that you expect to carry on trading and be trading next year as well.

 

Si I will tick over doing whatever small amount of work I am allowed to and will take the grant of offered it,  I will still be trading next year though at what level who knows?  My overheads working from home are very low and mostly paid up for a few months already.

[Cpd]

42 minutes ago, Thedreamer said:

As an accountant I can see what the government has done but too many folk have fallen through the cracks particularly in our area.

Yup..... totally reliant on tourism for the next six months.....tiny amount of savings..... less than £1500.....  Just going to have to hunker down and limit spending to the absolute minimum. The good thing  is that I live on a remote island with 5 acres of garden and 3 ongoing building projects and plenty of stockpiled materials, so I will be as busy as ever and am thankful for that. 

[ProDave]

5 minutes ago, Cpd said:

Yup..... totally reliant on tourism for the next six months.....tiny amount of savings..... less than £1500.....  Just going to have to hunker down and limit spending to the absolute minimum. The good thing  is that I live on a remote island with 5 acres of garden and 3 ongoing building projects and plenty of stockpiled materials, so I will be as busy as ever and am thankful for that. 

Why have you fallen through the net?

 

My tenants run the B&B and have 3 years accounts and the bulk of their income is from the self employed B&B business.  So I fully expect them to qualify for the grant of 80% of their average income.  Why won't you?

[nod]

I get paid a directors salary so it doesn’t really effect me 

But there will be many that will carry on going to site and wave the future payout Simply because they can’t manage that long 

We have four out of five sites still open and are under pressure to keep up with the work 

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, Thedreamer said:

As an accountant I can see what the government has done but too many folk have fallen through the cracks particularly in our area.

 

As an accountant, how many other cracks are there?

Have heard that if a company that is paying their staff 80% of wage and they do any trading, they loose it all.

Have also heard that it is only available to full time employees.

Could be back to 1970's crazy paving and income tax levels.

[Ferdinand]

2 hours ago, Thedreamer said:

My wife has some self employed income, but the bulk comes from wages from tourism sector.

 

At moment we don't get any help, as the tourist season usually starts in March.

 

Some self employed people who are able to continue to work will be laughing all the way to the bank as they will get up to £7,500 for nothing.

 

As an accountant I can see what the government has done but too many folk have fallen through the cracks particularly in our area.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Can you talk me through that £7500 for nothing?

 

I have not yet absorbed the detail of the package - how does that work.

 

Ferdinand

[Cpd]

1 hour ago, ProDave said:

Why have you fallen through the net?

 

as I will need to potentially wait a very long time before I get anything back from the government 

 

6 hours ago, nod said:

I feel very sorry for the self employed While they will get something They won’t get anything until June at the earliest If the lockdown is extended it could be a long time without any income 

and due to me starting my new business 3 years ago I had to supplement my income with savings made previously as I developed the new  business.
Any government pay out would only come to about £380 per month max per month  (based on my previous 3 years accounting) and I seriously expect that my holiday let will  (if I am allowed to open) only make pennies over the next six months, whereas I expected to make £8000+ this summer alone.   
 

so I am left wondering how I am to survive on My £1500 savings between now and the earliest payout from the government. 

luckily I am dept free and own everything and live I independently so I WILL be ok for  some time but When the first big bill comes in I will be left looking to borrow, something I have NEVER done in my life. 
 

having never claimed anything like the dole or income support in my life and I’m 47 and paid plenty of tax, the one time I need the help now looks like  it’s a long way of and when it comes (tiny amount) I will be in dept and heading into winter with NOTHING in the bank to see me over. 
 

this is where I am going to “fall through the net” 

 

I am not one to complain And will do everything I can to make it work. Just sold 12 eggs for £5 ...... time to increase the flock and sell of some excess vegetables! 

 

 

 

[nod]

It does look like you are getting penalised for starting your own business 

Our sons partner started up on her own two and a half years ago 

Jubilant when she found out self employed are going to be helped 

I don’t think she has realised that she won’t be within the criteria 

[ProDave]

1 hour ago, Ferdinand said:

 

Can you talk me through that £7500 for nothing?

 

I have not yet absorbed the detail of the package - how does that work.

 

Ferdinand

They will take your average SE profit over the last 3 years, and pay you 80% of that for 3 months, capped at a maximum of £2500 per month as a taxable grant.

[Stones]

And you can keep working and earning...so if your SE income / work remains stable /at the level it was pre crisis, the govt support is in effect money for nothing, assuming your income level makes you eligible. Clearly the intention is to support / top up / replace SE income that has fallen significantly/reduced to near zero because of the crisis /government restrictions. I think the chancellor was asked about this and had to concede the point but didn't want as he put it, the perfect to be the enemy? of the good (or some such form of words).

[AliG]

I’d hope people have the integrity to not claim if they are still working and earning. But no doubt some will whilst others struggle.

 

I looked out the window today and the guy who laid our grass was in the garden  I spoke to him about taking over looking after the garden a couple of months ago.

 

He subcontracts to another company who have been doing it poorly. They didn’t really want me to switch to him but I got an email yesterday saying he could take it over as they only have one member of staff working.

 

We had a discussion about how he planned to work as he works outside on his own so there is no reason not to work. This is in line with government policy.

 

I asked what had happened to all the staff. He said they were given the choice of 80% pay at home or 100% pay and working. All but one member of staff chose staying at home.

