scottishjohn

If normal life of sunamp heating element is 2-3 years and the unit its costs over £1000 --then that does not sound like a good deal for a std type dhw system -other than it takes less physical space .still a long way to go before it could take over from std dhw system for majority of houses

think thats the sort of stuff my dad used about 70years ago --pity hes dead now or i could ask him I remember him saying best lasting colour for outside woodwork was green

a bit more accurate detail think is really needed what are the walls made out of that the semi flat grp is going join too? maybe lead flashing into brick wall onto the flatish roof -plenty of length,but also a flashing on roof below grp finished edge of it going up under the wall flashing --? plenty of overlap on everything and no flat area to puddle .

think its just same as PB --you never have it touching the floor ,cos it can suck up moisture and skirting will cover it anyway ,

I talked to a uk zinc roof supplier a couple of years ago and he stressed very much the need for a constant ventilation space under it . for a supplier to stress that on first contact was enough to put me off the system . Its expensive enough and then to have to build another sarking board roof under it --too much for me --same as you would do for a "scottish" type slate roof , but instead of costing £30-£80sqm its £150sqm for top layer I think If i really wanted roof to look like that then the insulted panel type the kinpspan and others supply would be the way you are getting up to 0.015u roof in one layer and the look you want and as phonelic is bonded to underside --no moisture problems --ever

In scotland now If you build a house with and agricutural tie --EG -- you can start a lama farm or chicken ranch ,trout farm etc providing enough ground to be considered as possibly viable -- not one field and a "good life " type then at some point in the future you can sell the house to NON agricultural person . BUT that piece of ground will never be allowed another chicken farm +house on it So gone are the days when you had to pull the house down if it became empty or only those engaged agriculture close by could inhabit it , something my mind is contemplating +will possibly be testing out with planning ,but i think alpaca,s are a better temperament than spitting,biting lamas, not sure if its now the same in england +wales --could be something to do with crofting?

used to call it "tombstone technology" in the aviation world ,or so i was assured by a man who worked for bristol after the war then finished on the concord project before retirement If the wings fall off --then we need to beef them up --sort of attitude LOL no excuse these days with computers to work all the numbers out in a split second

the £1900 would pay for an accumulator ,if you had a big pressure drop and would smooth out flow+pressure and you would still have £1k in your pocket,or just take the money and fit accumulator if needed later

yes agreed, sort of,but not in my house the one big double rad was on the back wall and window was not on that wall. so you do feel radiation of a lower temp ,eg cold ,from that area . anything above absolute zero is heat

what you are seeing there is exactly what I was eluding too in the difference between rads +ufh that I noticed with rads I never felt the cold radiation from the windows ,but very noticeable once I swopped to UFH

deifnitley Ifound this with my garage workshop -which is 25mx 24m we used to have blown air heating then changed to infrared gas tube heaters this heated the ramps the floor the mechnaics toolboxs etc --anything and everything ,which then radiated to the air .what was very noticeable was that when the big doors were opened for a car to come in the temp recovered much quickerwhen door was shut than when when blown air heating ,as all that went out of the door when it was opened I think it is the same with UFH --it heats all the furniture etc at a low level ,so opening doors does not drop temp same as with rads

I agree with you which was why i used a thermal store with my system to stop "hunting on lpg boiler +I had solar thermal input to this as well and due to house type each room has its own stat+programmer and zone valve the down side is the no one keeps all the doors shut to each room .LOL so slightly pointless -- so now its ended as basically an upstairs and downstairs zone that works fine -- and i can see with small heat store in floor you need to store it in a large tank ,which is where my idea of combined solar thermal +PV and tall large store comes in that is easy to insulate to death if you want to in the service area

with only a very slim biscuit screed then it should not be as big a problem cos you won,t be holding heat for so long or have as much of a "thermal mass" to heat up ?

maybe we should be building with strip foundations then subwalls and fill inside them with 300-400m insulation and fully floating floor on top of it with UFH built in ? no big heat store in floor then --so only heat it when you need it - temp will change very quick then and low heat losses?

thats exactly what i found

I have no calculations, just the one that matters --how much energy i have to pay for and that said 20%less with suspended floor retro fit UFH than with rads maybe that is the way then air gap and insulated suspended floor with thin screed if looking for best economy in heating costs ? or should it be same 300eps then slab ,then 100mm eps and ufh then choice of floor ? what do your numbers say to that ?

