Do you also underestimate DIY jobs?

[Adsibob]

So I’m building a cupboard in my converted loft. There is a sloping ceiling coming down on one side of the room, and I’m installing some vertical wooden posts from the sloping ceiling down to the floor, so that I can then hang some cupboard doors from those verticals. Each door will be about 135cm high. I thought this would be a very straightforward task. I ordered some tulipwood posts that were 2.7m long, ready planed and the right dimensions so that all I would have to do was cut them diagonally to match the diagonal of the ceiling slope. Turns out that instead of a perfect 45 degree angle, my ceiling is 46.7 degrees. It also turns out that the walls either side of this cupboard area are not perfectly square. 
 

So there has been quite a bit of swearing and trial and error to try and get the angles right, and to try and mitigate the non-squareness of the walls. Also a few trips to screwfix to get things that I didn’t realise I needed until midway through (such as knee pads, plasterboard fixings and a countersink bit).

 

I’ve probably spent 3 x 3hr sessions on this job, and still only finished half of it!

Is this complete underestimation of the task normal??? Part of the problem is I am trying to achieve perfection, when it really is not required. 

 

[SteamyTea]

Angle grinder, multitool and filler.

 

[Sparrowhawk]

1 hour ago, Adsibob said:

Is this complete underestimation of the task normal??? Part of the problem is I am trying to achieve perfection, when it really is not required.

Yup. That's why my house is full of half-finished projects.

[Pocster]

Yep 

[JohnMo]

Vastly under estimated time required every time. Never order enough materials, so alway one or two more trip to get parts.

 

But always finish the jobs eventually.

[Adsibob]

A more experienced DIYer and family member came over and had a look at my half finished project. He pointed out a mistake I’d made. He’s coming back tomorrow with a “mitre saw” so we can fix it.

I will need to Google what type of saw that is. And tidy up my workspace!

[Radian]

Every time I experience this exact same issue - I think of the building contractors who quote for a job on the basis of materials cost and time estimates.

I honestly believe this is one of the few areas where they may actually be more skilled than me.

Edit: I forgot - I'm still  rubbish at plastering

Edited May 23, 2023 by Radian

[JonBATConsult]

3 x 3 hr sessions results in about 3 hrs of actual work. Each time its 1 hrs of faffing, finding tools, swear, thinking and then 1 hr of packing and cleaning up. 

[Adsibob]

Right, I’ve googled a mitre saw. Can’t believe such a thing exists. If it can cut a 47 degree angle, it would  have saved me quite a bit of time.

[Jenki]

4 minutes ago, Adsibob said:

Right, I’ve googled a mitre saw. Can’t believe such a thing exists. If it can cut a 47 degree angle, it would  have saved me quite a bit of time.

Mine cuts, I think 52 deg left 60 deg right and bevels 47deg. (Compound mitre saw). 😁

[Thorfun]

14 minutes ago, Adsibob said:

Right, I’ve googled a mitre saw. Can’t believe such a thing exists. If it can cut a 47 degree angle, it would  have saved me quite a bit of time.

I can’t believe you were try to do angled cuts WITHOUT a mitre saw. 😂

[Adsibob]

21 minutes ago, Thorfun said:

I can’t believe you were try to do angled cuts WITHOUT a mitre saw. 😂

InitiallyI was starting with a 45 degree dud, and then shaving that to see if I could get it to work. This was far to iterative, so I abandoned that method in favour of using trigonometry to “design”  the right angle, from then on, I pretty much got all of them correct except for two where I forgot that a line I was working from wasn’t actually perpendicular to the wall. The floor plan definitely shows a perfect rectangle, but my builder didn’t build three room that way. 

[TonyT]

That’s when an adjustable bevel comes in handy 

[Lofty718]

This is interesting, I was also planning to try and make some built in wardrobes out of MDF. Any photos of your progress so far?

[Adsibob]

11 hours ago, Lofty718 said:

This is interesting, I was also planning to try and make some built in wardrobes out of MDF. Any photos of your progress so far?

Yep. My relative bought me a laser level. Made the job so much easier:

[Adsibob]

You can also see the DeWalt mitre saw on the floor. This was lent to me by the same family member who supplied the laser level. The main posts are now all in, I just need to order the spray painted MDF doors and fit them. I May also put some additional posts in towards the back of the attic nook so that one or two of the cupboards can have shelves in them.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Adsibob

[Adsibob]

So I need to order my doors. I will hang six doors, one from each of the six posts in the photo above, and I want them to go floor to ceiling. The height from the FFL to the laser line (also in photo) is exactly 1266mm for all posts except for the ones attached to the walls. The left hand wall post is 1264mm and the right hand wall post is 1270mm.

