Which ICF method should I use?

[Indy]

I'm seriously considering ICF for my build and started looking at the different systems. So far I've spoken to Beco Wallform, Nudura and Durisol and they all seem to push the plus points of their product over the others.

 

Any recommendations on how to go about choosing one over the other - are there any online guides or videos that would make it easier to understand?

 

Most likely coupled with a SIPS roof.

[JohnMo]

Durisol, go on their website a full install instructions can be downloaded.  Also need less structural steel, than some other systems. Easy to do cladding and internal battons as they screw directly into the woodcrete., Render, brick/ stone slips attach directly also.

 

Downside is the block is not airtight, so needs either a membrane, parge or wet plaster coating. I did parge and service battons, then plasterboard (taped and jointed).

 

If you doing it yourself, it does not need bracing, just osb/ply on the corners, at cot blocks and at lintels.  But you can only do 6 levels high per pour of concrete.

 

Overall easy enough to do yourself, only tools needed,  I used was a recip saw, spirit levels, rubber mallet, tape measure, battery drill and roofers square.

[Russell griffiths]

Why would anybody consider beco. Have a really good look and tell us all the things it hasn’t got. That will help you decide. 

Durisol. Oh ffs just don’t. 

Do a search, this topic has been covered many times in the last year. 

[Mr Punter]

I have used Polarwall in the past for a basement.  It seemed OK and they were good to deal with.  I doubt I would use ICF again but never say never.

[CotswoldDoItUpper]

There is a huge amount of info on here and everyone has their own opinions/success stories/nightmare tales etc. each system has its  pros abs cons. As a starter you may need to decide between woodcrete and eps. 
 

good luck! If I was building I would use ICF, probably a woodcrete system. 

[Chanmenie]

If you are definitely considering woodcrete have a look at Isotex from https://insulhubuk.com/

Much better block than Durisol 

 

also use the search function on here as there are a couple of builds with pictures using woodcrete blocks 

[freshy]

On 19/02/2022 at 14:12, Indy said:

I'm seriously considering ICF for my build and started looking at the different systems. So far I've spoken to Beco Wallform, Nudura and Durisol and they all seem to push the plus points of their product over the others.

 

Any recommendations on how to go about choosing one over the other - are there any online guides or videos that would make it easier to understand?

 

Most likely coupled with a SIPS roof.

Who is building the house for you?

[ToughButterCup]

On 19/02/2022 at 14:12, Indy said:

...

Any recommendations on how to go about choosing one over the other 

...

 

Yes.

Visit a couple of sites of each type and watch the installs. Then decide. We used Durisol. The only reason I'd use the same again is because I know what to look for, what to avoid and how to fix it when [....] happens.

 

All the other types mentioned are perfectly adequate for anyone's needs: they would not have survived in the market if they'd been wanting in any way.

[Clc136a]

Also interested in building in ICF, walk out semi basement into clay bank, 3 units.

Considering Jakon, but struggling to find SEs or builders near Gloucester experienced (sure they're out there?)

Given that part of the basement will form a terrace and support some weight is horizontal ICF recommended?

[Adam2]

7 hours ago, Clc136a said:

near Gloucester experienced (sure they're out there?)

 

Try CNM in Cheltenham

[Indy]

Thank you all, been reading this subforum with a lot of interest and have taken the comments onboard. Trying to understand the difference between Woodcrete and EPS solutions, though there really doesnt seem to be a single definitive source that compares and contrasts the available solutions (maybe a task to take on!)

 

I've also taken the advice to book myself on the training course and have so far been in touch with Durisol, Nudurua and Insulhub (ISOTEX) so will see how that goes.

[Indy]

23 hours ago, freshy said:

Who is building the house for you?

 

Undecided and the training course will help me figure out whether I can take on any elements of the work on a DIY basis. In all likelihood, its going to be done by a main contractor as I wouldn't have the time or expertise to take on the whole build.

