Static Caravan? Or how about this?...

[Mulberry View]

We have no choice but to accept that our plot doesn't have the most straight-forward access due to a shared drive with a tight corner. The most we can get up the drive is a 7.5 tonner, certainly not a 30+ft Static Caravan. We've conceded to craning some things in and we are (kinda) at peace with that. Though it isn't entirely straight-forward.

 

Then there's the thing about us wanting somewhere to live that's a bit better than a ropey old caravan. I know many endure it and I know we could (we've put up with worse), but we want to be comfortable so that we don't rush the build in our desperation to get out of the 'van. So, we had already decided that if we buy a caravan, we'll 'do it up', although I accept some will see that as a waste of money. We only need a simple space as there are only 2 of us, so I expect we'll knock some walls about to make the space easy and as pleasant as possible to live in.

 

The reality is that we're likely to pay around £3000 (if we're lucky), for a caravan that will cost us around £1000-1500 to crane into place. Once there, we'll want to 'Winterise' it and tart it up a bit. That's if we're lucky enough that it doesn't turn out to be an absolute snotter.

 

I can't get out of my head that for what we'll pay for this caravan and the risk involved, I could build a fairly simple timber building, we have the space after all. I could insulate it well and clad it with corrugated panels. We'll then be at the same point, with a bare shell, but potentially a better one. I feel as though the amount of time and money we'd spend kitting out this timber shell will be not much different to what we'd spend on a 'van. The only down side is that we won't be able to sell it afterwards, but a caravan would have to be craned out anyway, which might negate the pittance it will probably be worth anyway.

 

Am I stark-raving mad?

[Hilldes]

We budgeted £3k per caravan, but found at this price all we viewed needed a lot of work. Many looked ok on web sites but were in poor condition when viewed in person - some were quite simply old mingers. We actually spent £6k each and bought two from a dealer that needed very little work - we had no time for this a demolition of the old house was imminent. The dealer offered guaranteed buy back of £2.5k each but plan to try to sell ourselves first to see if we can get more.

 

On winterising we did nothing. I know other self builders have done things like skirts but we are in a sheltered location and accepted they are going to be (very) cold in winter and use an obscene amount of energy to keep warm. Ours have single glazing and next to no insulation in walls, roof and floor.

 

After surviving the winter we’re looking forward to boiling in the summer ?. I’m sure this winter had more freezing mornings than any I can remember?.

 

Would definitely go for a static again though as opposed to renting a house/flat. It is invaluable being on site 24/7, lower cost etc.

[Cpd]

I have just finished an 18 month stint in a hobby touring caravan that I have on my property and I found it completely manageable. The thing that makes it work for me is having the kitchen and the shower in separate units attached to the vans outside. Having these on the outside eliminates the problems of damp and lingering cooking smells inside. I also stuck an additional 100mm of kingspan on the roof and 50mm on all the sides, built a frame round it and clad it in timber and then stuck a turf roof on it......... ok so I went completely over the top and it would have been cheaper and easier to probably build from scratch.....  

 

if you have the skills then build a box and kit it out as you will end up with a much more manageable space. It’s not going to be cheap so do the sums before committing.

 

One other slightly easier option is to buy a large log summerhouse that can be assembled on site with the addition of tagging on an external shower and loo and then at the end of the build you can dismantle and sell on. 

[ProDave]

We did 18 months in a 30ft static caravan.  I paid £4K for it and I got one in tidy condition ready to move into.  I did add a wood burning stove which helped keep it warm in the winter.  Ours is still there and will remain for the foreseeable future.

 

With the access difficulties, I would be looking at some form of building that can be used as temporary accommodation, and will then have another use as a garden building after the build so it can stay, so whatever perilous journey to get there is one way.

 

It really really helped that we had the shell of the house up before we moved into the 'van and that enabled us to have the laundry and an office set up in the house shell.

[joe90]

I did not have the time to build a “unit” to live In so bought a Static but if you can get a 7.5 tonner in, what is the width?. There are many large touring vans for sale and if looked after can be sold on. I liked the fact a caravan was complete, if small, fir the duration.

[Mulberry View]

Thanks for your input.

 

If I was to go down the route of something other than a caravan, what are the planning implications? Let's say, for example, I build a timber structure of the same size and proportions of a caravan and am prepared to commit to a planning condition enforcing its removal once done...

 

Or am I going to have to detail it fully on the application? It's very tucked away, it's unlikely to affect anyone.

