Potential builders

[SarahG]

Meeting our first builder on site tomorrow. What sort of questions should I ask, topics to discuss?

 

He has sent off our drawings to his estimators so hoping he will bring his quote along tomorrow.

 

He is the second builder we have spoken to and comes highly recommended. The first didn’t get very far as his communication was so bad I gave up. Clearly wasn’t interested.

 

Don’t suppose there are any builders on here interested in a new build in Surrey are there 😀

[Temp]

Perhaps ask him what he thinks of the insulation requirements of the Building Regs? Don't say any more but note if he see it as an expensive regulation or inadequate target.

 

If you are going for ASHP ask him what he thinks of them. He should say something about them working well if you have UFH and a well insulated house. 

 

Ask him if he thinks airtight houses are unnecessary. Hopefully he will tell you its important.

 

If you are on a self build mortgage that has strict stage payments you might want to sound him out on what stage payments he normally wants. It's not a great idea to agree exactly the same schedule with the builder as your mortgage lender but they must be compatible schedule's obviously. Perhaps don't tell him what they have offered you. You might want to negotiate more favourable terms with the builder so you retain a bit more to the end. It's not unknown to retain a percentage for a year after completion to cover snagging.  

 

Ideally find out where he's working at the moment and go look at that house. Is the site tidy? Neat work? Messy? I've said it before - If you ask him to take you to one he's built it will probably be his mother's house 🙂 

 

[Big Jimbo]

All good questions from Temp above. If he is a Limited Co, have a look at his previously filed accounts online.

[Post and beam]

I asked a prospective builder about ASHP and MVHR. It was clear from his response that he thought it 'new fangled technology'. In my head the meeting ended at that point.

He was a nice genial old boy and i am sure he could build me a solid driveway. Just not the house.

I am still looking

[PeterW]

47 minutes ago, Post and beam said:

I asked a prospective builder about ASHP and MVHR. It was clear from his response that he thought it 'new fangled technology'. In my head the meeting ended at that point.

He was a nice genial old boy and i am sure he could build me a solid driveway. Just not the house.

I am still looking

builder..?? A lot of that should be done by others such as plumber / M&E / electrician etc so it’s horses for courses as a general builder shouldn’t / wouldn’t know about some of that but should be part of the planning and decision making as routing of ducts through steels etc can be a challenge … much easier done on paper and then tell the builder to follow the plans religiously … 

[TonyT]

Maybe you should have asked a plumber or electrician,  or someone with an M&E background in my opinion would be more suitable in asking about these technologies rather than a builder.

 

I would ask if they have a list of sub contractors for specialist trades that he uses and can he supply details of this too in due course, or is he a builder that does everything himself and you then spend thousands afterwards rectifying what you can see and then worrying about what you can’t see.

 

Find out the feeling of a contract with targets and payments should be agreed too, saves arguments later

 

[Post and beam]

37 minutes ago, PeterW said:

builder..?? A lot of that should be done by others such as plumber / M&E / electrician etc so it’s horses for courses as a general builder shouldn’t / wouldn’t know about some of that but should be part of the planning and decision making as routing of ducts through steels etc can be a challenge … much easier done on paper and then tell the builder to follow the plans religiously … 

I agree, up to a point. If the guy puts himself forward as competent then i expect them to be. 

[SarahG]

Thanks @Temp those are all really valuable tips. We are going for ASHP and UFH. Our architect has provided a lot of detail on our specific insulation requirements- which the builder has so that is a good question to ask him about that and also air tightness tests and the photographic documentation stuff.

 

Even if the builder isn't doing the work himself he still needs to be on board with the requirements. As @TonyT said a list or an idea of his sub-contractors would be helpful.

 

We will be taking out a self build mortgage which we have the agreement in principle for and there are requirements for JCT contact and structural warranty that I will ask him about also. I am not clear if we take out the structural warranty or if that is something they would do.

 

I need to make my own list now before he arrives!

[Thorfun]

18 hours ago, SarahG said:

Don’t suppose there are any builders on here interested in a new build in Surrey are there 😀

i know a rather good builder based in West Sussex. i didn't use him as i went timber frame (although his comical response was "I have a hammer" 🤣) but i've seen his work and it's very good and he's a really nice guy to boot.

