Can someone recommend any do-it yourself design software?

[Grendel]

Can someone recommend any do-it yourself design software?

[Barney12]

If you want something free then you can't go far wrong with Sketchup. It's a bit of an initial learning curve but once you've grasped the basics it's very intuitive. There is a huge resource of training guides online. YouTube being the first stop.

 

In the past I've also used Cheif Architect which is a bit American centric but the DIY versions are easy enough to use.

 

HTH

[Russdl]

I'd vouch for Sketchup as well. As Barney says it's a bit of a struggle to start with but gets easier and easier. 

 

I've been faffing with it for a while and now have a 3D model, geo-located in Google Earth, accurate sun/shadow positions and all surrounding properties modelled. I'm far from being any kind of expert but I've found it invaluable to see what works and what does't.  I've also managed to get some fairly reasonable 2D plans and photo realistic(ish) visualisations all from the same 3D Sketchup model.

 

I'll be posting some Sketchup images on here in a day or two to get feedback regarding my plans.

 

[Crofter]

Another vote for Sketchup. It's time well spent to look up a few basic tutorials as well. I keep finding new ways of doing things easier and faster than before.

The one starter tip I would give is to never free draw. Always work on one of the three colour coded axes and always type in the line length that you want. The problems in Sketchup happen when two points (e.g. end of a line, corner of a shape etc) are in virtually, but not quite, the same place.

 

I found it quite addictive once I got going.

 

We had a wee chat about sketchup here

[ToughButterCup]

Ditto. There are loads of videos to help you

[PeterW]

I've used draftsight and you can also use a new 3D site that Dassault have made available at  home.by.me

 

Tend to use Visio now as I don't do much by way of CAD 

 

Edited September 4, 2016 by PeterW
Hit post too quickly ..!

[MarkH]

Everyone recommends and gets on with Sketchup, except me; Sketchup makes me want to smash my laptop over my own head. I'm quite computer literate - have used photoshop professionally, am not too bad with FCP - but for some reason Sketchup won't happen.

 

We've used Live Interior 3D Pro, it's somewhat basic but has done the job.

 

 

[Stones]

I used Sketchup to draw up a scaled floorplan and do some indicative 2D elevations and a 3D version of our current build, which I was able to take and show my planning officer during pre-application discussions.  The 3D images I produced proved very helpful in illustrating our ideas and in letting us assess whether we were happy with the design.

[Mackers]

I'm another for SketchUp. I use make at home and professional in work. It's the best software available and i use IES and Revit day in day out too. It's very very easy to use. Try it.

[IanR]

Diverted discussion from:

To avoid that thread going further off topic.

 

By Sensus, 11 hours ago

Perhaps you can recommend one?

 

 

Alias AutoStudio (now owned by Autodesk), previously Alias StudioTools.

 

 

By Sensus, 11 hours ago

Forgive the question, but do you have much design and/or CAD experience (and if so, with what packages)?

 

 

Yes, and Yes. Although "design" means different things to people of different industries. To be clear I have not worked professionally as an Automotive Stylist, but I have 30 years Automotive design and project engineering experience, and a few years here and there in other industries, ie. aerospace, industrial design, product design.

 

With regards to CAD Packages, I use (or have previously used) the following professionally:

 

Catia V5 

Catia V6 - early days, only done about 1000 hours in anger.

UGS NX I-DEAS  (now Siemens NX, was previously SDCR I-DEAS)

Alias StudioTools (not current, last used StudioTools 13.0) 

3D Studio Max

ICEM Surf (not current, last used 4.0.2) now owned by Dassault 

Imageware Surfacer

Catia V4

CADDS 5

CADDS 4x

PDGS

 

[IanR]

 

19 minutes ago, Sensus said:

Alias Autostudio is not much use for architectural design, of course, but looks like it might be a worthwhile alternative to Rhino3D for surface modelling (which is what we tend to use for surface modelling in a more generalist design environment) in a specifically automotive context.

