Looking for a new project

[nr projects]

Hi everyone,

 

My name is Nathan and I currently work as a Project Engineer/ Manager for a engineering company operating in the nuclear industry.

 

I am currently considering going self-employed as a Project Manager working for self-builders, charities and small businesses who have construction projects.

 

I started my working career as a Trainee Architectural Technician with an Architects firm, then after 4 years moved to a Timber Frame Manufacturer where I worked as a Timber Frame and Roof Truss Designer and Estimator. The skills I developed in estimating then led me to a job as a estimator at the engineering company where I've progressed to the role of Project Engineer / Project Manager.

 

I also have formal qualifications: ONC in Civil Engineering, HNC in Construction and the Built Environment and an APM Intro Certificate in Project Management.

 

Skills:

• Very proficient in using Microsoft Project (planning software) and AutoCAD as well as 3D design software.
• Experienced in using Total Stations (precision engineering projects and topographical surveys)
• Familiar with working to contracts (currently work on NEC3 contract on a daily basis)
• Understand costing and estimating processes

 

My question is: Is there a market for self-build project managers? If so, does anybody have any advice for starting a career in this field?

 

Thanks Nathan

[AliMcLeod]

Hi Nathan, welcome to the board. I"m new here but the people here are really friendly and very helpful and knowledgable. I can't really answer your question, but no doubt you've already studied the marketplace, so I do have a question for you. What would such a project manager typically charge and how? Is it daily rate (in which case I'd be concerned as a client that there is no incentive to keep things on time) or as a percentage of the build cost (same concern, but regarding budget) or on a fixed price basis?

 

I did smirk at your intro though - "Very proficient in MS Project" is something I see on almost every CV that have crossed my desk over the years. I'd be very concerned if a PM could not use that software.

 

I would add that, as someone embarking on a self-build, if I was to hire a PM, it would be very unlikely that I would hire one without a portfolio of successful build projects. So, it could be that you have to look to do some pro-bono work, perhaps mentoring an experienced PM on other jobs.

Edited August 2, 2017 by AliMcLeod

[Redoctober]

I have to say at the very early stages of our self build project, I had every intention of using a PM but as the months unfolded and the more knowledgeable I became through reading, visiting and talking to various people etc., the more confident I have become. So much so, I feel I can do without one - This decision has no doubt been made easier as I will be having a TF company to get me to weather tight stage and then a Builder and various trades to finish off.

All that said though, I didn't find it easy when I was researching / sourcing a PM - their general availability and costs were quite elusive I found, for the general self builder.

PW.

[nr projects]

Hi AliMcLeod

 

I think I would initially provide a tendering service for a 'fixed cost' where I would gather quotes and time estimates from various suppliers and trades so I could then give the client a detailed cost breakdown and programme. 

 

Based on the programme developed and the total project duration I would then produce a fixed price quote for the management of the project. I have worked with engineering contract that include financial befits for any time and costs save achieved by the managing contractor - this could be one way of avoiding the concerns you had regarding charging by hourly rate or percentage of build cost.

 

And thanks for the 'mentor' tip. I had thought about offering my services for free on a part time basis while gaining experience.

Edited August 2, 2017 by nr projects

[nr projects]

24 minutes ago, Redoctober said:

I have to say at the very early stages of our self build project, I had every intention of using a PM but as the months unfolded and the more knowledgeable I became through reading, visiting and talking to various people etc., the more confident I have become. So much so, I feel I can do without one - This decision has no doubt been made easier as I will be having a TF company to get me to weather tight stage and then a Builder and various trades to finish off.

All that said though, I didn't find it easy when I was researching / sourcing a PM - their general availability and costs were quite elusive I found, for the general self builder.

PW.

 

Where would you go about looking for the services of a Project Manager for a self-build?

[ToughButterCup]

Self builders are very highly motivated, determined people. We have to be. And the margins for those who want to sell on, is small. There's more personal commitment in this community than I have seen anywhere in my professional life (developing online resources for HEIs) because almost all the decisions are high stakes.

This community bears testament to the vast amounts of research we all do: just read the level of detail in the  answers even simple questions elicit.

I hate the abuse to which the word passion is subjected these days. But you won't find anyone here who isn't (or hasn't got to be) about their build. And we are all spending substantial sums - many of us just about keeping our heads above water.

 

The long way of saying I think many of us would love to be able afford someone with your skills.

[PeterW]

Hi and welcome. 

 

From the read of the first post you have got a number of key skills that a self builder would pay for - having an understanding of drawings means you can help spot the errors; estimating to help drive out the costs (value engineering); timber frame experience so you know some of the new technologies; and a bit of PM theory thrown in for good measure ...