 

if you don't get on with your chosen builders and want another to try let me know. fyi, i haven't asked him if he'd be interested in something in Surrey but happy to make an introduction if you want/need one.

[SarahG]

7 hours ago, Thorfun said:

i know a rather good builder based in West Sussex. i didn't use him as i went timber frame (although his comical response was "I have a hammer" 🤣) but i've seen his work and it's very good and he's a really nice guy to boot.

 

if you don't get on with your chosen builders and want another to try let me know. fyi, i haven't asked him if he'd be interested in something in Surrey but happy to make an introduction if you want/need one.

Thanks @Thorfun that would be great. Meeting went well today but obviously would like to speak to some more builders. I know a few people have had West Sussex builders in the area, none that want to do a full build though! Would be great if you could do an intro. Do you want to DM me?

[Thorfun]

Just now, SarahG said:

Thanks @Thorfun that would be great. Meeting went well today but obviously would like to speak to some more builders. I know a few people have had West Sussex builders in the area, none that want to do a full build though! Would be great if you could do an intro. Do you want to DM me?

I'm seeing him tomorrow so I'll speak to him then and get back to you if that's ok.

[SarahG]

35 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

I'm seeing him tomorrow so I'll speak to him then and get back to you if that's ok.

Yes of course. Let me know if he’s interested, no problem if not. Thank you.

[Dave Jones]

On 13/04/2023 at 18:20, SarahG said:

Meeting our first builder on site tomorrow. What sort of questions should I ask, topics to discuss?

 

He has sent off our drawings to his estimators so hoping he will bring his quote along tomorrow.

 

He is the second builder we have spoken to and comes highly recommended. The first didn’t get very far as his communication was so bad I gave up. Clearly wasn’t interested.

 

Don’t suppose there are any builders on here interested in a new build in Surrey are there 😀

 

what m2 cost are you budgeting for out of interest ?

[Iceverge]

On 13/04/2023 at 18:20, SarahG said:

Meeting our first builder on site tomorrow. What sort of questions should I ask, topics to discuss?

 

 

Get some references from them and interview the past clients. 

 

After some of the really awful stories on here about people loosing all their money so a trustworthy party is really important. Our builder wasn't the tidiest but honourable to a fault. 

 

A good individual who is fussy about their work can achieve excellent results so long as they are willing to learn old school or not. 

[Andehh]

Be sure they accept payment end of each month, and need no deposit or advance payments... Good builders will have large credit allowances at their merchants so don't even pay up front themselves! 

[Dave Jones]

2 hours ago, Andehh said:

Be sure they accept payment end of each month, and need no deposit or advance payments... Good builders will have large credit allowances at their merchants so don't even pay up front themselves! 

 

most reputable builders would expect materials to be paid for at point of order. They are not there to bankroll your build.

[Temp]

42 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

most reputable builders would expect materials to be paid for at point of order. They are not there to bankroll your build.

 

Not when we built. Most were ok with being paid in stages in arrears with 5% retained for snagging.

 

Our builder did ask if I could help with cash flow once and I agreed to buy the windows myself.

[Andehh]

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

 

most reputable builders would expect materials to be paid for at point of order. They are not there to bankroll your build.

No, because most reputable builders have at least 30 days credit on those materials. Maybe on delivery but never at point of order... If a builder insists on payment ahead of/at point of ordering I would be concerned as to WHY he can't get credit... 

[Redoctober]

On 14/04/2023 at 08:43, Post and beam said:

I asked a prospective builder about ASHP and MVHR. It was clear from his response that he thought it 'new fangled technology'. In my head the meeting ended at that point.

He was a nice genial old boy and i am sure he could build me a solid driveway. Just not the house.

I am still looking

 

On 14/04/2023 at 10:15, Post and beam said:

I agree, up to a point. If the guy puts himself forward as competent then i expect them to be. 

 

Not wishing to hijack the thread of this post but could this be why you are still looking for a builder? Our builder was the same view as the one you dismissed. He had no idea what an ASHP was when it arrived but has built many houses in the area. That is why we choose to leave the heating and plumbng to those expert in that field - bit like Doctors I suppose - A generic term covering a host of specialities!