 

No no no. If you say you understand Rhino, then you are not understanding Alias if you think there is an equivalence. While Rhino is OKish at it price point, it would have no place in an Automotive workflow.

 

I agree Alias is not suitable for Architecture. Taking you back to the start of this discussion, you blamed CAD for creating what you felt were rectilinear layouts in Architecture. All I said was "don't blame CAD", it's the construction industry that has chosen to invest their money buying software optimised for modelling boxes, so that is exactly what it has got. Other industries have invested in software with a different skill set.

 

There is nothing else I can bring to this discussion, you have your view and are sticking with it, as is your prerogative. I'm signing out.

[Gimp]

On 9/3/2016 at 21:58, Grendel said:

Can someone recommend any do-it yourself design software?

Depends what you have in mind. If its speed you need than Revit will be the way to go - it models components such as walls, floors, furniture, etc automatically so will save you loads off time over using 2D and even modelling these components up yourself in 3D modeling packages.

 

I have come across many Architects that have been way too slow in moving with the times and technology and still working with AutoCAD to their detriment. One office I've come across was always playing 'catch up' as they had so much work on and were struggling to keep up as they were essentially doing everything manually on AutoCAD (very labour intensive, their idea was to keep recruiting more staff trained in AutoCAD ) they never had the time to learn & move across to Revit. They had bought the Revit package which essentially automates within it many of the repetitive tasks of 2D CAD such as AutoCAD (ok you can use AutoCAD as a 3D modeler but few people do as there are better 3D modeler programs out there). They never really understood that the Revit software package would take away their pile of work problems and make life easier by updating the plans and sections as changes were made and eliminating a lot of problems associated with working in 2D in CAD.

 

Another practice I cam into contact with had also bought Revit but I could tell were stuck on AutoCAD by tradition and were very unlikely to change over (they needed it as many commercial & government contracts now demand the use of BIM (Building Information Modelling) enabled software such as Revit so engineers etc can all work on the same model & edit as required). So they could show these contractors/clients they had it (but did not use it) to gain the contract, after they gained it? who knows. They were so ingrained in the workflow that they had been used to with AutoCAD over the years, which was tedious at best, but they seemed to be so engrossed in the tedium that they had become brainwashed into thinking there was really any better way. The were all clocking on to their fifties, but I have seen people their age & older more accepting of software development and as in the first case ones younger that were ignorant of it also. In this case they failed to realize that much of the fault occurrence/finding that happens especially in 2D CAD (also but less so with 3D CAD modelers) doesn't happens so much with Revit, i.e doors misplaced in one set of drawings to another, hatching wrong or accidentally left out. All of these minor flaws that tend to occur over the course of a project as the design changes all add up to a lot of time to rectify.

 

The point being is that if you are new to CAD (or fairly new) then I would highly recommend Revit, there are plenty of online tutorials on you tube & lynda.com and elsewhere but its pretty straight forward once you learn the basics and it will stop you from making errors & produce drawings that are in most cases instantly suitable for sending to planning. You won't be inadvertently making lots of little mistakes that might prove costly on site, Revit tends to flag up or even stop you from continuing these errors. Revit will also produce a specification & quantity list without you having to do this separately and remove margin for error a lot here - another time consuming process it automates, wave goodbye to Excel

 

Revit is by no means perfect, it could do a lot more and user interface though mostly good could be made smoother still, but its the best for those new to CAD without much technical training in construction & its good for those with a heavy workload (or expecting one). It would be my choice if I was designing a lot for clients where I was just looking at the profit made per effort input and the time saving efficiencies - some clients want the work done ASAP or specify a short tender period.

 

That said, if I was designing a very bespoke building, as I have just done for myself I would use Rhino 3D all the way, it's great for planning out in 2D then extruding the 2D plans to 3D which help show how the design works or does not, any c*ck ups with walls being where you should have put an opening, etc. Its also great for producing a more 'designed' building as opposed to a generic building you nearly always get in Revit - a box, modern or pitched roof is fine if that is all you want and I  don't mean that in the derogatory sense, its practical and often makes sense. If you want something a bit more original then Rhino is the way to go, but I think that design training/knowledge is essential here otherwise you are wasting your efforts and would be better of with a generic design produced in Revit. Rhino will take you longer than Rivet, much longer, but is still quicker than AutoCAD depending on the amount of detail you wish to go into. Sure a basic floor plan & elevation can be drawn up in AutoCAD, but the same can be done in Rhino from Plan view and Rhino has a much smoother user interface I think that aids accuracy.