[epsilonGreedy]

16 minutes ago, Mulberry View said:

If I was to go down the route of something other than a caravan, what are the planning implications? Let's say, for example, I build a timber structure of the same size and proportions of a caravan and am prepared to commit to a planning condition enforcing its removal once done...

 

 

I don't think the planners can dispute the construction method used for temporary workers accommodation. It might be simpler for you and the planners if you obtained formal approval for temporary residential accommodation on site for the duration of the build.

 

After reading this thread I would advise against the idea of living in a touring caravan for more than one summer.

 

Have you thought about building the garage first? One solution I have seen is a touring caravan connected to one door of a double garage. The caravan was used for a bathroom, bedroom and late evening snug while the larger space of the garage hosted a kitchen and laundry.

 

btw Touring caravans are expensive and buy you 25% of the square footage of a static at a similar stage of depreciation.

 

 

[Mulberry View]

1 minute ago, epsilonGreedy said:

 

I don't think the planners can dispute the construction method used for temporary workers accommodation. It might be simpler for you and the planners if you obtained formal approval for temporary residential accommodation on site for the duration of the build.

 

After reading this thread I would advise against the idea of living in a touring caravan for more than one summer.

 

Have you thought about building the garage first? One solution I have seen is a touring caravan connected to one door of a double garage. The caravan was used for a bathroom, bedroom and late evening snug while the larger space of the garage hosted a kitchen and laundry.

 

btw Touring caravans are expensive and buy you 25% of the square footage of a static at a similar stage of depreciation.

 

 

 

Of course we all live in hope that we'll get our home built as quickly as possible, but I am a pessimist so would prefer to prepare for the worst.

 

SWMBO would prefer we build something that had an onward use, but I can't see it. I'm comfortable with losing 'a few grand' on our living accommodation as we would prefer to do what we can to make the process as easy to endure as possible.

 

I'm thinking of a stilted structure, built off 100x100 posts (probably around 12 of them). A 150mm thick subfloor which can be insulated. 100mm thick walls, filled with PIR and clad/roofed with simple corrugated roof sheets. The timberwork doesn't bother me, it's nothing compared to what I envisage in the house. I can pick up doors and windows from Gumtree (or a mismeasured window dealer). The interior would be ply-lined and painted. Internal walls would be a simple affair, roughly 2/3 towards an open-plan living/kitchen area the other 1/3 a bedroom and bathroom. We had expected to put a kitchen and bathroom in whatever caravan we buy, so that's pretty equal and by doing this we can plan the space to allow us to use our existing bed, cooker and fridge freezer (which might not fit in a static).

[epsilonGreedy]

9 minutes ago, Mulberry View said:

We had expected to put a kitchen and bathroom in whatever caravan we buy, so that's pretty equal and by doing this we can plan the space to allow us to use our existing bed, cooker and fridge freezer (which might not fit in a static).

 

 

Static caravans are flimsy structures so I would caution about moving walls or remodeling one. They are fitted out with space efficient modules particularly in the bathroom.

 

Mine is an extra wide 13'6" model with a total floor space of around 460 sq ft. It is a rare 1 bedroom version and life has been more than tolerable for 2.5 years. By my calculations a mid size touring caravan is 100 to 130 sq ft.

 

Even with a large static life became much better with an extra 8' x 4' garden shed to house the washing machine and tumbler.

 

There are many solutions to the accommodation problem but a common theme is that people build extensions or add an awning to their initial accommodation unit.

 

Do you have planning for a garage?

 

p.s. I would want something larger than 4" x 4" posts to handle the occasional extreme winter gust striking the structure side on. Just a hunch...

[Mulberry View]

10 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said:

 

Static caravans are flimsy structures so I would caution about moving walls or remodeling one. They are fitted out with space efficient modules particularly in the bathroom.

 

Mine is an extra wide 13'6" model with a total floor space of around 460 sq ft. It is a rare 1 bedroom version and life has been more than tolerable for 2.5 years. By my calculations a mid size touring caravan is 100 to 130 sq ft.

 

Even with a large static life became much better with an extra 8' x 4' garden shed to house the washing machine and tumbler.

 

There are many solutions to the accommodation problem but a common theme is that people build extensions or add an awning to their initial accommodation unit.

 

Do you have planning for a garage?

 

p.s. I would want something larger than 4" x 4" posts to handle the occasional extreme winter gust striking the structure side on. Just a hunch...

 

That caravan of yours sounds like just what we need. If only we can find one. I hear you on the shed too.