 

There will be a 4mm gap between doors (the posts will therefore be visible, but they will be painted same colour as the doors). 
 

Will a consistent door height of 1256 work? I have taken the lowest post height of  1264 and then subtracted 8mm to allow clearance for the doors to open. But I’m wondering if this will give me clean horizontal lines top and bottom? Other option is to go for 1258 which is 1266 (ie the height of 4 out of the six posts) subtract 8mm and accept that the left most door will only have 6mm of clearance between it and the floor and the right hand post will be a bit more visible.

 

doors are going to be 18mm thick MDF, and a bevelled 45 degree back edge along the top to fit nicely under the sloping ceiling (although this is closer to 47 degree slope).

Edited May 26, 2023 by Adsibob

[Russdl]

Can you make 1220mm doors work as that is the width of a sheet of MDF, at 1250+ there will be lots of waste and more expense I suspect. 
 

A thin strip across the top of the doors of 30-40mm would let 1220mm doors work and may give a neater finish. 

Edited May 26, 2023 by Russdl
Added a bit.

[ToughButterCup]

On 23/05/2023 at 18:22, Adsibob said:

 ...

Is this complete underestimation of the task normal???

.... 

 

 

Yes.

But a few years of doing the same task, No.

 

Google and follow Peter Millard on YooChoob. Lots to see there.

Edited May 26, 2023 by ToughButterCup

[Adsibob]

2 hours ago, Russdl said:

Can you make 1220mm doors work as that is the width of a sheet of MDF, at 1250+ there will be lots of waste and more expense I suspect. 
 

A thin strip across the top of the doors of 30-40mm would let 1220mm doors work and may give a neater finish. 

That’s an interesting thought, I will check with the door supplier.

[TonyT]

Might have been better to screw a timber plate to the angled ceiling then fix the vertical timbers and similar wall plate just like making a partition

 

looks a bit thin on substance.

 

 

[Adsibob]

37 minutes ago, TonyT said:

Might have been better to screw a timber plate to the angled ceiling then fix the vertical timbers and similar wall plate just like making a partition

i thought about that, but I would have needed to cut a 3.3m length of timber diagonally, and at the time I didn’t know mitre saws existed. I thought about buying an arris rail but even then the angle wouldn’t have been exact. 

 

37 minutes ago, TonyT said:

 

looks a bit thin on substance.

 

 

I think it’s strong enough. All but one of the uprights are made of tulipwood, 38mm by 58mm. The one exception is MDF bound in a resin primer, which is 32mm by 125mm. Each upright is fixed at six  points: three metal brackets at the bottom end; and two metal brackets  and a screw that goes through the tulipwood and then into the ceiling at the top end. They aren’t carrying much weight as it’s just 18mm MDF doors. 
 

I’m sure there are better ways of doing this, but I’m just a novice DIYer, impressed that I managed to get everything pretty straight! I did ask my builder to do this (when I learned, to my surprise, that it wasn’t included in the original contract) but he wanted money I didn’t have. So I’m leaning as I go.

 

Do others really think it’s not strong enough? if so, should be quite straightforward to add battening in between the uprights to strengthen the frame; I’m just not sure it’s necessary.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Adsibob

[Russdl]

I did something very similar in our loft with a similar frame work but used timber top rail as well. It’s not decorative in any way shape or form.
 

We used 9mm MDF for the doors which has proved more than adequate.  

 

 

[Big Jimbo]

Well done @Adsibob. I know that this is not your trade. You will get a lot of satisfaction from doing that.

9 hours ago, Adsibob said:

i thought about that, but I would have needed to cut a 3.3m length of timber diagonally, and at the time I didn’t know mitre saws existed. I thought about buying an arris rail but even then the angle wouldn’t have been exact. 

 

I think it’s strong enough. All but one of the uprights are made of tulipwood, 38mm by 58mm. The one exception is MDF bound in a resin primer, which is 32mm by 125mm. Each upright is fixed at six  points: three metal brackets at the bottom end; and two metal brackets  and a screw that goes through the tulipwood and then into the ceiling at the top end. They aren’t carrying much weight as it’s just 18mm MDF doors. 
 

I’m sure there are better ways of doing this, but I’m just a novice DIYer, impressed that I managed to get everything pretty straight! I did ask my builder to do this (when I learned, to my surprise, that it wasn’t included in the original contract) but he wanted money I didn’t have. So I’m leaning as I go.

 

Do others really think it’s not strong enough? if so, should be quite straightforward to add battening in between the uprights to strengthen the frame; I’m just not sure it’s necessary.

 

[Big Jimbo]

Nice space @Russdl Well done