 

So there we have it, other alternatives are available - 3D Studio Max is much like Rhino if you prefer it. Catia I know some use but tends to be more engineering types, Sketchup tends to lack accuracy, its more basic modelling but some still use it and I think some improvements have been made to it. AutoCAD I would personally stay clear off its day is done even if many Architects don't realize it/accept it. ArchiCAD is very similar to Revit, but I think Revit has a more direct user interface so preferable. Other modelling programs exist but to be honest are more for other industries such as product design & engineering so would stay clear, i.e Solidworks or basic modellers such as Blender unless you take a preference to them for some quirky reason and other less well known software aimed at architecture exists, but is not wide spread in use in the architecture industry. So if I were you I would go with Revit, otherwise if just doing basic plans odds are you'll end up paying for someone else to do further work on them.

 

  

Edited September 29, 2016 by Gimp

[IanR]

Do you mean Revit?

[Gimp]

On 9/24/2016 at 23:23, Sensus said:

 

It's 'Revit', not 'Rivit', in case anyone goes off and hits Google and comes back with lots of pictures of frogs.

 

The big practical problem with Revit is simply cost - it's quite a pricey piece of software for amateur users, or small architectural practices. The secondary problem is that there is an 'overhead' involved in giving it the extra information it needs to create a full BIM model, which on simple buildings like houses is very difficult to justify in terms of commercial efficiency, so you end up never using it to its full efficiency.

 

For working on large and complex buildings, and if budget is not an issue to you, then I wouldn't hesitate to agree with the middle comment I've quoted.

 

But even with effectively unlimited budgets, the UK's major housebuilders have largely voted with their feet and stayed with AutoCAD for the time being, as they currently don't seem to believe that Revit offers sufficient advantages to outweigh the additional overhead it imposes on design resource, when it's used for simple houses.

 

 

 

Sketchup, like all CAD programs, is accurate to better than millimetric precision... far more accurate than it's possible to actually build.

 

Its limitation, at present, is that it's not terribly good for traditional 2D drawings, particularly when you get into detailing, with hatching and call-outs and that sort of thing (and even when you use the 'Pro' version, which comes with an additional package that bolts on some additional functionality in these respects).

 

Yep, Revit was what I meant. Well you can get Revit LT now for £45 a month on subscription (LT suite £65 a month). Think just one month should be enough, maybe two with learning (although you can get a free trial), but OP would have to ensure it's all done & printed out, preferably dwg files taken as back up before subscription runs out or it would be paying for another £45 at a later date. It is a shame though that they seem to have gotten rid of their perpetual licenses would put more people off and look for alternatives I think.

 

Sketchup, yes that is what I meant to say, its user interface is not really geared to detailing which is what I meant by accuracy.

 

I've come across house builders that still use AutoCAD, its a pain, I generally try to avoid working for practices that use this software now and have removed any reference to it on my CV to avoid being contacted by those seeking AutoCAD skills, it's just so dire to work with, awkward user interface, not smooth, oddities and really is the height of tedium. I much prefer to work in Rhino in 2D, far better user interface, smoother, quicker & a reasonable priced perpetual license for ever more

 

I just see the architecture & house-building industry lack of will to move on as a major detriment, just like how we lost out in are automobile industry back in the day by not keeping at the cutting edge of technology. Up to date CAD programs can really improve work efficiency and hence save on many costs. I mean AutoCAD goes back to the early eighties, its crazy its still being used. 

 

Just looked up AutoCAD also now only on license it looks, shockingly £180 a month for full version, £48 for LT version, even more than Revit! Get Rhino, can do the same as AutoCAD, cheaper & better.

