johnhenstock83 Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 hello again, it's finally the time for us to place an order and get a kitchen after many months of setbacks. I've been negotiating with several main suppliers (Magnet, Howdens, Benchmarx, Wickes etc.) and we're down to Howdens vs DIY Kitchens. it will be a DIY project, but I had tradespeople around and they all praised Howdens and ALL confused DIY Kitchens with B&Q. I did my own research and I'm really undecided, don't know what to do. from everything I've seen, DIY Kitchens is significantly superior to anything Howdens even produced. Thickness, foil wrapping, drawer size, colour quality, legs, attention to details, carcass stripping etc. this is not there being a slight difference, but a major one in every important aspect of the kitchen. Howdens did price match our DIY quote and they can get the kitchen to me in 2-3 days, which is a bonus, but I keep wondering if I'll regret going for quick rather than something that's obviously leagues above. I'm yet to find a single negative or second place review for DIY kitchens, opinions are divided on literally ALL other brands. who do I go with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markc Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 Go with who you “feel” best. Chipboard is all pretty similar, most fittings are similar (unless you are prepared to spend a lot of money). A cheapie kitchen fitted well will outlast and out perform an expensive one fitted badly. painted finishes are one area you can spend a bit more. Next white kitchen I do for myself, I will paint it myself using 2 pack car paint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMo Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 I just bought a few flat pack units from Howdens, if you in off street you will pay way more than if you can find someone with an account. We mentioned a joiner and got 57% off the normal price. Both my sisters used DIY kitchens and were both happy with the result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 15 minutes ago, johnhenstock83 said: ... who do I go with? Your partner. Forget everyone else. Honest - not tongue in cheek. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMo Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 As @ToughButterCup says, unless your single, do what the other half says with regard the kitchen, you will live everyday regretting you didn't. Because it's wrong somewhere... and it's your fault! But to be honest I ( and other half driving the conversation) would go with a blank sheet of paper to a kitchen designer and see what they come up with, their design will be miles better than yours, and shouldn't cost you any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnhenstock83 Posted June 30, 2023 Author Share Posted June 30, 2023 thanks all. I guess all I wanted to know is whether I'll regret settling for Howdens when DIY Kitchens is so much better at literally the same price. In fact, I could get a painted kitchen for £300 more... as for a kitchen designer, I disagree. we're very hands on homeowners, we did our building regs drawings, our floor plans, we're not your typical customer who need to be told what can be done. besides, we spend a lot of time in the kitchen, with friends, and need to satisfy some OCD style needs regarding symmetry etc. any other tips welcome, thanks again! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeGrahamT21 Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 Mine came from DIY kitchens, really pleased with it. Few issues upon delivery with an item damaged and missing a part, but they quickly replaced it without any hassle. Not had a single issue since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunc Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 (edited) I fitted a DIY Kitchens 2 years ago. I'd say it's a little better than some of the cheapest flat pack stuff but really it's marginal once it's fitted. Hinges and handles are probably the biggest noticable difference. Slightly heavier grade back board to the unit. Leg adjustment pretty good, unit alignment reasonable, choice of unit interior finish....er, that's it. The fact that the units come preassembled saved a lot of time. I'd happily use them again but I'll also be shopping around just to ensure best price. Oak worktops were cheaper elsewhere. Customer service was very good [couple of small items were missed in the original delivery and were sent within 24hrs of lodging an issue. I requested dry assembly for one unit so I could cut it to fit, which they forgot to do. They did want to see photos of the fact that I couldn't take it apart 😆 before they sent a replacement but that was only a 48hr delay]. The only real disappiontment with DIY Kitches was their showroom display where they have their own base unit lined up next to half a dozen compeitor units. All the competitor units were deliberatly misaligned or mis assembled to make the DIYK unit look better. Smacks of desperation and slightly underhand tactics. All could have been fixed easily and would therefore have been nearly indistinguishable....which for me is the bottom line - go with whatever you like the look of. Edited June 30, 2023 by Dunc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnhenstock83 Posted June 30, 2023 Author Share Posted June 30, 2023 I don't know what to say. I watched this video and it's pretty obvious that there