Tesla going in today !

[Pocster]

44 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

Yes, indeed............ but,

 

Lets all count how many problematic power cuts they've had in the last 5+ years, well, any type of power cut for that matter? Percentage wise, it's a micro-figure.

Just about every offering is AC coupled / retro-fit and only some are incrementally up-scalable in sensible increments ( 2.4kW hikes ) to match the system accordingly to your ACTUAL needs.

The Tesla is a one-size-fits-all solution, yes, you can bolt another on, rolled out for a nation of T-fans with a simple sales ethos of 'copy / cut / paste / repeat' and at 13.5kWh for the V2 you will need a serious amount of excess PV to warrant its purchase. If that has not had its fill then of course it will gulp grid electricity to maintain its condition / happy minimum dormant state ( and it's been well discussed that using the grid to charge a battery, with a limited lifespan, is not economical. It CAN be done, and certainly gets mentioned by my clients during discussions about storage options, but the maths just don't work out as you'd ( simply ) be better off strategically buying power direct from the grid instead.

A 15% loss of overall efficiency is the first gotcha, just with the additional conversions from DC to AC and back again, but the sheer size of the V2 is the biggest design gotcha where you must be able to demonstrate a large amount of PV is routinely available to mop up with such a big battery. Limited throughput is the final nail in that coffin for me, because if you end up routinely using the grid to condition the battery you then start to chew into its life expectancy. Read the small=print  

Add to that the fact you can only charge and discharge that whopper at a factory-governed rate**, then it's like having a giant set of lungs but a drinking straw for a windpipe  

 

Can the Tesla be successfully deployed in a residential setting? Yes. Does it require a lot of thought and for you to do the sums first? Yes. Do people just LOVE the Tesla and don't really care about any of the above? Yes, and double-yes.

 

Disclaimer: @pocster, this is not a dig so therefore this sentence stops you from giving me a ear-bashing  

 

SolarWatt are nearly unique in the way they work. DC coupled for starters, and scalable ( like Pylon-tech and a few other Chinese / budget offerings ) in 2.4kW increments, but the party-piece is the decider for me. 

During times of no excess PV availability the SW battery is warrantied to simply drop to its hibernate level and do just that....hibernate. No need for it to randomly steal from the grid to fill its boots,  so about as efficient ( and simple ) as it gets. Also then very easy to understand its expected efficiency as grid load-shifting ( the correct / most strategic employment of ) eg when it becomes a necessity over the 'winter period' when PV is at 25% or less of it's stated output ) is not in the equation. ( The EPS function is on its way BTW!!  ). Add to that a very clever BMS and a multi-scalable format ( you can add more command units as well as more batteries **which will double or treble the charge and discharge rates and it's win win AFAIC.

 

I certainly wouldn't forgo those qualities and sheer robustness / elevated efficiencies to get an EPS I'm likely to never / rarely use.......bearing in mind that you have to be in the house at the exact time of the power cut to manually swap the EPS selected circuits over ( unless you further invest and pay to install Tesla's autonomous EPS changeover doo-daa ( aka expensive must-have ornament )) which has a 5+ second delay before kicking in...... 

 

There is a better way, but the DC has one Achilles heel ( thank f.u*k for that says @pocster ) which is it is not really suitable for retro-fit and needs to be included early on in the M&E design.

 

End transmission.

I think the solar watt is complete sh*t ?

Bet you have an Android phone aswell ! ?

[Pocster]

Yesterday’s figures .

 

Solar today will be tricky - currently 0 ?

[Thorfun]

50 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

Yes, indeed............ but,

 

Lets all count how many problematic power cuts they've had in the last 5+ years, well, any type of power cut for that matter? Percentage wise, it's a micro-figure.

Just about every offering is AC coupled / retro-fit and only some are incrementally up-scalable in sensible increments ( 2.4kW hikes ) to match the system accordingly to your ACTUAL needs.

 

 

we've had 2 in the last 2 days. they weren't very long but enough to fully piss me off and have to go around a reset all the clocks, heating timer, reboot all my electronics etc. if SolarWatt bring this feature in by the time I'm ready to implement, e.g. the next 3-6 months, then I'll consider it. otherwise it's Tesla all the way for me. I guess I'm a bit of a fanboy at heart.

[Nickfromwales]

26 minutes ago, pocster said:

I think the solar watt is complete sh*t ?

Bet you have an Android phone aswell ! ?

I f******g love you ? 

Edited October 21, 2020 by Nickfromwales
Sent off my new iPhone 11 ✌️

[Nickfromwales]

16 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

 

we've had 2 in the last 2 days. they weren't very long but enough to fully piss me off and have to go around a reset all the clocks, heating timer, reboot all my electronics etc. if SolarWatt bring this feature in by the time I'm ready to implement, e.g. the next 3-6 months, then I'll consider it. otherwise it's Tesla all the way for me. I guess I'm a bit of a fanboy at heart.

