How much space to a boundary fence is needed to erect a wall?

[Dreadnaught]

This will be a new build bungalow. I am negotiating boundaries on my plot with the vendor. He is proposing to provide a little extra space to erect a fence beyond the outside wall of my future house (the boundary fence was missed off the plot as advertised). The construction method of my house will be timber frame, wooden I-beams (passive house) and rendered.

 

He has suggested 0.5m (50cm) of gap between my outside wall and the fence (a fence that will be in place throughout the build).

 

How much space does a contractor need to erect such a wall? Is 50 cm enough? What about scaffolding?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Russell griffiths]

If this is a permanent fence how are you proposing to maintain that side, In future, if it’s two story you will need more space for the angle of ladders. I would want at least 1200mm minimum 

is it not possible to move the house further from the boundary. 

[Dreadnaught]

4 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

If this is a permanent fence how are you proposing to maintain that side

 

The fence will be the responsibility of the neighbour. 

Regarding maintaining my wall, I imagine it would mean squeezing in the 50cm gap. Is that too little?

 

5 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

if it’s two story you will need more space for the angle of ladders

 

Its a single floor (bungalow) but good point about ladders for cleaning the roof windows on that side.

 

6 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

 is it not possible to move the house further from the boundary. 

 

It could be, but I have a tiny plot so keen to use it all. 

[Mr Punter]

Agree with @Russell griffiths that 1200 is minimum.  Any eaves / gutter overhang or is it a gable?

[ProDave]

Do you not have a fireproofing issue, particularly with windows if <1M from a boundary?

 

Is there no way you could negotiate the boundary to be just over 1M from your wall?

[Dreadnaught]

4 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

Any eaves / gutter overhang or is it a gable?

 

Not sure yet. Architect has not done their work.

 

1 minute ago, ProDave said:

Do you not have a fireproofing issue, particularly with windows if <1M from a boundary?

 

 

No windows on that side, just roof windows (which hopefully would be > 1m from the boundary as the crow flies).

 

1 minute ago, ProDave said:

Is there no way you could negotiate the boundary to be just over 1M from your wall?

 

Could do. But swings and roundabouts. Its part of a wider deal.

[Temp]

I would allow at least enough room to get a narrow scaffolding tower up past the verges. Narrow scaffolding is around 0.85m but you need some extra space to move it around so I'd say at least 1m from the verge (which is more than 1m from the wall).

 

Any rainwater down pipes or boiler flues on that wall?

 

PS: Narrow towers that tall should have outrigger legs but that would add a lot more space.

 

PPS: A Wheelie Bin is about 60cm wide so perhaps allow at least 75cm to get one down there easily.

Edited May 8, 2018 by Temp

[Russell griffiths]

If it is a tiny plot, does it have to be a bungalow, how about 1:5 storey 

bungalows take up a lot of room. 

[Dreadnaught]

12 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

If it is a tiny plot, does it have to be a bungalow, how about 1:5 storey 

 

Sadly, planning wont allow it.

 

23 minutes ago, Temp said:

Any rainwater down pipes or boiler flues on that wall?

 

No flue. Could be rainwater pipes.

[Dreadnaught]

I worry more about the construction phase. Can I build a timber frame house (single floor) so close to a boundary, with just a 50 cm gap?

 

Also, does anyone know of any planning principles about how close a new build can be to a boundary? I have heard of a 1.2m figure mentioned, but I am not sure if that's just a guideline or whether its a requirement.

[Russell griffiths]

Can you not have a fence for construction purposes, set at 1500mm and after construction move it in to where the vendor wants it. 

 

It is possible to build to build anything you want in the tiniest of space, (think building in London) but why would you for ease you want at least 1500, is he willing to be flexible, 

 

are you being to acomadating because you have found a plot you want. 

[Dreadnaught]

6 minutes ago, Russell griffiths said:

are you being to acomadating because you have found a plot you want. 

 

Good challenge. Hmm, some more thought is needed.

 

Thank you all. That has been very helpful!

