New Build Oxfordshire

[bigreadie]

Hi,

 

My wife and I are embarking on a self build in Faringdon, Oxon.  We have managed to buy our plot outright and hope to start building May/June this year. 

 

Having major issue with the mortgage and our broker who is literally no help at all.  They told us we had been agreed in principle back in Sept and it now turns out that was not the case and we are still in the application phase.  We wouldn't have completed on the land if that was the case!!  they have now also said we need to build a 20% contingency in to all the figures we submit to the mortgage company meaning we have to budget our build to around £165k which seems impossible.  If anyone has any advice on how to fill out a schedule of cost it would be much appreciated!!

 

Coupled to that our initial budget seems way off for pretty much everything we have planned.  All of the online resources and  books we have read say you can build for £1500 m2 and so far out of a budget we have been quoted £50-56k for the foundations and £54k for the SIPS of a £21000 build (140m2 floor plate for a bungalow).  There are no issues with the ground or access and if this is the case then it look like we will fall at the first hurdle of the build.

 

The groundwork's are a particular concern as every contractor we speak to is maxed out due to the development going on in the area and I think this is what is driving the costs up...any idea's?

 

thanks

 

BigReadie

 

 

 

 

 

[Oz07]

Are you confident enough to employ subcontractors and move away from overheads and profit margins of groundwork companies

[Russell griffiths]

Those prices look ridiculous, I would do more research, a number of members on here have gone for a foundation and frame as a package. 

I remember a topic on here recently about insulated slabs and I believe the figures being chucked about where £120 per m so that should have your slab done for £17000 as long as no funny ground conditions 

 

for what it’s worth my footprint is double yours and my foundations up to finished floor came in at under £40000, that included piling and a very substantial ringbeam due to very poor ground. 

 

I would like to think at 140m you should get a foundation and frame package with a roof on it for £100,000 easily. 

 

My personal opinion I would look at something better than sips panels. 

[bigreadie]

Thanks Oz07.

 

We are looking at PM'ing ourselves and are happy to do the subby route.  However we have had little success it getting quotes back from them at present.  i think it is a case of persevering...

 

Thanks Russell...your comments echo our initial thoughts ref the cost of foundations...our initial budget was £24k, which included a contingency!!  We are also getting quotes for Brick and Block and ICF which will hopefully come in cheaper as well.  I see your in Glos...do you know if your groundworker covers west Oxfordshire!!!

[vivienz]

Do you know what your ground is like?  It would be worth finding out for sure just what you are building on before committing to a particular route.  For example, my site is clay and the foundations and piles weren't too bad on costs, but the price of all the muckaway has been enormous.  Better to know at the outset.

[Ferdinand]

@bigreadie

 

Welcome. 

 

Well done on the plot - they seem thin on the ground in Oxfordshire. 

 

I would make 2 points not covered yet:

 

1 - Take the time it takes, and don't regret doing so. There may also be opportunities with Brexit about to happen, or us staying in mid-air. The climate is unstable, and contractors may find their order books changing. 

2 - There are various direct routes eg some building societies do self-build mortgages (eg Ecology, Melton, Ipswich iirc for three). Have a skim through this section of the forum:

https://forum.buildhub.org.uk/forum/112-self-build-mortgages/

 

Ferdinand

 

 

 

 

[ProDave]

Hi and welcome.

 

Oxfordshire is where I come from, but I never realised my self build dream there, land was simply too expensive, we had to move to the Highlands to do that.

 

If your build is 140 square metres and your budget £165K then you have a problem.  If you project manage and do a lot of the work yourself, you might get down to £100 per square metre, but even at your estimate of £1500 per sq m that's £210K

 

I don't know the ground conditions where you are but if it is good and you can do simple strip foundations then as a comparison it cost us £10K to get our foundations done.

 

[ToughButterCup]

1 hour ago, bigreadie said:

[...]

we have been quoted £50-56k for the foundations and £54k for the SIPS of a £21000 build (140m2 floor plate for a bungalow).  There are no issues with the ground or access 

[...]

 

Take  heart.

We needed piles for our build - and initial quotes came in between £22,000 and £17,000  - which, as you say, would have made  us fall at the first hurdle too.

 

Persistence is key.

6 months research got the piling job done for £6500. Its just a matter of stickability. ....

So you have a limited budget. What's new?  Every Man Jack One of us on here has exactly the same problem.

 

Change the parameters of your build and make it happen for £165k. It'll be hard, but not impossible. You will get loads of help, sympathy and financial advice here. Loads of it. 

 

Oh, and bad jokes from @Onoff

 

[Ferdinand]

2 hours ago, bigreadie said:

Coupled to that our initial budget seems way off for pretty much everything we have planned.  All of the online resources and  books we have read say you can build for £1500 m2 and so far out of a budget we have been quoted £50-56k for the foundations and £54k for the SIPS of a £21000 build (140m2 floor plate for a bungalow).  There are no issues with the ground or access and if this is the case then it look like we will fall at the first hurdle of the build.

 

2 hours ago, bigreadie said:

We wouldn't have completed on the land if that was the case!!  they have now also said we need to build a 20% contingency in to all the figures we submit to the mortgage company meaning we have to budget our build to around £165k which seems impossible.  If anyone has any advice on how to fill out a schedule of cost it would be much appreciated!!