 

What most PMs miss are the skills to have foresight and to stop the risks becoming issues - that sounds simplistic but I work on a daily basis with PMs that really don't know how to identify where something is going wrong until it's happened. It's about having a questioning mind, analytical yet sometimes relying on that "hunch" that things aren't right. The amount of times I get asked "why" and my answer is "because it doesn't feel right" and I get them to check again - 9 times out of 10 we have no issues but there is always the one where something is going wrong. 

 

That identifying the 10% is what will set you apart from other PMs - some comes from experience, but some will come from not accepting the "it's the way we do it" you will get from some trades. Just read the current window quality thread and think about how you would approach the horrors that some of the members here have had - nothing wrong with learning from others mistakes ..!  

[nr projects]

Thanks for the comments. I have been reading lots on here over the past week and I will continue to do so.

 

I understand that many self-builders are running high risks financial and want to avoid adding further costs to their builds - perhaps I'm targeting a very small market - or perhaps I can offer support on a part time / on demand basis.

 

 

[Alexphd1]

Hi and welcome.

I am not your target customer as i am too much hands on to justify a project manager, but there is certainly a market for this.  How do you see yourself in a role ie on site every day checking up on trades, quality control, cleaning up at the end of the day, sorting problems etc or  sorting paperwork putting tenders out pricing material? Up here the architect usually puts together a basic spec and sends the tender out to builders, to be working on the initial tendering without agreeing your costs I can see problems arising very quickly.

 

I could see a person between a project manager and a contractor would be more beneficial. If you had your own telehandler, your own caravan/site office and a phone book full of good reliable trade numbers who owed you a lot of favors, first on site last off site & knows the project inside out ...... i think even i might even consider you! 

 

 

 

 

[MikeSharp01]

Hi and welcome. I think you could look at your business model and see if you can optimise it around the stuff people, even here, really struggle with because I suspect we would all either have paid for, or will pay for, support in those areas - the high stakes as @recoveringacademichas said above. So for instance we all struggle, and evidence is more than abundant on this forum, with getting the energy systems design and installed to meet our needs. Even the omni competent @JSHarris(that's a compliment Jeremy) had a couple of goes at several aspects of this - you can read his blogs, a great resource, all about it here.  The choices around UFH / DHW / Vented & non vented / GSHP / ASHP / Phase change energy storage / battery storage / PV arrays etc take a great deal of understanding in the first place and is high stakes as most, unlike Jeremy, will not be treating the build as a research project. So being able to offer project support in this area, and others, would, I expect, have value for self builders for which they would be prepared to pay. This could then be rolled up into the budgeting programme stuff you have already mentioned.  If you work your away around the various topics here you will see where the needs are and how the cost / value equation might pan out for customers and hence for you.

[Ferdinand]

Welcom @nr projects

 

18 hours ago, nr projects said:

Is there a market for self-build project managers?

I think there is, but it is very diverse and fragmented. You will need to specialise in some way (eg in TF), and comms to the market is difficult until you get say 6-7 years under your belt.

 

The services you sell and the services that deliver the lion's share of value to the customer may be different, because almost by definition you will be selling to inexperienced builders and will sell only one package to each customer. One answer to this will be networking and being on the preferred recommendation list for architects and others, and so your customer becomes the architect.Suspect that is how many find their PM, though mine was a Planning-Consultant PM who's recommendation was success in a controversial application on the front page of the local paper and a personal interview.

 

Perhaps you need to investigate whether TF companies are asked to recommend PMs by people buying kits - does your employer have such a list?

 

The only self-build PM that comes to mind was the Grand Designs chappie who made a career after rebuilding his burnt down thatched cottage; many of the others combine it with other roles.

 

There are people who want a PM to do everything and just make it happen, and others who will be more hands-on. You could specialise or be flexible,

 

I think benefits to the customer you can offer may include taking out the cost of other professionals, or offering services dealing with difficult bits. Another is to help the customer be more the equal of the experienced architect to get what the customer actually wants.

 

eg benefits you can sell

Get a TotalStation and include the survey in your package - immediate saving £500-1000.

Ditto an ability to handle the EPC modelling. Worth £500 or so.

Ability to draw and optimise plans, or do planning applications well.

Ability to get project done more quickly.

 

eg huge benefits you could not sell up front

Come with established subscription to SPONS.

 

eg Specialisms

Offer a plotchecking due-diligence service. You are the bloke who tells them it was a tannery in 1926, or how to deal with problem x.

 

If you come with a bundle of Trade Accounts and knowledge as to who is the best / most reliable / most flexible supplier of "x" (eg staircases), then you may well pay for yourself twice over - whcih the customer would see as "under budget" (hopefully).

 

Best of luck.