[lizzie]

Originally our house was supposed to be banked into the earth wall. I didn't want that and so condition of the purchase was that we got an extra 50cm from vendor and we moved the house over a tiny bit (tight plot in that direction) we have ended up with 1200 between house and retaining wall because we took our 50cm and then built wall in the other side of that giving us the full 50 (and maybe a tiny bit more - whats a cm or twoLOL). 1200 is OK for scaff, pipes etc.  I wouldn't want any narrower. I have a back door there which is handy for nipping out to the bin etc

 

This is mine at  night (low level lighting) - we gravelled floor rather than paved because there are lot of manholes and all the services running down there so easier if ever we need to get at anything.

 

 

[Dreadnaught]

Thanks @lizzie. That's really helpful to visualise.

 

I suspect the vendor thinks of his 50cm as a concession and we will have to move our property back 70 cm too to get a gap of about 120 cm. I have to weigh-up whether that is a fair deal in the wider context. Thinking…

 

[Simplysimon]

what's the wall coating? wouldn't want to be roughcasting in 500mm space

[PeterW]

Scaffold can step over a 6ft fence for building purposes as long as the vendor is ok with that for the building period. 

 

Issue may well be fire regs with your rendered panel, and as others say, it’s not really anything other than wasted space 

 

Considered a basement..?

[Ferdinand]

2 hours ago, lizzie said:

Originally our house was supposed to be banked into the earth wall. I didn't want that and so condition of the purchase was that we got an extra 50cm from vendor and we moved the house over a tiny bit (tight plot in that direction) we have ended up with 1200 between house and retaining wall because we took our 50cm and then built wall in the other side of that giving us the full 50 (and maybe a tiny bit more - whats a cm or twoLOL). 1200 is OK for scaff, pipes etc.  I wouldn't want any narrower. I have a back door there which is handy for nipping out to the bin etc

 

This is mine at  night (low level lighting) - we gravelled floor rather than paved because there are lot of manholes and all the services running down there so easier if ever we need to get at anything.

 

 

 

Hope nothing is deep. You would have fun digging a 1m deep hole or trench there.

 

F

 

[Dreadnaught]

27 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Considered a basement..?

 

Yes, would love one but planning again say no. Tree roots galore! I have the world's most difficult site. It has the full card deck of constraints. 

[PeterW]

Why do planning say no - or care ..?

  

Tree roots will be a problem for any foundation construction - on clay you could end up at 2m founds so why not make the best of it ..?

[Dreadnaught]

19 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Why do planning say no - or care ..?

 

There are big trees adjacent to the site (a Horse Chestnut Tree, a Plane Tree, two Beech Trees, all mature) and the neighbours kicked-up a fuss about each of them. Its a conservation zone in the middle of the city so all those trees effectively have TPOs. And more than half the site is a no-dig root-protection zone.

 

I did say the site has all the constraints imaginable 

[lizzie]

39 minutes ago, Ferdinand said:

Hope nothing is deep. You would have fun digging a 1m deep hole or trench there.

 

F

They hand dug the trenches to get it all in so I imagine the same would happen if it ever needed to be accessed in the future. I wouldn’t ever be personally doing any digging of course?

Edited May 8, 2018 by lizzie

[PeterW]

50 minutes ago, Dreadnaught said:

 

There are big trees adjacent to the site (a Horse Chestnut Tree, a Plane Tree, two Beech Trees, all mature) and the neighbours kicked-up a fuss about each of them. Its a conservation zone in the middle of the city so all those trees effectively have TPOs. And more than half the site is a no-dig root-protection zone.

 

I did say the site has all the constraints imaginable 

 

And PP is for a bungalow ..?

 

Whats the soil ..?

[Dreadnaught]

30 minutes ago, PeterW said:

And PP is for a bungalow ..?

 

Yes, of highly contemporary design.

 

30 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Whats the soil ..?

 

Made Ground (0 - 2m or so) over river-terrace deposits (then 0.2 – 1.5m) to Gault clay (at 2 - 3 m total depth). Recommendation is for screw piles to a suspended slab over a sub-floor gap. I have no idea at present how I am going to have the passive-house levels of insulation in the floor. 

 

(Oh, and the plot is between flood zones 2 and 3. The full card deck of issues!)

[PeterW]

I wish you every bit of luck with that plot ..!!! Fence sounds the least of your worries ...!!

[Nickfromwales]

15 hours ago, Dreadnaught said:

Sadly, planning wont allow it.

Attic Truss the roof now for 'adaptation' later on. If you cant get a recognisable room you can always have 'very posh', carpeted & heated storage space. 

I store my 11 year old in mine