Tesla’s offering won’t alleviate shit. You’ll still lose everything and still go around resetting everything as there is a huge delay in bringing the power online through their ( additional cost ) changeover effort. ?

 

Beware the web of sin, and don’t fall in   

Edited October 21, 2020 by Nickfromwales
Forgot how to spell lose. Ffs.

[Pocster]

This is a thread about a purchased Tesla - not whether it’s fiscally viable or better / worse than ‘x’.

 

[Thorfun]

8 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

Tesla’s offering won’t alleviate shit. You’ll still lose everything and still go around resetting everything as there is a huge delay in bringing the power online through their ( additional cost ) changeover effort. ?

 

Beware the web of sin, and don’t fall in   

that's not what the installer told me. he said the lights didn't even flicker when it changed over from a power cut.

 

I've been meaning to get a new battery for my UPS for ages but I'm just a bit lazy sometimes.....

[Nickfromwales]

27 minutes ago, pocster said:

This is a thread about a purchased Tesla - not whether it’s fiscally viable or better / worse than ‘x’.

 

I already added my disclaimer so you’re stuffed. 
The only thing getting locked will be the bathroom doors, with you on the inside, when SWMBO asks why your softly stroking your new battery instead of grouting. 
It’s ok to leave it for 5, it’ll still be there.....

 

BUT, I would appreciate if you could throw some feedback on what it’s doing if poss please. ?

[Nickfromwales]

3 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

that's not what the installer told me. he said the lights didn't even flicker when it changed over from a power cut.

 

I've been meaning to get a new battery for my UPS for ages but I'm just a bit lazy sometimes.....

If you EPS a single circuit? Or the whole house? 
YouTube Fully charged vid says and shows different. 
Ask more questions. 
 

UPS and EPS are two different things and not any supplier out there allowed to do differently as it’s legislation ( from what I got told by the manufacturer and a couple of quote prestige installers whom I’m in regular contact with ). 
I could be wrong, or misinformed so will confirm in a planned call later today. ?

Edited October 21, 2020 by Nickfromwales

[Thorfun]

4 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

If you EPS a single circuit? Or the whole house? 
YouTube Fully charged vid says and shows different. 
Ask more questions. 

I watched that fully charged YouTube vid (assuming we're talking about the same one where Kryten get's his PW2 installed) and he did go on to state that the change over should've been a lot quicker than that. I will have a UPS for my mission critical stuff and things with HDDs so as to protect them.

 

And don't forget that when the zombie apocalypse arrives and the main grid goes down myself and @pocster will be the ones with electricity still running while everyone else is cowering in the dark.

 

ps. don't know the answer to the EPS single circuit or whole house. electrics baffle me.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Thorfun

[Nickfromwales]

8 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

And don't forget that when the zombie apocalypse arrives and the main grid goes down myself and @pocster will be the ones with electricity still running while everyone else is cowering in the dark.

And that’s how the zombies will find and eat you before me ?

[Thorfun]

1 minute ago, Nickfromwales said:

And that’s how the zombies will find and eat you before me ?

assuming they get past the automatic defence systems that is (powered by my Powerwall 2 of course)

[SteamyTea]

FFS is it 1985 with all this talk about resetting clocks, timers and 'electrical' goods.

 

[Thorfun]

1 minute ago, SteamyTea said:

FFS is it 1985 with all this talk about resetting clocks, timers and 'electrical' goods.

 

feels like it sometimes

[joe90]

The good thing about being a Luddite like me is if we have a power cut I get to read a good book by my rechargeable work lamp and listen to my rechargeable work radio sat in front of my wood burning stove,  the only thing that needs resetting is the clock on the range cooker. (And my android mobile phone still works ?).

[ProDave]

1 hour ago, pocster said:

This is a thread about a purchased Tesla - not whether it’s fiscally viable or better / worse than ‘x’.

 

But the savings Vs cost is important.  I have never doubted it will save you money.  My question is simply will it save enough money to justify the capital cost and and over what time.

 

If you are going to remove that from the discussion then it will just be a thread about how wonderful battery storage is.

[Pocster]

Very very overcast and rainy . But still just covering my admittedly very low lecky usage 

[Pocster]

1 minute ago, ProDave said:

But the savings Vs cost is important.  I have never doubted it will save you money.  My question is simply will it save enough money to justify the capital cost and and over what time.

 

If you are going to remove that from the discussion then it will just be a thread about how wonderful battery storage is.

Because I can’t answer that question .

What Will lecky cost in 5 years ?

Once I add an EV ( everyone seems to ignore the cost of purchase because it’s a CAR ) - then there’s even more benefit .

Once I swap to agile more benefit again .

The true answer will be in 10 years time . As I said even if I break even by then my carbon footprint would of been reduced for a decade . My gut feeling based on others whom have had a pw for longer is that I’ll reach break even before 10 years .