are more significant differences than just the cabinets or the hinges. the way the door is wrapped/laminated/painted, the quality of the finish, the presence of protective elements where other brands don't have it etc. ... it's quite clearly day and night to me, but I do agree a cheap kitchen fitted properly will look more expensive. we'll drop by Howdens today, have a proper look and decide later. thanks all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blooda Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 We used Howdens for the carcasses. a Localish show room for the electrical appliances, Sinks from someplace online. A local supplier for the Quartz tops, [half the price of Howden's] Handles from handles4u [saving about £100 on Howden's price] We used Howdens as they are near, and generally have stuff in stock, and will take stuff back, we used the Joiners account. We paid Howden's by card, and then explained in the covering VAT letter why the invoice had his name on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Walker Posted June 30, 2023 Share Posted June 30, 2023 10 hours ago, johnhenstock83 said: thanks all. I guess all I wanted to know is whether I'll regret settling for Howdens when DIY Kitchens is so much better at literally the same price. In fact, I could get a painted kitchen for £300 more... as for a kitchen designer, I disagree. we're very hands on homeowners, we did our building regs drawings, our floor plans, we're not your typical customer who need to be told what can be done. besides, we spend a lot of time in the kitchen, with friends, and need to satisfy some OCD style needs regarding symmetry etc. any other tips welcome, thanks again! If you're "very hands on", why aren't you making your own kitchen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 Can't really fault our DIY kitchen. I remember reading somewhere that they remove any negative reviews, hence the universal praise. But my own experience was positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnhenstock83 Posted July 1, 2023 Author Share Posted July 1, 2023 7 hours ago, Adrian Walker said: If you're "very hands on", why aren't you making your own kitchen? Not that hands on 🙂 5 hours ago, Crofter said: Can't really fault our DIY kitchen. I remember reading somewhere that they remove any negative reviews, hence the universal praise. But my own experience was positive. They might be able to remove negative ones from their website, but not from forums like this one, blogs, trustpilot etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz_moose Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 DIY sent me 10 damaged worktops in a row. 2 of the cupboards were out of square. 2 of the centre posts were too long so cupboard top and bottom pieces bowed so the door gaps are bigger in the centre. 4 drawer faces were chipped and my pull out towel rail was scratched. its worth getting the sink unit delivered dry built so you can adjust it easily for your pipes. the same goes for a 60/40 fridge/freezer unit. as i had to cut the back panel off mine and i had to build a box to go under the Fridge freezer to raise it up as the 'split' of the doors didn't line up. one of the doors slit about a year in so they had to post a replacement. all of their draw and hinges are BLUM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 18 hours ago, JohnMo said: As @ToughButterCup says, unless your single, do what the other half says with regard the kitchen, ... Talked this issue through with SWMBO the other day. She made a good point - " Do I tell you what you should have in your workshop, Festool this Festool that .... ? " And quick as a flash I replied "Ermmmmm, dunno wot you mean .... the tools you buy are just as expensive as mine though " Took a while to calm that one down .... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparrowhawk Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 35 minutes ago, ToughButterCup said: Talked this issue through with SWMBO the other day. She made a good point - " Do I tell you what you should have in your workshop, Festool this Festool that .... ? " And quick as a flash I replied "Ermmmmm, dunno wot you mean .... the tools you buy are just as expensive as mine though " Took a while to calm that one down .... My wife's a spender on everything and anything, and is now encouraging me to buy tools to "even things up". That wasn't quite what I had in mind when I said we should balance our spending, but okay... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparrowhawk Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 Back on kitchens, the one thing I'll say re Howdens is their kitchens are everywhere - holiday homes, rentals etc. They have a 'look' and I suspect when you come to sell that cheapens the kitchen because people can tell it's a common kitchen. Maybe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozza Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 (edited) My last house I had a DIY kitchen for 10 years. It was great. When I self built I didn’t even consider anyone else, went straight to DIY again. My best mate did a DIY kitchen on my recommendation. He was very happy too. On my most recent one one of the painted doors had a slight blemish on it. They sent a new one out promptly. Excellent customer service. I installed units myself but got them to supply & fit the quartz worktops. No issues with splitting the invoice for