Sunamp container bulging

[ProDave]

16 minutes ago, Triassic said:

If our local housing association is anything to go by, they are sticking PV on every available roof. I bet they’d not be too chuffed at the 25% utilisation of the available PV. 

 

I got the impression from the Sunamp web site that social housing was a key part of their target “mass market” !

The HA won't care.  "Renewables"  Check, box ticked, job done.,

[Barney12]

7 minutes ago, ProDave said:

The HA won't care.  "Renewables"  Check, box ticked, job done.,

 

Absolutely. The press is littered with stories of unsuspecting tenants with supposedly ‘low energy, low cost’ homes which are costing a fortune to run. 

[joe90]

It’s a good job the “boffins” on this forum can bring reality to green bolt on goodies.

[Triassic]

Have we heard anything from Sunamp.

 

Their blurb states.... Renewable electricity systems are optimised by Heat Batteries, and able to divert any spare electricity to the Heat Battery. Here it is converted to heat, and stored until it is needed, rather than the electricity leaving the home and going to the Grid for minimal return.

 

Lets hope they get their PV charging program sorted out, as I’ve bought mine based on its ability to charge using the PV first, when available.

[Jeremy Harris]

I've heard nothing, but am monitoring the energy it uses from the grid, versus the energy it uses from excess PV generation, together with our generation and import energy, so I can see how big an impact changing the setting last Friday from Option 1 being ON to Option 1 being OFF has made.  Last week showed that utilisation of available excess PV generation was poor, around 25% of our available excess went towards heating the Sunamp Uniq, the rest went to the grid. 

 

I will have a whole week of data with the changed setting next Monday around midday, so it will be interesting to see how things have changed with the Option 1 setting altered.  My gut feeling is that we may be up to around 50% or so excess generation utilisation, but that's still pretty poor IMHO, especially as it's unlikely that we'll have any days where all the excess generation couldn't have been stored in the Sunamp if it would accept a charge whenever there is any spare capacity.

[newhome]

45 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

but that's still pretty poor IMHO, especially as it's unlikely that we'll have any days where all the excess generation couldn't have been stored in the Sunamp if it would accept a charge whenever there is any spare capacity.

 

Ask for the old one back until they’ve addressed this issue ?. 

[Jeremy Harris]

10 minutes ago, newhome said:

 

Ask for the old one back until they’ve addressed this issue ?. 

 

Nice thought, but it was an absolute nightmare getting the 150kg UniQ up stairs, and I really don't want to have to get it back down to send off, then haul the ~60kg of Sunamp PV upstairs in its place, unless I really have to. 

 

If there is a modification to the Qontroller that fixes the utilisation issue then that's much easier to implement, as in all probability it could be as simple as blowing some new code in via the JTAG port, or just swapping out the control PCB, and maybe the temperature sensing string.  Either of those is a ten minute job, that wouldn't need any heavy lifting.

[Triassic]

Is Sunamp Technical Department actually aware of the issue, and are they all over it like rash?

[Barney12]

2 hours ago, Triassic said:

Is Sunamp Technical Department actually aware of the issue, and are they all over it like rash?

 

Yes, they are very much aware. As to how big and how itchy the rash is I'm not so certain but I know @Nickfromwales is trying to keep the communication channels open and flowing.

[Jeremy Harris]

2 hours ago, Triassic said:

Is Sunamp Technical Department actually aware of the issue, and are they all over it like rash?

 

 

As @Barney12 says, I'm sure they are aware of the issues and are probably working on both the case stiffness problem, to resolve the bulging, and also the design and functionality of the Qontroller.  I can only guess, but would think that designing, testing, production engineering and rolling out any fixes isn't likely to be an overnight task, but one that may well take weeks or months to resolve.

[ProDave]

1 hour ago, JSHarris said:

 

 

As @Barney12 says, I'm sure they are aware of the issues and are probably working on both the case stiffness problem, to resolve the bulging, and also the design and functionality of the Qontroller.  I can only guess, but would think that designing, testing, production engineering and rolling out any fixes isn't likely to be an overnight task, but one that may well take weeks or months to resolve.

But it would still be nice to have an acknowledgement they are aware of the problem and they are working on a solution.

[NSS]

Can't say I've paid too much attention to the various Sunamp threads previous to this one as our build was too far advanced before I became aware of their products to consider them. That said, I'd assumed they were a relatively new business (if not a start-up) but I see they've been around somewhat longer than I'd imagined. So have their current products just been a long time in development, or are they second or third generation offerings? 