[Russell griffiths]

20 hours ago, Clc136a said:

Also interested in building in ICF, walk out semi basement into clay bank, 3 units.

Considering Jakon, but struggling to find SEs or builders near Gloucester experienced (sure they're out there?)

Given that part of the basement will form a terrace and support some weight is horizontal ICF recommended?

Nudura have just done two in Stroud, 3 storey bottom storey walk out, all cut into a shale bank. 
talk to Icf supplies in Essex. 
steve Burgess they supplied it. 
I went there to watch a pour being done. 

[woody2shoes]

On 20/02/2022 at 16:51, Clc136a said:

Also interested in building in ICF, walk out semi basement into clay bank, 3 units.

Considering Jakon, but struggling to find SEs or builders near Gloucester experienced (sure they're out there?)

Given that part of the basement will form a terrace and support some weight is horizontal ICF recommended?

 

I believe these guys based near Gloucester and use Jackon.

 

https://www.sandalcroftconstruction.co.uk/

 

Also Polysteel, Warmerwall are in Cheltenham

 

https://polysteel.co.uk/

 

I would be interested to see how you get on with them if you make contact.

[freshy]

19 hours ago, Indy said:

 

Undecided and the training course will help me figure out whether I can take on any elements of the work on a DIY basis. In all likelihood, its going to be done by a main contractor as I wouldn't have the time or expertise to take on the whole build.

You seem to be going down the same route as me. Then I realized that DIY was no longer an option for me. Like others have said visit sites and speak to the building contractors. They will have their own favorite or experiences..

 

Question, which way round should you proceed?

 

Choose an ICF first then a builder willing to use that ICF?

 

Or a builder first then decide on which ICF?

 

Edited February 22, 2022 by freshy

[ToughButterCup]

1 hour ago, freshy said:

...

which way round should you proceed?

Choose an ICF first then a builder willing to use that ICF?

Or a builder first then decide on which ICF?

 

Neither. A builder who builds using your choice of  ICF all the time. 

[Chanmenie]

2 hours ago, freshy said:

You seem to be going down the same route as me. Then I realized that DIY was no longer an option for me. Like others have said visit sites and speak to the building contractors. They will have their own favorite or experiences..

 

Question, which way round should you proceed?

 

Choose an ICF first then a builder willing to use that ICF?

 

Or a builder first then decide on which ICF?

 

 

Or ask the ICF companies if they can recommend a builder near you who has experience of their product 

[Budgie]

On 21/02/2022 at 15:33, Russell griffiths said:

Nudura have just done two in Stroud, 3 storey bottom storey walk out, all cut into a shale bank. 
talk to Icf supplies in Essex. 
steve Burgess they supplied it. 
I went there to watch a pour being done. 

There's a current Nudura build near Cricklade in Purton if you wanted to get up close and personal? Let me know and I'll arrange it for you. I've attached some pic's I took yesterday.                  Regards,

Steve

[Indy]

1 hour ago, Budgie said:

There's a current Nudura build near Cricklade in Purton if you wanted to get up close and personal? Let me know and I'll arrange it for you. I've attached some pic's I took yesterday.                  Regards,

Steve

If that offer is open to others, I would be quite keen to have a look at the build in action Steve. Let me know and I can send you a direct message.

 

I did also attend the Durisol training course at the NSBRC yesterday and one thing became really clear. While its really DIY friendly (much more so than the EPS type systems with reduced need for bracing), the language they were speaking versus what I understood means its beyond my ability to DIY any sort of system. I will be looking at getting a specialist builder to do this most likely.

[Budgie]

21 minutes ago, Indy said:

If that offer is open to others, I would be quite keen to have a look at the build in action Steve. Let me know and I can send you a direct message.

 

I did also attend the Durisol training course at the NSBRC yesterday and one thing became really clear. While its really DIY friendly (much more so than the EPS type systems with reduced need for bracing), the language they were speaking versus what I understood means its beyond my ability to DIY any sort of system. I will be looking at getting a specialist builder to do this most likely.