[Ferdinand]

Agree with Sensus' last comments.

 

I think that if you give one lot of people tools that do a lot more, the limitation on what happens will be set by how much time they have available rather than that is sensible to be done.

 

The RIBA or CIOB or whoever will recommend new practices that require the extra capability to be used to the max, which will create more work for everyone else driven by the new tool.

 

I would suggest that if you find a tool that doubles productivity you probably need to halve the workforce to stop the amount of work to be doubled too !!

 

(being a little anti-Panglossian for a moment).

 

It requires judgement AND self-discipline from decision makers, and a willingness to limit their own influence.

 

Ferdinand

[Gimp]

8 hours ago, Sensus said:

 

 I don't know - I really don't!

There's a tendency for the the theoretical advantages in efficiency to absorbed in extra time spent on presentational 'fluff' that's superficial and of no real value. CAD monkeys and design geeks get all excited about the extra functionality... business managers less so.

 

I personally agree with you that BIM and products like Revit are the way forward, if used wisely, but the fact is that the UK housebuilding industry has looked long and hard at it (I know, because I was involved myself at a senior level), and thus far doesn't agree with us in the purely commercial terms that are all that are important to them.

 

The other programs (Rhino, Archicad, etc.) are all very well, but the blunt issue is that they're not the Industry Standard, so no matter how horrible AutoCAD is (and it is, in terms of user interface), we're stuck with it until Revit gains full dominance... and then we're stuck with Revit.

 

Glad you agree that AutoCAD has an awful user interface  I can't believe that it has maintained market dominance for so long with such a problem which I see as down to their allowing students to use it for free & gaining a monopoly position in the marketplace. It should be a case that it was Industry Standard as its well over thirty years old now but because so many refuse to move on it somewhat still is sometimes in tandem with Revit.

 

I guess there is Vectorworks, now that it has developed to Revit like capabilities and perhaps beyond as another BIM capable program. Seems that perpetual licenses are still available but its costly, particularly if OP is just doing a one off or occasional build.

 

I think the only advantage of Autodesk going for 'rental' licenses is that they are quite probably messing up the market dominance they have gained and their competitors will be able to exploit those that don't want to rent or move to renting from their last perceptual licence they have with Rivet, AutoCAD, etc. I personally can't stand it when companies go for rental licenses it just smacks of greed and arrogance that they believe we should be all held to random on their products. I still use my old student version of photoshop which is perpetual rather than use an updated rental version.

 

I think that in terms of workload you are somewhat right, I love all that fluff  that taking on Revit rarely equates to laying off staff as might be initially thought as there is often other stuff to do. I do think though it can avoid taking more staff on, feeling overworked, awkward process and having attention on other matter diverted as can happen with AutoCAD. Staff morale also seems better with Revit type of programs as its smoother to work with and takes away a lot of their daily problems they have to deal with with AutoCAD.

 

I'm personally a big fan of Rhino, its got some great add ons and with Autodesk risking their market dominance I can see it coming back into favour more as it was say five years or so ago. Plus the new version 6 when it comes out could deliver good stuff if it improves upon Rhino like version 5 did.

 

[Onoff]

I use AutoCAD (2010) simply because I trained on AutoCAD & I use it for everything.

 

When I found Draftsight I was using within about 30 seconds thinking I'd found a clone albeit a 2D one. It felt very like the simpler circa AutoCAD 2000 I trained on.

 

I then found you could do some limited pseudo 3D stuff in Draftsight. I once started a drawing in Drafsight on a laptop, on site and saved the drawing to Dropbox. Got home and fired up AutoCAD. Straight away got a message saying the drawing hadn't been created in AutoCAD (annoying) but it opened OK. I then tried to extrude some of the shapes I'd done the basic outlines of in Draftsight and AutoCAD wouldn't allow/recognise them (very annoying).

 

So now I stick with AutoCAD except for the odd fag packet sketch or DXF for cutting a plate here and there. Anything long term I want to add to and 3D then AutoCAD.