At my wits end with brick layers. Advice please.

[flanagaj]

I've refrained from posting on here for fear of asking stupid questions, but I have concluded that on this occasion, I really could do with some guidance.

As you know, we let our first brickie go as his work was substandard.  We waited nearly 8 weeks for the new one to start and he started Monday.  He is making good progress and aside from not listening to me or reading drawings where service lintels are supposed to go, it's ok.  However, when he started, I was really surprised that he did not build up the corners of the house using a laser level, to ensure that the height of the first course would be correct.  Instead, he started at one end and made his way down the 24m length.

He is now at dpc level on the internal leaf and he is 22mm out from one end of the house (excluding garage) 17m to the other end.  Alarm bells are ringing in my head again and I don't know whether I should raise the issue.

It's driving me mad that I have to deal with such incompetent individuals.  I also had to explain to him that he had missed out the lintel for a back inlet gulley.  His response "you don't run a soil pipe into the back of a bottle gulley.  You put the sink waste through the wall and into it."  Clearly, he is wrong, but I am just the dumb IT Programmer who knows feck all.

Just after some help here, as I really don't want to sack another builder and start again.  

[Mr Punter]

The 22mm is annoying but is only 1mm per metre.

 

With the sub structure stuff it will be possible to rectify but I would point out that I expect it built as per drawings.  Better to let him know as he progresses than after he has finished.  Check the drawings each day and go through with him in the morning where you think he might mess up.

[saveasteading]

22mm is a lot. He hasn't a clue other than brick, next brick. 

Probably has never had to set up the coursings/ manage.

 

I've known them like this.

Doors missed out (I'll cut that out later). 

Got no bricks. When did you realise it was getting low? Got no bricks.

 

Ive seen worse if it's any consolation.  The brick course spiralled and was up to window level when noticed. Fortunately I was only engaged to find why it wasn't working.

 

Does it otherwise look OK?

 

22mm now and then what? He gets it back over a few courses or it gets worse. Will he remember windows and get them right. When you reach eaves the roof and gutter will be a challenge to an innocent joiner.

 

you need a proper talk, sat down to keep his attention.

If you think he is worth the risk then

I think I might be tempted to compromise if there really are few options.

 

Tell him to win back that 22mm * by removing and replacing the last course. 11mm correction then again above dpc.

Ask him how he is going to prevent this happening again. 

 

And daily checks by you.

 

* someone on BH who can lay bricks will know better than I.

 

 

 

 

[G and J]

4 hours ago, flanagaj said:

aside from not listening to me or reading drawings where service lintels are supposed to go, it's ok. 

Is this ok? Appreciate that you've had problems sourcing a bricklayer, but this wouldn't have been ok for us.

 

Not sure if you're able to be there in the day, but what has worked for us is trying to establish buy in for the project, people have seen us doing stuff and we have made it clear its going to be our home (not a profit making venture), and whilst it can be difficult to pick things up a "sorry, not sure that's right; not what we were looking for; or even know we're being picky" has gone a long way.

 

There is no doubt we've been lucky, but ........

[torre]

Yes raise the issue, 22mm is a lot to be out by DPC. What were the foundations like? Has he created a problem or inherited one (even so he should've been picking this up)?

 

If you'll have level thresholds at multiple openings over that length then one potential problem might be you'd struggle later with a liquid screed.

 

Our brickie had to pick one corner up over a few courses, marking the spacings for the next few courses out on the corner profiles seemed to work well (say the good end is 75/150/225/300 then the low end mark 77/154/231/308 etc) until you're back level.

 

You have to have an honest discussion, ask how he plans to get back to level, suggest taking down a course or two as the lower you start to fix this, the easier it'll be. Give him a chance and then decide from his response (both attitude and actions) if he's someone you can work with or will be battling with for the rest of the brickwork.

 

When you say soil pipe into the back inlet, I guess you only mean grey water, not a toilet?

[ToughButterCup]

5 hours ago, flanagaj said:

...  Alarm bells are ringing in my head again and I don't know whether I should raise the issue...

 

Yes, you should.

 

How you do that is the key

 

You are not an expert - or assumed not to be an expert: and the minute you start pointing to what might - or might not - be a problem, you become a target. For his (?) ire. 

Raise the issue in plain straight terms:

• I see this [...] as a problem. Am I correct in thinking it is one?
• How are we going to get to the required level ? And by when ?
• Do not suggest an answer to your question(s) - you'd be pissed off with me if I came and asked you why you'd coded that 'class' as you did.
• Give clear direction on the desired outcome
• Supervise daily - take a benign  interest in the short term, tighten as necessary

Under no circumstances pay him yet.  

[kandgmitchell]

LABC warranty manual suggests no more than 15mm for walls over 5m long.

 

See this:  https://www.labcwarranty.co.uk/hubfs/Technical Manual v10 Files and Images/Manual Sections/Section 1 Tolerances.pdf#:~:text=A 10mm deviation is suggested,over 5m long.

 

It's frustrating about leaving lintels out etc. Our groundworker had a tendency to say "that's close enough". I always countered with "what the frame erectors want they must have, so stick to their requirements please otherwise I'll get the blame". For instance we had set places for rainwater drains so the associated downpipes could be located over studs in the frame for fixing. I had to have the first gulley moved because it had to be 1645mm from the corner and he put it at 1800mm odd. "They'll just move the downpipe" was the reply, but why not just put it where the drawing said in the first place!!! I found blaming others for "being awkward" came in useful and maintained a working relationship until we got there......