Lenders not happy with 'Building Regulation Part G(2)(b) standards limiting water consumption to 110 litres per person per day'

[thefoxesmaltings]

Anyone had this issue from lenders being generally unhappy and unwilling to lend based on the following condition? This is in our planning permission:

 

"Condition 9 - The development hereby permitted shall be constructed to Building Regulation Part G(2)(b) standards limiting water consumption to 110 litres per person per day.

Reason: To reduce demand for finite resources as the district is in a water scarce area. This condition is imposed in accordance with Policy SP10 of the Local Plan."

 

Lenders and valuers alike are concerned about the implications of the above condition under the principle that it affects the saleability of the property, and therefore negatively affects it's value and security.

[AliG]

They are being an idiot. That has been in building regs since 2010.

 

It just means that fittings that limit water use have to be used. No one actually checks the water consumption.

[Kelvin]

As above although I expect it’s a wilful decision insofar that lenders might have glossed over this before but are not being a lot more stringent on what they’ll lend against as they tighten up money supply 

[joe90]

Ha, my BCO looked at my huge bath and said “you know that does not meet building regs but if I make you change it you will only put it back again afterwards!” And moved on…..

[thefoxesmaltings]

10 minutes ago, joe90 said:

Ha, my BCO looked at my huge bath and said “you know that does not meet building regs but if I make you change it you will only put it back again afterwards!” And moved on…..

So you also had this condition and were able to get funding from lenders on a self-build mortgage?

[Temp]

 The relevant bit of the Building Regs is Approved Document G..

 

Quote

 

(2) The requirement referred to in paragraph (1) is either

 

(a) 125 litres per person per day; or

(b) in a case to which paragraph (3) applies the optional requirement of 110 litres per person per day,

 

as measured in either case in accordance with a methodology approved by the Secretary of State.

 

(3) This paragraph applies where the planning permission under which the building work is carried out— (a) specifies the optional requirement in paragraph (2)(b); and (b) makes it a condition that that requirement must be complied with.

 

 

So yes it is a more stringent standard than otherwise. Never heard of it being a problem for lenders.

 

One option might be to ask the planners if they would remove/replace the condition if you install some sort of rainwater recycling system. Even if only for flushing loos. Propose your own ambiguous condition. What does the SPD SP10 say about rainwater recycling if anything?

 

We have an underground rainwater recycling tank but its only used for garden/car.

 

 

 

 

[thefoxesmaltings]

2 minutes ago, Temp said:

 The relevant bit of the Building Regs is Approved Document G..

 

 

So yes it is a more stringent standard than otherwise. Never heard of it being a problem for lenders.

 

One option might be to ask the planners if they would remove/replace the condition if you install some sort of rainwater recycling system. Even if only for flushing loos. Propose your own ambiguous condition. What does the SPD SP10 say about rainwater recycling if anything?

 

We have an underground rainwater recycling tank but its only used for garden/car.

 

 

 

 

Haha, we already have rainwater harvesting proposed to be installed as part of the approval, yet still had this condition imposed.

Do you think it might be worth trying another broker? Currently using Mayflower who I was recommended to as they are self-build mortgage specialists.

[Temp]

Do you meet the rules for the Ecology Building Soc?

[joe90]

28 minutes ago, thefoxesmaltings said:

So you also had this condition and were able to get funding from lenders on a self-build mortgage?

No, luckily I had the cash from a previous sale for my build, the building regs include water use and some, like Jeremy, got pulled up on it and made to instal water saving devises in taps etc, my guy was far more laid back about it. 👍 

[thefoxesmaltings]

5 minutes ago, Temp said:

Do you meet the rules for the Ecology Building Soc?

Ecology also said 'no', based on the aforementioned condition.

[joe90]

1 hour ago, thefoxesmaltings said:

Condition 9 - The development hereby permitted shall be constructed to Building Regulation Part G(2)

But surely that’s standard building regs which every new build must comply with?

[Mr Punter]

Because the condition did not further specify that the property must maintain the rate of consumption indefinitely there is nothing to prevent a future owner from putting in whatever appliances they like.

[Temp]

23 minutes ago, joe90 said:

But surely that’s standard building regs which every new build must comply with?

 

No its an option at the planners discretion. See my post above.

[Temp]

38 minutes ago, thefoxesmaltings said:

Haha, we already have rainwater harvesting proposed to be installed as part of the approval, yet still had this condition imposed.

 

One possibility might be to appeal the Condition on the grounds that its not needed to meet Policy SP10 of the Local Plan because you are installing a Rainwater Recycling System.

[Radian]

All those restrictors are self-defeating anyway. Tiny volume of water doesn't flush the loo properly so gets flushed two or more times. Pathetic shower doesn't rinse off suds so longer is spent with the water running. 🙄

[markc]

4 minutes ago, Radian said:

All those restrictors are self-defeating anyway. Tiny volume of water doesn't flush the loo properly so gets flushed two or more times. Pathetic shower doesn't rinse off suds so longer is spent with the water running. 🙄

Yes but they tick the looney greenie boxes

[nod]

57 minutes ago, markc said:

Yes but they tick the looney greenie boxes

Exactly 

[Temp]

1 hour ago, Temp said:

 

One possibility might be to appeal the Condition on the grounds that its not needed to meet Policy SP10 of the Local Plan because you are installing a Rainwater Recycling System.

 

Further..

 

It might even be possible to prove it with maths. Eg show that with the normal 135L/person/day fittings and rainwater recycling you will draw less than 110L/person/day averaged over a year from the mains. 

[Haylingbilly]

I had the following condition "

10. Prior to the occupation of the dwelling, details shall be submitted to and be approved in writing by the Local Planning Authority to confirm that the dwelling has been completed to meet the requirement of 110 litres of water per person per day."

The Ecology were happy with this . Not sure if this helps or not?

[Carrerahill]

On 06/10/2022 at 14:38, thefoxesmaltings said:

Anyone had this issue from lenders being generally unhappy and unwilling to lend based on the following condition? This is in our planning permission:

 

"Condition 9 - The development hereby permitted shall be constructed to Building Regulation Part G(2)(b) standards limiting water consumption to 110 litres per person per day.

Reason: To reduce demand for finite resources as the district is in a water scarce area. This condition is imposed in accordance with Policy SP10 of the Local Plan."

 

Lenders and valuers alike are concerned about the implications of the above condition under the principle that it affects the saleability of the property, and therefore negatively affects it's value and security.

Bankers not understanding Construction industry I guess. Nothing new!

 

 

[Blooda]

We initially completed this for Building Regs:-

 

The Water Calculator

 

And made it fit, this was suitably accepted for Building Control, Water Connection and the Warranty.

 

Edited October 10, 2022 by Blooda