Just like building a house ; I’ll take the plunge and evaluate later if it was worth it . The destination is always the journey .

[Onoff]

3 minutes ago, pocster said:

I’ll take the plunge

 

Poor choice of words with a leaky underground house! ?

[Thorfun]

2 minutes ago, ProDave said:

But the savings Vs cost is important. 

 

it's important to some but not so important to others.

 

for me on some things it's not important at all but on other things it is. e.g. we're having RWH which will never repay itself in a 100s of years at the current cost of mains water but we want to reduce our use of mains water so those that need the mains water more than us have it available to them.

 

and some people just like new toys and tech to play with! I'm one of those and I get the feeling that @pocster is as well.

 

obviously, budgets play a major consideration and some don't like to frivolously throw money away on things. personally, I want to enjoy my life while I can. having seen my brother suffer from heart attack and stroke at 45, my father pass away 3 years after being diagnosed with MND at 73 and my mother taking a massive downturn in her health due to heart failure at 76 I'm now thinking that life it too damn short to worry about stuff like ROI or payback period etc. As long as my kids have an education (and a habitable planet to live on!) and I can leave enough equity in my estate to help them when I finally go I'm all for enjoying it all now!

 

I guess I'm very fortunate to be in the position financially to allow me to do this and others aren't and I get that.

 

horses for courses and all that, right?

[Pocster]

12 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

 

it's important to some but not so important to others.

 

for me on some things it's not important at all but on other things it is. e.g. we're having RWH which will never repay itself in a 100s of years at the current cost of mains water but we want to reduce our use of mains water so those that need the mains water more than us have it available to them.

 

and some people just like new toys and tech to play with! I'm one of those and I get the feeling that @pocster is as well.

 

obviously, budgets play a major consideration and some don't like to frivolously throw money away on things. personally, I want to enjoy my life while I can. having seen my brother suffer from heart attack and stroke at 45, my father pass away 3 years after being diagnosed with MND at 73 and my mother taking a massive downturn in her health due to heart failure at 76 I'm now thinking that life it too damn short to worry about stuff like ROI or payback period etc. As long as my kids have an education (and a habitable planet to live on!) and I can leave enough equity in my estate to help them when I finally go I'm all for enjoying it all now!

 

I guess I'm very fortunate to be in the position financially to allow me to do this and others aren't and I get that.

 

horses for courses and all that, right?

Now we’re talking bruv’

 

I think from the “others” it’s been established it’s not worth it fiscally at least in the short term .

I equally was going to have RWH - but as you say payback would be 1 billion years . I actually wanted to produce my own drinkable water from rainwater , but again it just isn’t viable . Looked at pellet boilers for years - before I even began my build . Don’t mind the high initial costs ; but storing pellets is problematic and they just track the price of gas . I want *some* lecky that is free be it pv , wind turbine or my own nuclear power generator ( I’d love one of them - especially when it goes wrong ).

Some of us lead . That means mistakes and bad choices will be made . But we pave the way for you lesser mortals to follow .

 

”This is the way” as the Mandalorian would say .

 

You people are standing on the shoulders of giants ( no emoji exists to demonstrate my complete smugness ) 

Edited October 21, 2020 by pocster
Elon musk told me too

[ProDave]

f you have an EV and are either retired or work from home, then that makes the case even less compelling for battery storage, because by charging the car in the daytime you will pretty much guarantee 100% self usage of your solar PV generation.

 

If you are out at work all day then the battery storage may enable you to charge the car a bit in the evening from your free solar PV power.

[Thorfun]

5 minutes ago, ProDave said:

f you have an EV and are either retired or work from home, then that makes the case even less compelling for battery storage, because by charging the car in the daytime you will pretty much guarantee 100% self usage of your solar PV generation.

 

If you are out at work all day then the battery storage may enable you to charge the car a bit in the evening from your free solar PV power.

for me the battery is for usage at night. so I can power all the TVs, music players, lights, heating, DHW etc when the sun has gone down. then the next day use the excess PV to charge the battery up and do it all over again. 

 

I'm aware this won't work in the winter due to the lack of sun but, in my mind, this is perfect for what I want during the summer months. 

[Onoff]

 

12 minutes ago, pocster said:

That means mistakes and bad choices will be made.

 

The mistakes and bad choices I could make with money!

[Pocster]

7 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

for me the battery is for usage at night. so I can power all the TVs, music players, lights, heating, DHW etc when the sun has gone down. then the next day use the excess PV to charge the battery up and do it all over again. 

 

I'm aware this won't work in the winter due to the lack of sun but, in my mind, this is perfect for what I want during the summer months. 

Exactly my intended use for PV , charge the battery for night use .

Hence agile especially for in winter and lack of PV to charge that battery ( and car ) cheap