Uphill poo?

[G and J]

So, another on of my brainboilers at the mo is the potty in my man cave (AKA The Hide, because it looks like a bird hide).

 

The sewer leaves the site out front, the invert level at that point is 500mm.  We are just about ok for the house, but at the end of the garden it’s otherwise.  The ground in the back garden is about a foot lower than out front, so I simply can’t just rely on gravity (unless I put the potty on the roof of The Hide and have a feature aerial sewer pipe!).   I’ve tried to put a pic on this post to illustrate.  
 

We believe that we will not be allowed to bury a waste system, and it would probably not be practical anyway given the mature trees we wish to preserve anyway.  
 

I would be grateful for ideas!

[Mr Punter]

Get a pump station.  The outlet can be run close to the surface.

[Moonshine]

Macerator and pump

[Mr Punter]

Just now, Moonshine said:

Macerator and pump

 

Macerators are noisy and annoying.   A packaged pump station is quieter and more reliable.

[G and J]

Would said pump go up near the house, with the pipe from The Hide having a gentle fall into it?

[Mr Punter]

You could have a sunken tank and pump just outside the man cave.  Gravity drain into tank, pump up to the gravity sewer.

[Alan Ambrose]

>>> unless I put the potty on the roof

 

Is that what they call an upside-down house? Good view?

[G and J]

11 minutes ago, Alan Ambrose said:

>>> unless I put the potty on the roof

 

Is that what they call an upside-down house? Good view?

A poo with a view?   😉

[G and J]

41 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

You could have a sunken tank and pump just outside the man cave.  Gravity drain into tank, pump up to the gravity sewer.

Is this the kind of thing?

 

https://www.henrypumps.co.uk/js-sv-sewage-vortex-pumps-2--3-inch---js400sv-js650sv-js750sv-js1500sv-227-p.asp?_=&variantid=231&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIrMW42NirhgMVRotQBh1OBweQEAQYBSABEgLhSPD_BwE

 

If I understand you correctly then the pump would have a negative fall to the main sewer?

[LnP]

I installed this pumping station in a similar situation, from Drainstore. It's been in a year and works fine so far. Completely silent.  

 

Single Sewage Pumping Station - 610mm x 1000mm 292 Litres - up to 10m head plus 2 year warranty on pump - Include High Level Alarm

 

[Mr Punter]

https://drainstore.com/pumping-stations-pumps/packaged-pumping-stations-and-pumps/single-sewage-pumping-station-610mm-x-1000mm-292-litres-2-year-warranty-pump/

[ProDave]

A simple macerator would be a lot cheaper and simpler, typically they sit behind the WC pan.

 

Whatever you choose I would regard this shed loo as being for No 1's only.  Take a walk to the house if you need a No 2.  Trust me you don't want to be fishing a failed pump out of a raw sewage pumping station that has been used for "all functions"

 

In all cases the output pipe is a smaller bore and it goes uphill under pressure from the pump.  It would typically discharge into an inspection chamber in your case close to the road so the final bit can drain by gravity to the sewer.

[G and J]

7 minutes ago, ProDave said:

A simple macerator would be a lot cheaper and simpler, typically they sit behind the WC pan.

 

Whatever you choose I would regard this shed loo as being for No 1's only.  Take a walk to the house if you need a No 2.  Trust me you don't want to be fishing a failed pump out of a raw sewage pumping station that has been used for "all functions"

 

In all cases the output pipe is a smaller bore and it goes uphill under pressure from the pump.  It would typically discharge into an inspection chamber in your case close to the road so the final bit can drain by gravity to the sewer.

I started by looking at macerators but I got the impression it would lift the waste but then needed a fall to the sewer connection.  As that would mean above ground pipe I wasn’t keen.  Have I misunderstood? (Again!)
 

 

[G and J]

25 minutes ago, LnP said:

I installed this pumping station in a similar situation, from Drainstore. It's been in a year and works fine so far. Completely silent.  

 

Single Sewage Pumping Station - 610mm x 1000mm 292 Litres - up to 10m head plus 2 year warranty on pump - Include High Level Alarm

 

Did you install it near the sewer connection or near the garden building?

[saveasteading]

a saniflo costs £300 ish and will do the job comfortably. I would put the small dia pipe inside a drain pipe though as a duct in case it need sorting in 10 years.

 

I once put one on a site serving a double toilet and about 12 to 15 workers, pumping about 15m, and it worked for a year.....and so we moved it to the next job and it worked for ages too.

Each model will have  a spec stating a distance OR height gain, but you need to find the graph that combines the two. 

 

for some reason a pump station has to have a tank that holds a day's worth of content, but a saniflo doesn't.