 

Ferdinand 

Edited August 3, 2017 by Ferdinand

[Calvinmiddle]

Have PM'd you should have a notification 

[nr projects]

Thanks all for your comments - I'll look into those areas mentioned where self builders may require support.

 

I was thinking about buying my own total station and providing surveying / site topo plan service. Didn't realise as survey cost as much as £500 - £1000!

 

 

[Jeremy Harris]

As a guide to survey prices, we paid £450 + VAT for a boundary survey, plus confirmation of the height and position of a dozen marker posts over a big power cable.  The surveyor was on site for around one and half hours in total, and was based around 30 minutes drive away.  The price was reduced because I supplied an OS base map and survey in DXF format that I'd already bought a licence for.  My guess is that the survey would have been around £500 +VAT had I not had the base data that he could use, as he'd have had to pass on the cost of the OS fees and would have had the extra hassle of downloading an cropping the OS grid square file (I'd already done that in AutoCad for him).

 

These prices were from 2013, so are a bit out of date now.

[Ferdinand]

1 hour ago, nr projects said:

Thanks all for your comments - I'll look into those areas mentioned where self builders may require support.

 

I was thinking about buying my own total station and providing surveying / site topo plan service. Didn't realise as survey cost as much as £500 - £1000!

 

 

 

@nr projects Pretty much any report by a consultant who needs to visit the site and study something, then write it down, will start at about that £500 level. The only cheaper processes will be regulated or mechanistic or mate's rates. But as a bundle you will be able to save your customer money by not having to do a special visit etc.

 

There may be further potential for other qualifications for different reports, but that depends on your market and ho so might be one to consider later.

 

Surveys are universal and if you have done your own are a good risk reduction if you trust your own abilities.

 

IMO the second most common one that may be trainable for relatively easily and useful in most builds as a bundled service may be traffic surveys and modelling, assuming that you have a numerate degree, but since many of us need a veritable parade of ologists there is quite a lot of scope to choose one.

 

If you did not know what surveys cost then you have some serious homework to do to develop the gut feel you will need. A lot of people, including me, have shared aspects of costs on here, and some have shared full costs for all aspects of their build. Read this from me and scan all the blogs from cover to cover, especially @recoveringacademic and @JSHarris.

 

A good exercise and a serious suggestion to understand the complications you need to help people through may be to build your own house. 

 

F

 

Edited August 3, 2017 by Ferdinand

[nr projects]

Thanks for that @JSHarris 

 

3 hours ago, Ferdinand said:

Ditto an ability to handle the EPC modelling

 

I assume you are reffering to 'EPC' contract models? @Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

32 minutes ago, nr projects said:

Thanks for that @JSHarris 

 

 

I assume you are reffering to 'EPC' contract models? @Ferdinand

 

I am referring to the Energy Performance process where you are required to model the theoretical energy efficiency of your house design, then have the results submitted by a Suitably Qualified Individual. I think @JSHarris has an article about it somewhere as he did the calculations himself and had to pay an SQI to put the numbers in a template and the doc in an electronic postbox. Another bit of revenue your customer would pay anyway that you can capture and save them sending elsewhere. Arguably a saving for your customer.

 

There was also some input from an EPC assessor about the pros and cons.

 

F

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2017 by Ferdinand

[Mr Punter]

23 minutes ago, Ferdinand said:

 

I am referring to the Energy Performance process where you are required to model the theoretical energy efficiency of your house design, then have the results submitted by a Suitably Qualified Individual. I think @JSHarris has an article about it somewhere as he did the calculations himself and had to pay an SQI to put the numbers in a template and the doc in an electronic postbox. Another bit of revenue your customer would pay anyway that you can capture and save them sending elsewhere. Arguably a saving for your customer.

 

There was also some input from an EPC assessor about the pros and cons.

 

F

 

 

 

 

It is normally called SAP calcs for new build.  Very cheap to get done by others, so may not be worth your time training and registering.

[Stones]

@nr projects, I think the main difficulty you face is being able to persuade self builders of the value you can bring to any project. Persuading someone who has self built before, and who has the benefit of hindsight, may well be easier than a first timer.  

 

As to the size of the market, you have to ask how many of the 10000 or so annual self builds in the UK, and more locally to the geographical area you want to work in, go over and above a standard building regs box.  A lot of self builds in my part of the world are just that, friends helping friends erect a TF kit. Nothing complicated or extravagant, just a house that's a hell of lot more comfortable and significantly cheaper to heat / run than their old house. I can't see that group paying out any more than they have to.  That perhaps restricts you to the smaller group of self builders who have a real and genuine interest in building something that exceeds a standard box, in terms of design, quality, energy efficiency etc.