[Jeremy Harris]

The current range are, I believe, their third generation of heat batteries.  I'm not sure what the first generation was, but the second generation was the Sunamp PV that we used to have. 

[NSS]

19 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

The current range are, I believe, their third generation of heat batteries.  I'm not sure what the first generation was, but the second generation was the Sunamp PV that we used to have. 

Yes, I had a read of their most recent annual report last night. Interesting stuff.

[Ricco]

Is there any information on the 50/90 "issue" if the Sunamp unit is connected to the grid only without PV (ie. charging it during economy 7 period)?

[Jeremy Harris]

Whether or not the 50%/90% issue impacts on charging from E7 depends on how much usable capacity you need from the Sunamp.

 

For example, if your use case was like ours, where we draw off around 4 kWh of hot water first think in the morning, but then use very little during the day, then there's a chance that a 9 kWh Sunamp may not have discharged down to the 50% level before the E7 period starts.  Under those conditions it wouldn't charge that night, so next morning would have around 50% charge remaining.  If the usage the following day was such that, say, 7 kWh of hot water was needed, then the Sunamp would run out of charge part way through.

 

If it was set for 90% discharge before accepting charge then it could be far worse, in that there could be a very high probability that it wouldn't charge overnight during the E7 period for the first night after a day of using some hot water and so run out of hot water the following day.

 

If you had a Sunamp set for 50% before accepting a charge and used most of the capacity during the day, every day, then the unit would always charge every night during the E7 period, so there wouldn't be a problem.  The main issue seems to be mainly for those who have opted to have a bit of "spare" capacity when ordering a unit, not realising that this "spare" capacity is really a liability that can leave them with no hot water (as has already happened to us once).

[Triassic]

On 06/12/2018 at 08:40, NSS said:

Yes, I had a read of their most recent annual report last night. Interesting stuff.

Do you have a link?

 

On 05/12/2018 at 17:49, JSHarris said:

 

 

As @Barney12 says, I'm sure they are aware of the issues and are probably working on both the case stiffness problem, to resolve the bulging, and also the design and functionality of the Qontroller.  I can only guess, but would think that designing, testing, production engineering and rolling out any fixes isn't likely to be an overnight task, but one that may well take weeks or months to resolve.

To be honest I’m not too concerned about the stiffness issues, I’m more concerned about my ability to use as much of the available PV generation. Given that mine is a none feed in tariff (DIY) installation, any generated energy is a “GIFT” to the grid and a financial loss to me. On reflection it’s a double wammy, I’m not being paid for anything I export and I’ve then got to buy it back to charge the Sunamp!

 

To be honest, I would not of placed an order for a Sunamp if I’d been aware of the new versions inability to charge using avalable PV generation. I really dont want to have to be adding a DIY Willie heater system to something that should ‘work out of the box’.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by Triassic

[NSS]

1 hour ago, Triassic said:

Do you have a link?

 

Download available from here https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC293690/filing-history

[Triassic]

3 hours ago, NSS said:

Download available from here https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC293690/filing-history

The Full Accounts document is well worth a read,

 

I never realised Sunamp are an MSC approved ASHP installer, until I read the above document!

Edited December 7, 2018 by Triassic

[newhome]

3 hours ago, Triassic said:

The Full Accounts document is well worth a read,

 

I never realised Sunamp are an MSC approved ASHP installer, until I read the above document!

 

Well they don’t do ASHP installations. I contacted them last week (along with a few others) from the MCS installer site and they rang me and said that they handed off ASHP installs as they don’t do them themselves. 

[dpmiller]

so someone else does the dirty work then they sign it off?

[Onoff]

11 minutes ago, dpmiller said:

so someone else does the dirty work then they sign it off?

 

A bit like when I had a MAJOR contractor subbing for EDF come and replace an incoming head and they left without fitting seals (and there was provision for two)!

 

 

[readiescards]

Does the 50/90 issue effect both the PCM34 and PCM58?

[Jeremy Harris]

42 minutes ago, readiescards said:

Does the 50/90 issue effect both the PCM34 and PCM58?

 

 

AFAIK it only effects the electrically heated eHW models, not the water heated models.  I believe the issue is only related to the turn on point for the electric heating element, but have nothing other than guesswork and a bit of crude reverse engineering to support that view

[Onoff]

Could you then...

 

Use the PV to pre heat a conventional store then use that store to feed a water heated Sunamp?