 

51 minutes ago, ProDave said:

If your build is 140 square metres and your budget £165K then you have a problem.  If you project manage and do a lot of the work yourself, you might get down to £100 per square metre, but even at your estimate of £1500 per sq m that's £210K

 

I don't see how all these numbers mutually-reconcile, even before we start trying to decide whether they are possible or not, and what is necessary in order to make them possible - eg between employing subbies and doing the PM yourselves, or whether you have to get your dungarees on and start doing some of the labouring yourselves.

 

I think a copy of SPONS  would be a worthwhile purchase - one thing you need now is a good head-feel for what you can buy with how much, and what you can save by contributing yourself or calling in every favour you have ever been owed.

 

My take:

 

• I think £1500 per sqm in Oxon is a low cost if you are doing a self-build without doing significant work yourself. Others may clarify.
• All costs are ballpark. As you go through your build it just gets to be a smaller ballpark. That's trite - but it says do not commit to so many specifics in advance (eg pre-buying a 5k cooker) that you cannot cover possible variance in the later stages. Sufficient thought experiments are worth their weight in gold.
• My general opinion is that on average it should be possible to save 20-25% over initial costings without compromising cost or quality too much, or by finding an alternative item or strategy that will be acceptable. Obvs that is a general rule, but set you target high.
• 15-20% is what your minimum self-build contingency should be anyway. That can be reduced progressively in amount if not in precentage, as finish costs are more predictable than "what's under this soil" costs, but most people will have lots of gold plating they will want to spend it on anyway.
• Work through some of the thorough cost saving examples that have been done here. One or two people have threads with real detail. You need to know where you stand, and how you will get it to move-in point even if it goes 20% over and you have a shell which still has concrete floors, and only one sink on a batten. Here is @Visti's thread where he did that for his build at Gravenhill.

Ferdinand

Edited February 10, 2019 by Ferdinand

[Russell griffiths]

Hi @bigreadie I’m afraid I did all my Groundworks myself, however we did use a piling contractor 

SEVERN BORE PILING who I can highly recommend if that is what you end up doing. 

 

If you give us an indication of how much you can successfully do yourselves, and a brief idea of what you want to build and the level of finish

i think there are a number on here who could give a good ball park figure for what it is going to cost you. 

 

 

[Onoff]

1 hour ago, recoveringacademic said:

Oh, and bad jokes from @Onoff

 

 

Yep, I've piles of 'em...

 

 

[Visti]

Welcome to the forum! And congrats on buying the land in Faringdon! Love that village with the folly tower. Has a great with cafe too that serves the best croquetten this side of the channel.

 

As Ferdinand linked, we're doing a self build up in north Oxon near Bicester. It's costly here, no doubt about it. We're looking at £1875/m2 in terms of build cost including the foundation. I rose several times since that post mainly due to Brexit related price increases and a very protracted preliminary stage, blowing our 10% contingency twice. That's £345k across 184m2 (detached, 5 bed, two stories), a whole £200m2 cheaper than originally indicated by the quantity surveyor.

 

That is probably the most realistic cost for a self managed build with some DIY in our area. It is entirely possible to go lower with more time and DIY, but for this part of the country it will just be naturally expensive for anything not done yourself. 

 

I highly recommend a materials first approach: spend money on the fabric of the house and not the kitchen and fittings. Those can easily east up a budget and don't really add much IMO. You can always upgrade them later!

 

 

 

[Weebles]

Hi, there are a few of us in Oxfordshire on this forum. We are in Henley and about half way through our build. We employed a man with a digger for our Groundworks and he did what we asked. Prob cheaper than using a Groundworks company. Steep learning curve for us but good to get going. Soil survey essential but we had less clay than they said so dug too deep, mucked away a load of stuff and then had to bring crushed concrete in and roll / vibrate it. But no piling needed thankfully. Overkill foundations are the result. And 12k of contingency gone.  Taking your time is good advice from @Ferdinand

 

ecology building society has been a good option for us.

 

we can recommend a super electrician (Didcot based so practically next door to you)

 

 

 

[Ferdinand]

19 hours ago, Weebles said:

Taking your time is good advice from @Ferdinand

 

Just to drive that home with a Baseball Bat.

 

You have taken on the role of Project Manager.

A Professional doing that on your build would be charging you 20-30k. At £250-300 per day that is 80-100 days or 600-900 hours. ie 5-6 months full time. 

Your equivalent in 3 hour evenings plus half of Sat & Sun, assuming you are 2/3 as efficient,  is more like 500 evenings and afternoons.

Just on the Project Management, and not including anything you do towards designing it, getting the specialist knowledge to PM a build, or actiually building it ! 

 

My point is that for such a process you should not be surprised if planning to minimise your budget alone costs you 60-100 evenings in time spent, and if you save yourself say 10-20% it will be worth it.

 

That is normal, so don't worry that it is too much.

 

It is just that many of us don't add all the 2 hours here, and 3 hours there, that we spend on PM, and realise that it adds up to a helluvalot.

We just think we are going 25% or 30% slower than we expected, and start worrying.

 

You do not need to worry about taking extra time; you only need to worry if you get 40% of the way through and realise you have spent 60% of the money, then go ........ "oooooooooooh, sheeeeeeeeeeet !".

 

My other tip for this bit is to get a specific office area, and at least a half decent filing system, including an archive set up so you can find things again later.

 

Ferdinand

Edited February 11, 2019 by Ferdinand