Absolutely Indy. DM me and I'll give you the details.

[Russell griffiths]

59 minutes ago, Indy said:

 

 

 While its really DIY friendly (much more so than the EPS type systems with reduced need for bracing), 

I’m baffled by people’s thoughts that finding a system that according to the bloke selling it requires less bracing, is a good thing. 

Having worked on 3 different icf builds this year, I can without hesitation say that with any icf system you want lots of bracing, to believe a rep and use minimum bracing will end in a world of pain, on one build the wall moved in the pour ending with a wall with a 25mm bulge in it. 

bracing is good, not something to avoid to save a few hundred quid. 

 

Go and look at that job And You won’t ever want to look at a durisol block again. 

Edited February 24, 2022 by Russell griffiths

[Nickfromwales]

On 20/02/2022 at 16:51, Clc136a said:

Also interested in building in ICF, walk out semi basement into clay bank, 3 units.

Considering Jakon, but struggling to find SEs or builders near Gloucester experienced (sure they're out there?)

Given that part of the basement will form a terrace and support some weight is horizontal ICF recommended?

@Bitpipe for one, used a stand alone basement contractor and then built a timber frame atop ( MBC Timberframe ). They're in Gloucestershire iirc. Options are available for 'mix n match'  

Edited February 24, 2022 by Nickfromwales

[JohnMo]

4 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

I’m baffled by people’s thoughts that finding a system that according to the bloke selling it requires less bracing, is a good thing. 

Having worked on 3 different icf builds this year, I can without hesitation say that with any icf system you want lots of bracing, to believe a rep and use minimum bracing will end in a world of pain, on one build the wall moved in the pour ending with a wall with a 25mm bulge in it. 

bracing is good, not something to avoid to save a few hundred quid. 

 

Go and look at that job And You won’t ever want to look at a durisol block again. 

Still don't understand the hate people seem to have for Durisol.  Other than 12mm OSB screwed (directly into the woodcrete) at corners, lintels and cut blocks, that's the only bracing you need.  No blow out on my build or two other I know about near me.  

 

Easy enough to do yourself, without a lorry load of bracing other systems seem to demand.

 

Durisol has been around for 70 to 80 years, tried tested and worked easily enough for me.

 

A downside is it's not airtight, so that's an extra job to do, but it is vapour open and can give a breathable building.

[Indy]

15 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

I’m baffled by people’s thoughts that finding a system that according to the bloke selling it requires less bracing, is a good thing. 

Having worked on 3 different icf builds this year, I can without hesitation say that with any icf system you want lots of bracing, to believe a rep and use minimum bracing will end in a world of pain, on one build the wall moved in the pour ending with a wall with a 25mm bulge in it. 

bracing is good, not something to avoid to save a few hundred quid. 

 

Go and look at that job And You won’t ever want to look at a durisol block again. 

 

Not an expert so I will take the salesman's word for it, at least to begin with. And then come to a forum full of experienced people to understand the best way forward. I'm still in research mode so not fully decided on a system but this was the first session I attended so have nothing else to compare it to.

 

One thing I did find was that airtightness would be an additional step, so looking at systems that somehow incorporate this to remove opportunities to get it wrong?

[BotusBuild]

17 hours ago, Indy said:

While its really DIY friendly (much more so than the EPS type systems with reduced need for bracing)

I have seen this argument before quite a few times. I think this is based on messaging from the woodcrete manufacturers (designed to "scare"). The question I always ask is, how do you get to the top of the wall to pour the concrete? Surely some scaffolding is required. So, OK, no bracing, but you've got to put scaffold up. Now read on....

 

I used Nudura (EPS) with the Nudura bracing - this bracing includes a platform level (you have to put scaffold planks on it of course). We did it DIY. The first floor took myself and my wife 5 days to put it all up ready to pour.

 

I'm not against woodcrete, it works for some, but personally I do find the "EPS needs bracing" to be a null argument.

 

Hope this helps