[iSelfBuild]

I'm self employed... and royally shafted my self in all kinds of ways in terms of an eligibility for self employed help. I have Ltd companies. Left employment in July 2018, had some income from employment (May - July) and just £2k dividends. Saved every penny in my business not to evade tax, just to grow my business and take the leap to employ people in 2020 - I realised that dream in February this year. Only paid myself £700ish a month salary throughout this tax year, again not to evade tax just to grow my business - this year I topped up my income with dividends of £16.5k to £25k personal income. They really are going in on us 'tax evader directors' - Yes I may pay myself with dividends to avoid NI contributions but I do pay corporation tax, employer NI contributions, pensions contributions, VAT etc and we still get taxed on dividends.

 

Another way I shafted myself... rented a business premises in February and my landlord didn't manage to sort the lease and register the transfer of SBRR because he has been quite un-well, I'm not a monster so I didn't put him under any pressure throughout February and March. It's highly likely that I won't get the potential £10k grant on offer for SBRR as if they allow post dated applications there would be a lot of fraud with people renting out empty units to their mates.

 

Still... I'm not too upset. I will manage and one of my businesses is doing really well. I suppose there are a portion of self-employed that do qualify but don't really need the help - they can still claim it as I don't believe you have to prove and hardship do you? I do worry about those directors who live hand to mouth, month to month and there is many of them! It's disgusting that they are disregarding them. They say it's complicated... well here's a solution that works for all. All employees and self employed can have an advance on their self assessment tax return income level or end of year tax return. You can claim it each month IF you need it. It's got to be paid back just like how student loans are paid back and it's written off after so many years. Surely this is a fairer solution and would have been welcomed by all self employed as a god send. Fortunately my friends and family are all well and the nation seems to be behaving and the NHS continues to do a fantastic job.

Edited March 27, 2020 by iSelfBuild

[nod]

38 minutes ago, AliG said:

I’d hope people have the integrity to not claim if they are still working and earning. But no doubt some will whilst others struggle.

 

I looked out the window today and the guy who laid our grass was in the garden  I spoke to him about taking over looking after the garden a couple of months ago.

 

He subcontracts to another company who have been doing it poorly. They didn’t really want me to switch to him but I got an email yesterday saying he could take it over as they only have one member of staff working.

 

We had a discussion about how he planned to work as he works outside on his own so there is no reason not to work. This is in line with government policy.

 

I asked what had happened to all the staff. He said they were given the choice of 80% pay at home or 100% pay and working. All but one member of staff chose staying at home.

Excellent point 

If you are working The right thing to do would be not to claim 

 

I’d said in a previous post that I’d waved a months rent for four of our long term tenants 

Two have informed me that they are getting paid off there employers and will be fine 

The other two have offered to make the month up in June 

Lots if good people out there 

[AliG]

We asked the cleaner to stop

coming and stopped going to the gym but are still paying them as I am still being paid and they need the income.

 

I was not impressed at all with a work colleague who said they might let their nanny go as they are working from home.

[Ferdinand]

2 hours ago, AliG said:

We asked the cleaner to stop

coming and stopped going to the gym but are still paying them as I am still being paid and they need the income.

 

I was not impressed at all with a work colleague who said they might let their nanny go as they are working from home.

 

My cleaner has now stopped coming, as she works for a Limited company run locally.

 

Will get the 80%.

 

Also she has mum’s supply of unused pyjamas, which will probably last about a decade ?. I'm pleased that someone known to me could use them, rather than having to cast them on the charity shop wind.

 

F

 

Edited March 27, 2020 by Ferdinand

[Oz07]

Mines still coming did ask me if I want to cancel as around 50% of her other clients have. I'm happy for her to come as long as she is. 

[Pocster]

21 hours ago, Thedreamer said:

My wife has some self employed income, but the bulk comes from wages from tourism sector.

 

At moment we don't get any help, as the tourist season usually starts in March.

 

Some self employed people who are able to continue to work will be laughing all the way to the bank as they will get up to £7,500 for nothing.

 

As an accountant I can see what the government has done but too many folk have fallen through the cracks particularly in our area.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Can you explain how 'income' from property is devised ? i.e. being a 'landlord' ( which anyone can be simply from renting out a property' and being a self employed landlord ?)

I know HMRC treat these differently one as an investment ( so no help where SE or not) and one as a trade/business . What 'defines' the difference?.

Obviously if you work full time and have 1 property let through an agent that looks clearly like an investment.

[joe90]

39 minutes ago, pocster said:

Obviously if you work full time and have 1 property let through an agent that looks clearly like an investment.

but, I am retired on a private pension And rent out another house, my pension is PAYE but rental income is declared as “self employed” not investment by HMRC!!!

[ProDave]

36 minutes ago, joe90 said:

but, I am retired on a private pension And rent out another house, my pension is PAYE but rental income is declared as “self employed” not investment by HMRC!!!

I am not sure you declared that correctly.

 

My end of year tax calculation shows:

Profit from self employmet £xxxx

Profit from UK land and property £yyyy

Income from UK pensions £zzzz

 

If you have declared rental income as "self employment" I am not sure that is entirely right.  Or perhaps I am the one that miss read the guidance?

[joe90]

11 minutes ago, ProDave said:

If you have declared rental income as "self employment" I am not sure that is entirely right.  Or perhaps I am the one that miss read the guidance?

it’s the way I read the guidance and the way my “tax man” has declared stuff fir me.

[Pocster]

52 minutes ago, joe90 said:

but, I am retired on a private pension And rent out another house, my pension is PAYE but rental income is declared as “self employed” not investment by HMRC!!!

In theory you should be ok . But who knows ; guess we wait until June and find out !