 

I just feel that I can build something more sturdy and efficient than any caravan we can afford, but I have doubts hence asking!! Hehe.

 

I could make the corner posts much heftier if I was to build.

[epsilonGreedy]

41 minutes ago, Mulberry View said:

That caravan of yours sounds like just what we need. If only we can find one. I hear you on the shed too.

 

 

One bedroom statics are very rare, +12" wide models are easier to find. At 13.5' x 38' mine weighs in at 8 tons. Are you confident about swinging such a weight from the public road onto your site?

 

I cannot visualize your site but building something onsite might be your way forward.

 

Checkout the following workshop build video series. He slots some insulated panels together around a wooden frame.

 

 

p.s. a corrugated roof will require something to dampen the noise of heavy rainfall.

Edited May 5, 2021 by epsilonGreedy

[Ian Phillips]

Where abouts roughly are you? I'm in West Sussex and have been living in a 2 bed static with double glazing and central heating. It's only 5 years old.

 

We should be finished with it in a few months time, which might be a bit late for you? It comes complete with skirting and a covered outside space made from pallets! I'm sure I could throw in a utility shed as well!

I think there is a national shortage on good statics at the moment as well!

 

Whats your budget?

[Mulberry View]

1 minute ago, Ian Phillips said:

Where abouts roughly are you? I'm in West Sussex and have been living in a 2 bed static with double glazing and central heating. It's only 5 years old.

 

We should be finished with it in a few months time, which might be a bit late for you? It comes complete with skirting and a covered outside space made from pallets! I'm sure I could throw in a utility shed as well!

I think there is a national shortage on good statics at the moment as well!

 

Whats your budget?

 

Ian, we're up in Norfolk. As great as it sounds, I imagine that's worth a bit? Not really thought about budget, but I am tuned into residual value, so if spending a bit more early on raises the chances of resale then that helps.

[Mulberry View]

3 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said:

 

One bedroom statics are very rare, +12" wide models are easier to find. At 13.5' x 38' mine weighs in at 8 tons. Are you confident about swinging such a weight from the public road onto your site?

 

I cannot visualize your site but building something onsite might be your way forward.

 

Checkout the following workshop build video series. He slots some insulated panels into a wooden frame.

 

 

p.s. a corrugated roof will require something to dampen the noise of heavy rainfall.

 

I've not watched it yet, but that video looks like it'll be super helpful.

 

Every aspect of getting a caravan craned over worries me. I've had a local crane company do a site visit and they're pretty happy, but it's still a worry and will cost around £2500-3000 to lift in and out.

 

I would plan to insulate it all round, which will help with the rain noise? This is early in the thought process, but I'm more seeing that the idea has potential.

[Ian Phillips]

Around £10,000 I would hope. It's quite rare with the double glazing apparently? We have been comfortable in it with 2 adults a 2 kids as well for 2.5 years!

 

It's an ABI Trieste if you want some more info. I would imagine it would be worth somewhere near this in another couple of years as well.

[epsilonGreedy]

6 minutes ago, Mulberry View said:

I would plan to insulate it all round, which will help with the rain noise?

 

 

I cannot see how that will work, statics do not have an eave overhang and the roof is is not designed to take the weight of a person. I fear your cladding will end up as a botch that will come apart during a winter storm unless it is formed around a fully independent structure that envelopes the whole static caravan in which case just skip the static and build something like a prefab chalet or grand summer house.

 

Rubber matting sheets over the roof can solve the rain noise. Noise from the roof of a purpose built static is tolerable, I was responding to your idea of a corrugated roof over a diy structure.

[Mulberry View]

5 minutes ago, epsilonGreedy said:

 

I cannot see how that will work, statics do not have an eave overhang and the roof is is not designed to take the weight of a person. I fear your cladding will end up as a botch that will come apart during a winter storm unless it is formed around a fully independent structure that envelopes the whole static caravan in which case just skip the static and build something like a prefab chalet or grand summer house.

 

Rubber matting sheets over the roof can solve the rain noise. Noise from the roof of a purpose built static is tolerable, I was responding to your idea of a corrugated roof over a diy structure.

 

I've confused the conversation. My apologies! The corrugated cladding would be for my structure if I were to build it. It would probably have 150x50mm roof bearers at a shallow angle (around 15°), ply both inside and on top and a corrugated sheet on top of that with insulation in the void.

 

If we went down the caravan route, alterations would be kept to a minimum, but some are inevitable.

