SteamyTea Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 39 minutes ago, MikeSharp01 said: You could but you would soon either have it overwritten or asked to provide your evidence / citations/ references. I use it to confirm what I already know i.e. an equation. I know a fairly well known actor, their birthday is wrong on Wikipedia, and IMDB. They don't change it as that way they get lots of cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 (edited) 1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said: I would take a blend of both. There are a lot of very well versed individuals on this forum, and I for one have zero ‘credentials’ to relate to building a certified passivhaus. Wholeheartedly agree. By credentials I don't necessarily mean qualifications I mean has this person worked with this stuff before. Are they speaking from a position of knowledge or are they guessing? It is hard to tell sometimes. It becomes clear the more you read from a certain user who is knowledgeable about each field but I don't think it is unreasonable to ask someone to clarify not just what they were saying but what makes them say that. I don't know you guys that well yet but in time I'll need to do that less as we get to know each other. Admittedly my comments fell a little on the "appeal to authority" side of things but that isn't my general position. I was being somewhat reactive to abrupt claims of things not working or being impossible despite prior art. 1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said: However, I recently engaged with a PH certified architect, 25 years of PH design experience, and I got my design in at 88% efficient vs his 87%. He asked me a lot of questions, I gave very robust and reasonable replies, he conceded and the client then changed the MVHR design (well, the entire MEP design) and supplier on my say-so (and agreed to accept they’d lost £1k on the 1st design deposit). A PH certified home builder now builds differently, after 30 years of PH experience, after meeting me and hearing how I have approached creating homes that consider M&E etc and how we’ve integrated things on other clients previous builds. In terms of qualifications, I have a clean driver license, that’s it. But I do have bucketloads of tenacity, a passion for what I do, and an unquenchable thirst for knowledge. Most of the stuff I’ve learned has come from exchanges here, with invaluable input, argument, reason, and real-life data (there’s a HUGE amount of it here if you want to spend some time digging). This is very impressive and was likely the result of a ruthless focus on the data in front of you, great work. I'm very much at the top of the funnel trying to work out what works and what doesn't. As I get further down the funnel I will rule more and more things out until the solution comes into view. This will involve challenging assumptions, both my own, those of our team and the assumptions here. 1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said: I’d rethink your confidence in ‘all that glitters’, as only a select few turn out to be gold… but I certainly do hope you have some of the best at hand. You’ll need it, as there’s a LOT to correlate and execute correctly at yours. I've probably misrepresented my position here as I know painfully from first hand experience how true this is. Above I accidentally thanked another user for referring us to the timber framing supplier when I meant to thank you, apologies for getting the two of you mixed up. We will have a quote from them on Friday (incredible turnaround). I'll try to anonymise and publicly post what I can so others can make a direct comparison between Nudura and the timber frame. Edited March 6 by NailBiter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 (edited) 22 minutes ago, JohnMo said: I worked with a guy that used to use Wikipedia as a reference tool, for marine engineering project He started quoting something he found on there in a large meeting, unfortunately the information was duff and he was nearly sacked. Internet is awash with rubbish information, you need to do your due diligence to verify stuff. I think this is offtopic if you don't mind us steering it back. I'm perfectly happy for anyone in this thread to use either of the terms Thermal Mass and Thermal Inertia. We all know what we mean. Edited March 6 by NailBiter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 9 minutes ago, NailBiter said: I'm perfectly happy for anyone in this thread to use either of the terms Thermal Mass and Thermal Inertia. We all know what we mean. Except one of them can have SI units attached to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 2 minutes ago, SteamyTea said: Except one of them can have SI units attached to it. Perhaps a subject for its own topic, just like the somewhat tired "is wikipedia a good source" debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Just now, NailBiter said: Perhaps a subject for its own topic Not really, needs to be nipped in the bud early, then there is no confusion. There is plenty of stuff about it that older members have read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 I'm not sure what you are getting out of derailing this thread but can I kindly ask you to stop. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Let’s keep this on topic please folks. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 21 hours ago, SteamyTea said: This seems like it is going to become interesting, and expensive. Should be able to chip in with comments every now and again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 All helpful comments warmly received, if your goal here is just to go on the wind up can I ask you do it somewhere else? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe90 Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 I too started this journey at the top of the funnel despite being a builder for years….i think “most” here are “been there done that “ and some are well read. At least no one is trying to sell you anything. My ol Dad used to say, “there is no such thing as right and wrong, only opinion” 🤷♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 19 minutes ago, joe90 said: My ol Dad used to say, “there is no such thing as right and wrong, only opinion” 🤷♂️ Wise man. It turns out even the things I thought were absolute certainties aren't. For example MVHRs are potentially of dubious utility depending on latitude and other factors it seems. I guess speaking in general terms "MVHRs work" or "MVHRs don't work" is a fool's errand. The more I learn the less I know. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonshine Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 9 minutes ago, NailBiter said: the more I learn the less I know Mr Dunning and Mr Kruger have entered the chat.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 16 minutes ago, NailBiter said: Wise man. It turns out even the things I thought were absolute certainties aren't. For example MVHRs are potentially of dubious utility depending on latitude and other factors it seems. I guess speaking in general terms "MVHRs work" or "MVHRs don't work" is a fool's errand. The more I learn the less I know. MVHR is requisite in an “airtight” residence, you’ll go purple and your eyes will pop out if you don’t install it. Not entirely true, but of course you will need to shift humidity and CO2 etc, plus introduce fresh, breathable air, so the “does / doesn’t work” comment I think mostly pertains to the efficiency and heat recovery values vs function per-se. I, personally, would just look at the highest efficiency and most robust (longevity) unit I could afford, and then I’d save up and buy a better one These are going 24/7/365 so have to be designed, configured, and chosen well to get the dividends. Any unit will ‘move air’ btw. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Oh, and in a property that size you should do much better than 0.6 ach. The smaller the volume the harder it is to get a good score. Last few MBC TF jobs I’ve done have got 0.26, 0.27 and 0.25 results, as their airtight team are very meticulous, but I am even more so and bolster that with a bit more tape here and there plus AT foam anywhere that it looks like that would further improve things. @Russell griffiths got .28 on his DIY Nudura build iirc. That correct Bruce? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 It’s no secret that for MVHR I favour Brink equipment from CVC Systems. Whacking in some more of their stuff atm, and they’ve delivered great results on every install. Tres bien. 👌 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailBiter Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said: It’s no secret that for MVHR I favour Brink equipment from CVC Systems. Whacking in some more of their stuff atm, and they’ve delivered great results on every install. Tres bien. 👌 Will take a look cheers, someone made an ESPhome device that integrates this with Home Assistant here: https://community.home-assistant.io/t/brink-flair-325-heat-recovery-unit-esphome-modbus-integration-5/423182 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BotusBuild Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said: @Russell griffiths got .28 on his DIY Nudura build Ooh, now I know I've got a target for mine 🙂 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorfun Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 5 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: I would take a blend of both. amen brother! 🫡 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bramco Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 2 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: Last few MBC TF jobs I’ve done have got 0.26, 0.27 and 0.25 results, as their airtight team are very meticulous They are meticulous but the fabric can be good while windows, rooflights and doors can still let things down. Would be interesting to check the difference between 0.25, 0.5 and 0.75 on the heat loss spreadsheet - is there a big difference? Simon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone West Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 55 minutes ago, Bramco said: Would be interesting to check the difference between 0.25, 0.5 and 0.75 on the heat loss spreadsheet - is there a big difference? When I was modelling my last house, I ran my house design through the PHPP with a range of air infiltration values to see what the effect would be. Pressurisation Test Result (ACH) Specific Space Heating Demand (kWh/m2a) 0.2 12.1 0.4 12.3 0.6 12.5 0.8 12.7 1.0 12.9 2.0 14.0 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeSharp01 Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 6 hours ago, JohnMo said: Internet is awash with rubbish information, you need to do your due diligence to verify stuff. Absolutely - let's hope we here are not contributing too much - lets get back on topic - whatever that is given how far this one has wandered over 5+ pages.... Sorry @Nickfromwales Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorfun Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 1 hour ago, MikeSharp01 said: Absolutely - let's hope we here are not contributing too much - lets get back on topic - whatever that is given how far this one has wandered over 5+ pages.... Sorry @Nickfromwales threads going off topic can actually yield some amazingly interesting discussions and I've never worried about my threads diverging in various ways and have learnt tons from those diverse discussions. they generally come back on topic eventually anyway. at least no one has invited @Pocster in to this thread yet to really derail it! whoops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 20 minutes ago, Thorfun said: one has invited @Pocster in to this thread yet to really derail it! And as if by magic I appeared … 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeSharp01 Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Just now, Pocster said: And as if by magic I appeared … ooooops. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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