Ferdinand Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 (edited) This is an interesting proposal. The announcement is that coal will be banned for sale from Feb 2021, and unseasoned wood (moisture <20%) in packages smaller than 2 cubic m (*) from Jan 2024. So it will be anthracite or similar, dry wood, or have space to store it whilst it dries (challenge for posh inner London eg Fulham perhaps). Graphic below is a bit simplified (different emissions from different coal types). There is a Beeboid piece on it here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51581817. It was announced by the Ag & Fish Minister. I am assuming this is devolved, so this would be England only. Sounds like a not bad idea - I think, though some dwellings may need upgrading. What a difference to the arguments that used to infuriate my dad as a Council Architect around 1970 when the argument against insulation and gas central heating from some ex-mining Councillors would be "we have infinite coal and many of us get it free for life from the NCB". Ferdinand (* does anyone have an easy way to do superscripts from a normal laptop keyboard? I am sure it exists) Edited February 21, 2020 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyshouse Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 I think that there should be a total ban on coal, wood and biomas combustion in all towns, cities and schools for health and air quality reasons All those activities also release CO2 into the atmosphere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeSharp01 Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 19 minutes ago, tonyshouse said: I think that there should be a total ban on coal Challenging for steam buffs like me who like to move the logs down to the house by train - what will I do with all my spare time? 5 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 35 minutes ago, tonyshouse said: I think that there should be a total ban on coal, wood and biomas combustion in all towns, cities and schools for health and air quality reasons All those activities also release CO2 into the atmosphere The emissions from those is insignificant compared to vehicle emissions in built up areas. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 The concern with coal and wood burning isn't so much the CO2, but the harmful particulates. There's plenty of evidence to show just how harmful they are relative to vehicle emissions. I recall comparing the particulate emissions from wood stoves to that from diesel cars some time ago. Can't remember the exact numbers right now, but one wood burning stove is roughly equivalent to having several diesel cars parked on your drive with their engines idling, in terms of particulate emissions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Control the energy, control the masses. If it wasn't all about control the powers that be would have pushed for super insulated, energy efficient housing stock, supported retrofit schemes etc. I honestly believe that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 There are a surprising number of houses up here still burning coal on an open fire. The coal delivery lorries are always out and about at this time of year. We bought a few bags when we were in the caravan for a winter, I think most of what they sell came from Columbia since we don't mine our own any more. Surely this will spell the end for the nonsense that is Drax? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Visti Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Wonder if this includes charcoal... What will I do with my Webber! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted February 21, 2020 Author Share Posted February 21, 2020 3 minutes ago, Visti said: Wonder if this includes charcoal... What will I do with my Webber! I think it won't include charcoal - which has been purified by the manufacturing process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 And just how is the burning of wet wood going be policed? West Lancashire will continue to burn coal and wet wood for the foreseeable future. Luckily for my lungs, unpwind of us is the sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted February 21, 2020 Author Share Posted February 21, 2020 28 minutes ago, AnonymousBosch said: And just how is the burning of wet wood going be policed? West Lancashire will continue to burn coal and wet wood for the foreseeable future. Luckily for my lungs, unpwind of us is the sea. Since Councils are already responsible for bonfires and (?)smokeless zones, they would pick that one up, I guess. The initaitive sounds to me like the kind of thing that could have come out of the Behavioural Insights Team aka Nudge Unit (no idea if it did), which has been successful with small changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 52 minutes ago, Onoff said: Control the energy, control the masses. If it wasn't all about control the powers that be would have pushed for super insulated, energy efficient housing stock, supported retrofit schemes etc. I honestly believe that. Yes 100% I have been saying this for years now. They will remove petrol and diesel over time, gas perhaps, everything becomes electric, the general population then must step into line and pay for electricity and do as they are told. Self generation - fine, but they can then control the equipment costs too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeSharp01 Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Just because we are paranoid it does not mean they are not out to get us? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Just an aside. It it becomes illegal to sell "wet wood" Who is going to tell the two builders merchants near me to season their construction timber before selling it to me? The wood I got yesterday was inside their warehouse, but it was clear it had spent a considerable time outside somewhere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Bum ! I’ve just literally broken out my hole in slab and roof for flue - for wood burner . ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted February 21, 2020 Author Share Posted February 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, ProDave said: Just an aside. It it becomes illegal to sell "wet wood" Who is going to tell the two builders merchants near me to season their construction timber before selling it to me? The wood I got yesterday was inside their warehouse, but it was clear it had spent a considerable time outside somewhere. The ban is essentially retail and small quantities, and is only England (yet !). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 During my build I’ve saved lots of timber off cuts etc . ready for the stove ! As it’s the sale that’s being banned I assume I can use up my supply without issue ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 8 minutes ago, pocster said: Bum ! I’ve just literally broken out my hole in slab and roof for flue - for wood burner . ? They are not banning smokeless or wood, just trying to limit it to cleaner fuels. Wire in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, pocster said: During my build I’ve saved lots of timber off cuts etc . ready for the stove ! As it’s the sale that’s being banned I assume I can use up my supply without issue ??? Yes, for now! -Once we enter the real Orwellian dystopia we will have other things to worry about. Edited February 21, 2020 by Carrerahill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Just now, Carrerahill said: They are not banning smokeless or wood, just trying to limit it to cleaner fuels. Wire in. I know . It was just the timing was spot on ?. My solar panels go up tomorrow so be be prepared for the government to announce PV tax ?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted February 21, 2020 Author Share Posted February 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Carrerahill said: They are not banning smokeless or wood, just trying to limit it to cleaner fuels. Wire in. It's like twitter - people only read the Headline ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Just now, Ferdinand said: It's like twitter - people only read the Headline ? “Landlord murders 8 tenants to prevent them using log burner “ . You read it here first ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocster Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Carrerahill said: Yes - once we enter the real Orwellian dystopia we will have other things to worry about. True . Best build a shelter underground .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 1 minute ago, pocster said: During my build I’ve saved lots of timber off cuts etc . ready for the stove ! But that is a lot of the issue ..!! Treated timber and other things such as pallets are a massive issue. As is unseasoned wet wood. A lot of people buy them and have very little knowledge about how to light them and run them - and that causes the most of the smoke issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrerahill Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Just now, Ferdinand said: It's like twitter - people only read the Headline ? Or read the Star or Sun or Express where apparently, wood stoves are being banned, cars are being banned, your going to die, Dennis is going to unleash 20" of snow on us while tornados rip through the land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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