so what you are saying is is that radiators are a more effiecient system than UFH and we should all be using rads

I do not think the heat loss will be as bad as you suggest as the sort of system he is contemplating is not a "thermal store",nearly said "thermal mass", like a normal concrete slab and will change temp very quickly in comparison to a thick concrete slab -and so he will not loose as much because he is not putting it into the slab --but upwards and outwards when he needs it . I know its not a simple thing ,but i have lived with a system similar to this and it works fine and better than rads ,which is the point --it is a good half way house and as he is using gas then no need to charge up the floor at night on cheap electric ,as most do with ASHP etc and mains gas is still cheapest option for most people

I have no issue with your numbers --but that is not what the man was asking -he don,t want to rip his house to bits my physics say heats rises # its the principle that matters with rads you heat the ceiling first then the room fills downwards from the ceiling UFH heats the floor then the furniture and you,then rises to a point where it cools then drops and recirculates and so ceiling could be cooler ,dependant on height etc ,than where you are and where you need it you will note I suggested if keeping rads he insulates concrete floor to stop it sucking heat downwards anyway and even agreed that new slab would be better. and if he is doing a real up grade then maybe he should seriously consider re -boarding with 37m foam backed plasterboard--that will help a a lot with heat loss through walls and ceiling .. 50 year old house will have next to sod all wall or ceiling insulation . I know from when i did my house that it made a big difference in heat loss and noise level

well as usual I look at it another way yes keeping rads looks right one way ,but that still does not stop the heat going down through the concrete floor ,maybe you use rads and still lift floor by adding insulation layer under it next to concrete? all you can say is by its nature rads will throw heat up wards away from floor I retro fitted UFh in a suspended wooden floor with very little under insulation and the result was a 20% drop in heating costs --all i changed was rads to UFH--same lpg boiler -feeding a thermal store which the ufh coil ran through . I routed out the chipboard flooring and lined the slots with foil tape --fitted pipes then screwed down 6mm ply all over floor ,then ceramic tiles -- not a job i would do again - If doing it again-I would lift the floor level or drop the joist height and double them up to put strength back ,but it meant i could do it without destroying the house . everything that has been said about drafts+air leaks is correct -- that was the first thing i noticed after UFH --you could feel a cold from windows as you walked past them --so curtains were essential on these older double glazed units-- curtains seems something which is not done with a lot of new builds--must be all exhibitionists!!. thr other main thing was that the floor heated up all the furniture and anything close to floor --heat rises then before it gets to ceiling it drops again --radiators send heat straight to ceiling FIRST.-try standing on a chair and feel how hot it is at ceiling level in house with rads I would agree that rip out start again would be good ,but I also think the 50mm of phonelic foam as underlay with pipes inserted init ,then ply+ceramic tiles or some sort of hard floor will work just fine that will keep height down --if you can stand more height --all the better --but you gotta kill the drafts as they will be low level taking your heat away from the floor before it gets to you . phonelic foam =0.020 pir foam = 0.023

I agree with some of what he says ,but as i said in the other thread ,If you have space for both solar thermal and PV panels and a large tank then I believe there is a way use and get best from both systems working together with large very TALLthermal store

I know if it was here -in scotland and the planning was for 5 in one development ,then ALL the roads+ services + street lamps for ALL the sites would have to be in and up to council spec before you could move into any of them --so a check with council before buying

local prices for that house and something that would suit would decide which is best way forward. a plan showing size of house with size of plot and location of house on it would help people give better suggestions 2 more bedrooms and another bathroom sounds like half the size of the house you have ,which could be a problem to planning ,depending on other houses around you and plot size etc so as well as checking price of a another bigger house you maybe should approach planning and see if you can do what you want to first before buying

I certainly would be wanting to check the moisture content of all the wood behind this render panel -as soon as there is a hole to get at it just in case it is some other underlying problem .

glad to hear its getting sorted at last and as was predicted its strip back and start again .. all the woes you have had just confirms my thoughts that render on TF is not the way I would go It would be cladding. I don,t suppose they would convert it to that instead ,if you wanted? it does show that the actual render is very good + flexible as it has not fallen off in lumps ,