vat self claim / no vat supply & fit. Just remember as the carcasses are rigid not flat pack, they take up a huge amount of space on delivery. can’t comment on howdens but can confirm DIY kitchens are excellent. When planning my self build kitchen I visited a local independent posh, impressive annd expensive kitchen showroom for inspiration . I recognised they were using /selling DIY kitchens at a huge mark up. Edited July 1, 2023 by Bozza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 I think fitting a kitchen is about a lot of other things. making sure pipes are long enough to reach into rear of units without joins, bringing pipework under sink to ensure the space under the sink is usable, with isolation valves in every service having separate sockets for washing machine and dish washer if applicable I.E not plugged into a double socket. having plywood in the walls at the correct height for wall mounted units, base units etc so that it’s just screwing into units, all this makes installation easy. I like pre-made units now, my time is worth more, and I have more demands on my time. oh and making sure high level units are at a correct height for hob clearances… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattg4321 Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 11 hours ago, TonyT said: I think fitting a kitchen is about a lot of other things. making sure pipes are long enough to reach into rear of units without joins, bringing pipework under sink to ensure the space under the sink is usable, with isolation valves in every service having separate sockets for washing machine and dish washer if applicable I.E not plugged into a double socket. having plywood in the walls at the correct height for wall mounted units, base units etc so that it’s just screwing into units, all this makes installation easy. I like pre-made units now, my time is worth more, and I have more demands on my time. oh and making sure high level units are at a correct height for hob clearances… Good points, but what’s wrong with a double socket for a dishwasher and washing machine? There’s absolutely no way that a domestic dishwasher/washing machine would exceed 20 amps when run at the same time. If by some chance they did, it would be for such a short period of time as to be insignificant imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 Think the 20 amp, 16 amp on one outlet and 6amp on another is out, but I can’t remember where I read it. anyway you design the space to fit the machine, design the waste connection, design the water connection but stick a double socket for anyone to plug anything into., someone may even spur off it on the outside wall to supply the patio heater😀 I prefer single 13 amp sockets less risk for appliances that have heating elements that may be on at the same time… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted July 1, 2023 Share Posted July 1, 2023 I thought you had to have a remote (worktop level) switch and either a hard wired FCU or single socket for each appliance. That's what I did anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattg4321 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 10 hours ago, TonyT said: Think the 20 amp, 16 amp on one outlet and 6amp on another is out, but I can’t remember where I read it. anyway you design the space to fit the machine, design the waste connection, design the water connection but stick a double socket for anyone to plug anything into., someone may even spur off it on the outside wall to supply the patio heater😀 I prefer single 13 amp sockets less risk for appliances that have heating elements that may be on at the same time… Nothing wrong with that, but you’re designing out a ‘risk’ that doesn’t exist. Double sockets are rated at 20 amps. Those 2 appliances will go nowhere near this. 8 hours ago, Crofter said: I thought you had to have a remote (worktop level) switch and either a hard wired FCU or single socket for each appliance. That's what I did anyway... Not so, You just need suitable local isolation. Most (not all) people prefer not to have a load of FCU above their worktops ime. The 8/12 gang appliance control plates are prime suspects to go wrong/burn out, so I don’t really fit them either if I can help it. They’re usually poorly made (the fuse holders most often, but sometimes the 20A switches too) and much more liable to fail than a double socket imo. I’ve probably only ever seen a tiny handful of sockets that have failed due to overload (rather than a loose connection). I’ve seen loads of FCU and grid switches/fuses though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 https://flameport.com/electric/socket_outlet_circuits/index.cs4 designing out a risk, that’s good design I think , I just like high power appliances not to cause any issues. I have no issue if anyone wants to fit double sockets, it’s not a coding issue just not my thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnhenstock83 Posted July 3, 2023 Author Share Posted July 3, 2023 thanks all for the help. we went with howdens in the end. they were quite flexible about changing a few things around and once a price was agreed, they stuck to it even when changing from a simple baseline unit two pan drawers (£££). delivery in a few days, as opposed to DIY Kitchens, which would've taken at least another few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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