Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Onoff said: When are you coming to Kent again! I'll swap for a crate of Westerham Brewery's finest! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Yes, a double dose of Sentinel will do a bit, but wont remove 35 years of corrosion. Deffo need a magnetic filter after poking the hornets nest though, as you don't want that ? getting into the UFH loops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 8 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: Yes, a double dose of Sentinel will do a bit, but wont remove 35 years of corrosion. Deffo need a magnetic filter after poking the hornets nest though, as you don't want that ? getting into the UFH loops. Try 50+ years for this single pipe system. Before oil here it was a wood burner. I replaced the hwc maybe 20 years back and the old one was nigh on half full of scale. Heavy was the word! That's why I'm so paranoid about keeping the old and and new separate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Onoff said: Try 50+ years for this single pipe system. Before oil here it was a wood burner. I replaced the hwc maybe 20 years back and the old one was nigh on half full of scale. Heavy was the word! That's why I'm so paranoid about keeping the old and and new separate. Clean it, flush it, fit a mag filter and stop worrying. I've seen these with Castrol GTX, flowing black, and they still work annoyingly well. Do the CH MOT and see what the water quality is like after a couple of weeks of running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 11 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: Clean it, flush it, fit a mag filter and stop worrying. I've seen these with Castrol GTX, flowing black, and they still work annoyingly well. Do the CH MOT and see what the water quality is like after a couple of weeks of running. Did I buy a mag filter already, that's the question? Been in the loft, nothing there. Remember going into a local plumbers merchant but did I come out with one? Going to make use of the search engine here as I reckon I'll have said if I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Just now, Onoff said: Did I buy a mag filter already, that's the question? Been in the loft, nothing there. Remember going into a local plumbers merchant but did I come out with one? Going to make use of the search engine here as I reckon I'll have said if I did. Let us know at 04:00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: Let us know at 04:00 Sods Law I did buy one and it'll turn up but I'll just grab one of these maybe? https://www.bes.co.uk/intaklean-2-magnetic-filter-28mm-22831/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Yup. If the other one turns up, I'll punt it out into one of my installs for you. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, Onoff said: Sods Law I did buy one and it'll turn up but I'll just grab one of these maybe? https://www.bes.co.uk/intaklean-2-magnetic-filter-28mm-22831/ £70 inc https://www.heatingspares247.com/product/intaklean-2-28mm-central-heating-magnetic-filter-ik2mf28/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 9 minutes ago, PeterW said: £70 inc https://www.heatingspares247.com/product/intaklean-2-28mm-central-heating-magnetic-filter-ik2mf28/ Cheers. Just ordered from your link. Thinking to place it in the 28mm pipe coming up from the boiler. There's the flow and return pipes in that boxed in section behind the broom handles. Not sure though if the pipes are spaced off the wall enough. Probably not knowing my luck! I might as well swap the 28mm flow pipe from the top lhs to the right at the same time. That'll put the flow and return the same side of the boiler unless that's an issue? Makes it easier as I'd like to box the boiler in sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Odd as I fit them on the return as the galleries in the boiler are what they are designed to protect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 1 minute ago, PeterW said: Odd as I fit them on the return as the galleries in the boiler are what they are designed to protect. No worries, it can go in either pipe, whatever's best. I must admit I thought they were meant to stop crap getting into the pump and valves. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 As @PeterW says, on the return before the boiler! Pro_Installation.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 @Nickfromwales, morning. Appreciate the tip ref the low loss header and that, size wise, would certainly allay SWMBOs fear over losing under the stairs storage space (for ever more crap). Assume I fit a manifold then with provision for at least 7 circuits, roughly: Bathroom loop Bathroom towel rail Study Kitchen Lounge* Diner* Bedroom NB: No loop in the hall or stairs room itself. (* Going to be one big room eventually, not sure if one loop is big enough). Would that "small" 25kW llh be big enough for all those loops? Maybe I'd be better now arguing for a bigger space for a bigger tank? Should I, as an exercise, calc the eventual runs of pipe now, before I venture too far. Similarly, I aim to EVENTUALLY do away completely with the downstairs single pipe system. If I then heed the sage advice given here over the years and fit a UVC or TS the obvious place for it is under the stairs. If there is a "tank" already there it's easier for me to sell the idea to her. One ideal I suppose is that whole under the stairs area gets given over to me for a mini plant room. An alternative perhaps is our plan for full height cupboards either side of and over the bathroom door entrance to house the stacks of tat! (You'll walk through a corridor in effect made up by the cupboard sides). Maybe one side of that gets given over to house a tank? PPPPPP! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpmiller Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Stick your info into LoopCAD and see what it comes up with. 100m is a sensible max for each loop but the more similar you can get the loops the better IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 58 minutes ago, dpmiller said: Stick your info into LoopCAD and see what it comes up with. 100m is a sensible max for each loop but the more similar you can get the loops the better IMO. I must download it. Did my bathroom layout on AutoCAD: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Re sizing the LLH, the thread says “temporary UFH buffer” . Make your mind up lol. ? Use that “for now”............and then go to a TS later. FYI 25kW will be ample as all you have to imagine is a 25kW boiler going flat out ( which you have already ) heating via high temp rads. You’ll be on lower temps at that stage but kW requirement will be equal to or less as you upgrade the fabric in / under each room ( progressively lol ). Can’t you get on this GHG stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Do you actually need a buffer, if the UFH is only ever going to run when the whole heating system is on and other rooms are being heated by radiators? You might want a plate heat exchanger to separate the crud in the existing heating circuit from the UFH but then that requires the UFH to have it's own little header tank or small expansion vessel as a separate circuit. What are you doing to control the UFH temperature? I see no manifold or blending valve on your sketches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 5 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: Can’t you get on this GHG stuff? Seems I can get a grant for 2/3 for something... 4 hours ago, ProDave said: What are you doing to control the UFH temperature? I see no manifold or blending valve on your sketches? The intent is a manifold. There's a temp sensor run to the centre of the bathroom floor. Kindly sent to me by @PeterW many moons ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 Who knew? I removed the covering board from the 28mm flow and return pipes to the boiler and there's a bloody great gap where I can see straight into the loft. Must be some heat loss up through there! Plan is to put the Magnaflow in the right hand pipe, return to the boiler. Can anyone see why I can't move the flow from one side top to the other? It's not quite in line though: I've been up above the dormer ceiling and though I can't look inside, I've measured the header tank as best as. I reckon there's about 20L of water in it. If I tie off the header tank ball cock then drain off say 30L of water via the boiler drain cock can I chuck my 2L of system cleaner into the header? Then I assume let refill then bleed the rads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Why don’t you drain down and chuck the magnaclean in, leave enough room to put a container under the drain tap. The one you ordered holds 500ml of fluid - you just turn the isolators, open the drain tap and crack the top open. Then close the drain when it’s empty, refil with system cleaner and open the valves and run for 2 mins, then do the same again. That way it is directly through the boiler and also means the magnaclean is collecting the crud the system cleaner is chucking out ... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 And I would leave the boiler alone - a leak on that fitting will be a complete biatch to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 14 minutes ago, PeterW said: Why don’t you drain down and chuck the magnaclean in, leave enough room to put a container under the drain tap. The one you ordered holds 500ml of fluid - you just turn the isolators, open the drain tap and crack the top open. Then close the drain when it’s empty, refil with system cleaner and open the valves and run for 2 mins, then do the same again. That way it is directly through the boiler and also means the magnaclean is collecting the crud the system cleaner is chucking out ... Thanks. Was just thinking less to drain down to add the cleaner from the header. As you say though, I'll need to drain down to fit the Magnaclean! I'll see if I can borrow a 28mm pipe slice from work. I'll do at the weekend. Kid less then so nobody but SWMBO to complain they're cold! 15 minutes ago, PeterW said: And I would leave the boiler alone - a leak on that fitting will be a complete biatch to fix. I'm going to have to sort this one I think. When I've drained from here before it takes an age to drain, hardly comes out at all to start with. This isn't anyway the lowest drain on the CH system. Down to 4 different floor levels in the house since I did the bathroom! ? Looks like 1" and 2" spanners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Those unions will wind out and go back in just fine. Use a PTFE tape like this to sort those deep thread valleys as PTFE tape will struggle. Bit of boss white on the internal thread ( not too much ) and don't over-tighten first time around. Pinch up later if they weep, but with just F&E there's not much more than 1 bar there I'm guessing. +1 on using the filter to dose via. Don't use the F&E as it's the most elongated method of dosing there is. If you're worried about that, drain the towel rad when the systems down and fill that with the cleaner. Is that connected to the single pipe atm? I forget lol it's been a bit of a journey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 5, 2020 Author Share Posted October 5, 2020 Sorry, what's F&E? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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