[Nickfromwales]

42 minutes ago, Redoctober said:

 

 

Not wishing to hijack the thread of this post but could this be why you are still looking for a builder? Our builder was the same view as the one you dismissed. He had no idea what an ASHP was when it arrived but has built many houses in the area. That is why we choose to leave the heating and plumbing to those expert in that field - bit like Doctors I suppose - A generic term covering a host of specialities!

It is, however, a little daunting to start off knowing your chosen "old boy" isn't going to aim for airtight / well insulated as his first option, and a lot are old dogs who just don't need to learn any new tricks because for every door that closes, another 2 open atm. 

The builder would need to be passionate, and would need to be open to having reasons given and consequences understood, should, for eg, their quality of workmanship behind the scenes not be at the same par as what was on show at the end.

 

The builders I worked with on a job in Leicester were very receptive of me 'educating' them about where airtightness membranes / associated products etc went, and how to maximise on the execution of those works. End result was excellent.

 

I had one builder sneaking behind my back to actually try and talk a client out of putting insulation under a heated summer-room screeded floor, saying it was a complete waste of money. Client stuck with me, and we put 200mm of PIR under it. Massive benefits, and they only had to use the UFH for the absolute worst part of the year.

[SarahG]

I think the air tightness is the most daunting as it seems purely based on the builders competence, so really important they are on board with that. We have our insulation specified and it’s pretty high grade, more than required for BR. But surely that’s just a case of buying the one we have detailed, so not so much of a concern.

 

Difference in opinions on here with regards payment stages. Totally get the builder is not there to bank roll. Also I don’t really want to be buying too much myself due to VAT implications and also I would imagine a builder could get a better deal or know more suppliers. 
 

The builder we met yesterday seemed keen if we find suppliers to get them to fit and supply, as they would then guarantee the work. So that is something I need to clarify with him when he provides the quote. How much and what is he expecting us to purchase? Really interested to see how this compares to other builders.

 

Edited April 15, 2023 by SarahG

[Mike]

4 minutes ago, SarahG said:

air tightness is the most daunting as it seems purely based on the builders competence

It also depends on you - or your representative - checking it at the right stages, to identify and remedy the leaks.

 

6 minutes ago, SarahG said:

We have our insulation specified and it’s pretty high grade, more than required for BR. But surely that’s just a case of buying the one we have detailed, so not so much of a concern.

Don't underestimate the ability of the builders to install it incorrectly. Get the BBA certificates are check that they're being followed.

 

7 minutes ago, SarahG said:

I don’t really want to be buying too much myself due to VAT implications and also I would imagine a builder could get a better deal or know more suppliers. 

The builder will just go to their regular suppliers and pay what they're invoiced, plus a mark-up to cover their time, effort & profit. If you have the time to shop around, particularly for high value items, you may make savings even if you do have to pay the VAT. Or arrange with your builder that you will identify certain suppliers and they'll buy the products at cost + an agreed markup.

[saveasteading]

8 minutes ago, SarahG said:

it seems purely based on the builders competence

Not just that unfortunately. Our joiner was college trained, experienced, a superb worker and very highly skilled.

Yet he did not understand the air-tightness thing at all.

Sole plate to footings...'forgot' the mastic.

Vapour barrier lapped but not sealed.

when we raised the subject it generated a shake of the head, and basically he ignored it.

(There is a lot of that even among the best workers....if they haven't heard of it then it must be wrong...and ignored.)

So we did the seals out of hours.

It follows that  all the jobs he worked on in stick building, mostly as a sub-contractor I think,  have been done without air-tightness being enforced.

And that is a well-intentioned craftsman.

[Dave Jones]

its because there isnt one trade responsible for air tightness. The buck just gets passed as its labour intensive to get right.

 

I'd insist on a pre-plaster air test to confirm everything is going to plan so corrections can be made while they still can.

 

or

 

the easy option you do it yourself.

Edited April 16, 2023 by Nickfromwales
typo

[Dave Jones]

3 hours ago, Andehh said:

No, because most reputable builders have at least 30 days credit on those materials. Maybe on delivery but never at point of order... If a builder insists on payment ahead of/at point of ordering I would be concerned as to WHY he can't get credit... 

 

if you wanted bankrolling i'd hope the builder increases their margin accordingly. Fortunately they are in a good position to pick their customers.