[Bitpipe]

We moved into our two bed, two bath 40ft x 12 ft static in April 2015 and moved out August 2016 - family of 4, kids were in last years of junior school.

 

Caravan was bought of a local park the previous summer  for £1700 as it was slightly water damaged and was nice and dry when we moved in, was hooked up to power, mains water and sewage. LPG for heat. Cost £500 to get it transported and located on site on a low-loader by a specialist firm.

 

Interior was clean but tired. It was surprisingly roomy and we never felt tight on space. I recommend electric blankets in winter and a revelation was to run a small dehumidifier in winter also as the gas appliances (hob and fire) generate water vapour and this condenses out at night and leaves the floor a bit damp (and therefore cold) in the morning. The dehumidifier pumps a decent amount of heat also, just don't look at the electricity bill

 

What you really need to prepare for is summer - it is hard to keep a caravan cool if it's hot outside.

 

Also, don't entertain refitting the interior - as it says above, it will likely start to fall apart, the interior structure effectively holds up the roof. Challenging to crane them into place also as they have little structural strength and are liable to twist. 

 

We sold ours on for £1000 to the firm who moved it originally, believe it ended up on a fruit farm somewhere. Net cost to us was £1200 for 17 months accommodation - a good deal in my book

[epsilonGreedy]

1 hour ago, Bitpipe said:

as they have little structural strength and are liable to twist. 

 

 

I discovered this when trying to level my static by jacking up corners with a 12ton bottle jack. They are floppy things that groan a bit when a gust hits during a storm.

 

1 hour ago, Bitpipe said:

We sold ours on for £1000 to the firm who moved it originally, believe it ended up on a fruit farm somewhere. Net cost to us was £1200 for 17 months accommodation - a good deal in my book

 

 

It is easy to overlook the extra siting costs:

1. Armoured electric supply cable.
2. Pro electrician to connect up the supply.
3. A set of gas bottles, a change over switch, new gas pipe to route from where best to site the bottles, a new gas safe cert.
4. Front door steps.
5. An assortment of 110mm drainage pipe bends.
6. A digger for a foul drain extension trench.

[Russell griffiths]

Are you having a garage ?

you could build a 6x8 m garage and fit it out with a toilet and shower, would be up in a couple of months ready to live in. 

[Cpd]

Don’t underestimate the cost of building a structure from scratch- especially if you are going to dismantle it at the end, I can’t see you building something for less than 7-10k and your return on it at the end will be zero and probably cost you a bit just getting rid of it......  I would go down the static route and add on a lean to to house work ware, washing machine etc. 

[Bitpipe]

Just now, epsilonGreedy said:

 

I discovered this when trying to level my static by jacking up corners with a 12ton bottle jack. They are floppy things that groan a bit when a gust hits during a storm.

 

 

It is easy to overlook the extra siting costs:

1. Armoured electric supply cable.
2. Pro electrician to connect up the supply.
3. A set of gas bottles, a change over switch, new gas pipe to route from where best to site the bottles, a new gas safe cert.
4. Front door steps.
5. An assortment of 110mm drainage pipe bends.
6. A digger for a foul drain extension trench.

 

True but we reused the power supply to the van for the garage (put a kiosk in place when we first moved supply from old house pre-demolition) and only had a short run to the caravan from the new fouls which were needed for the new build anyway. Putting those in actually constituted a start on the build and locked in our building regs to older rules.

 

Steps were a stack of staggered pallets, as was the walkway to hard standing. 

 

Gas bottles were a faff, especially ensuring they were securely chained to posts and could not topple or get nicked. Agree that you need everything checked out for gas and electrical safety by pros but that would be same for any temp accommodation scenario.

 

If you want to build something semi permanent then there are insulated log cabins that would do the job but they are not cheap. You could also insulate a standard cabin. You'd need to price in the works for the base plus all services as per caravan.

[ToughButterCup]

On 03/05/2021 at 00:58, Mulberry View said:

We have no choice but to accept   ...   Am I stark-raving mad?

 

Ask the other half of  .. we ..

All technical considerations aside, what you are considering is extremely wearing. Starts as fun, demands more time than you'll have, insists on constant support-tinker-fettling-glueing, worries you when windy, and drips - ha! drips -  they're always over your side of the bed.

 

Your half of we will need support - so what does the other half of we think?

No need to answer; its just that mine has a unique, quiet insistence just as I'm into another of my 'yeah-we-can-do-this' fizzing episodes.