[G and J]

2 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

stating a distance OR height gain

Ah!  I think then I’m getting confused by the fall requirement after the maximum lift.  So in my case the pipe will first drop a couple of feet to go underground then run flat for circa 30m then very gently rise by about half a meter over about 20m.  Effectively a stupidly long flat u bend.  
 

Very good idea re the ducting.  

[Mr Punter]

25 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

a saniflo costs £300 ish and will do the job comfortably. I would put the small dia pipe inside a drain pipe though as a duct in case it need sorting in 10 years.

 

I once put one on a site serving a double toilet and about 12 to 15 workers, pumping about 15m, and it worked for a year.....and so we moved it to the next job and it worked for ages too.

Each model will have  a spec stating a distance OR height gain, but you need to find the graph that combines the two. 

 

for some reason a pump station has to have a tank that holds a day's worth of content, but a saniflo doesn't.

 

So each time you use the loo, if only for a wee or the basin to wash your hands, the saniflo motor will kick in loundly.  Good luck if you ever want it to be like a proper, habitable space but probably OK compared to a dirty stinking portaloo.

[saveasteading]

12 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

probably OK compared to a dirty stinking portaloo.

yes, we were using it instead of it going into a tank for later sucking out. But the OP here wants it for a mancave, so nobody else is there and he is busy washing his hands as he hears the pump.

 

33 minutes ago, G and J said:

I’m getting confused by the fall requirement after the maximum lift.

It is a cumulative thing. If it can lift 3m for example, then that includes 1m down and 4m up again.

[G and J]

Well, my thinking started as just being for my man cave (v irritating to have to trudge up the garden for a wee during a workout) but now I’m thinking during the build phase it could serve as the site potty.  And I’ll not hear the thing working over my music anyway!  🙂

[G and J]

24 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

he is busy washing his hands

And it’s a man cave.  None of that stuff is required lol

[Kelvin]

What about a composting loo. Nice and simple and no plumbing needed. If it’s just you using it then it won’t see a lot of use. The really dear versions will turn the waste into compost. The cheaper ones separate solids and liquids allowing the solids to dry out. You then empty them every  week or so  depending on use and size.  
 

Whatever you do, not entirely sure I’d use it as a site loo. Our site loo cost £105/month which included weekly cleaning/replenishment and we had it on-site for 9 months. It’s an extra cost but even if I had suitable alternative loo on-site I’d still have hired a site loo. 

 

[G and J]

54 minutes ago, Kelvin said:

Whatever you do, not entirely sure I’d use it as a site loo. Our site loo cost £105/month which included weekly cleaning/replenishment

Hmmmm, that’s less than I expected.
 

 

59 minutes ago, Kelvin said:

What about a composting loo. Nice and simple and no plumbing needed. If it’s just you using it then it won’t see a lot of use. The really dear versions will turn the waste into compost. The cheaper ones separate solids and liquids allowing the solids to dry out

Interesting thought, but not a solution I fancy.  I know it’s an illogical response but for me I think I’d rather go without and trudge back to the house for a wee.  But thank you for the idea, it’s not one I’d considered.  

[Kelvin]

Site loo costs have gone up since I negotiated my contract like everything else so it’ll likely be dearer than that. Just keep in mind if you decided to fit a loo in this garden room and use it as a site loo then it’ll have a load of different folk trudging in and out of it in all weathers during your build. Some folk have a different attitude to loo use than you might have… (my other half refused to use our site loo and it was kept pretty clean) 

[LnP]

15 hours ago, G and J said:

Did you install it near the sewer connection or near the garden building?

I installed it next to the outbuilding, in fact in the middle of where we now have a patio. I was a little bit worried we might get smells but we don't. The waste from the outbuilding falls by gravity into the pumping station and there's a level switch in the tank which turns the pump on. It's about 25m to the sewer chamber it connects it into. I looked into macerators, talked to builders and got advice that a pumping station was more of a "proper job". Also my mother-in-law had a macerator when she had a downstairs toilet installed, to get the waste a few meters to the sewer connection. It was unreliable. We're going to be living in this outbuilding during the build so it needs to be up to regular use.

 

You have to dig a hole in the ground for the tank, but we had a digger on site anyway for the trench.

[Russell griffiths]

A macerator fitted behind the toilet will 100% not work in your situation 

distance is to far, pump not powerful enough. 
 

anybody that suggests it will work, keep there name and give them a call to fix it when all that shit is backed up and under pressure. 
 

you will need a sewage pumping chamber fitted outside the man cave so the pump pushes the turdy water away, rather than near the road and sucking. 
 

allow £1200 at least for the tank and pump. 
 

or if your clever you can make one out of concrete rings and get your own pump. 
 

if it’s only light use go for a single pump, some have two and some have a back up alarm.