Novice in Cornwall

[Grosey]

Hi everyone, just had my 30th birthday, completed on a plot of land and am about to embark on a self build with my wife, so safe to say I'll definitely have lost all my hair by the time I am 31!

 

The plot is in Saltash, Cornwall. Still awaiting final confirmation of the mortgage but if that all comes through we will be looking to start 1st week of September. 

 

Dad has been hinting for years that he had built 2 houses by the time he was 30 so it was time for me to crack on!

 

Few photos and my attempt at a 3D mockup attached. 4 bedroom detached house with a large garage/workshop on almost the entire ground floor. 

 

Feel free to ask any questions, I've certainly got lots of my own!

[ProDave]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

 

That's an interesting project there, and not without it's challenges I suspect. That looks to be a big bit of ground in a big hole!!!!.

 

We look forward to the story unfolding.
 

[Nickfromwales]

Hello, and welcome   

Hair is a funny thing. My dad's family business was hairdressing and I remember my free haircuts well. I was not a dedicated follower of fashion   

My hair grows like I sleep with my head in a grow bag, and my dad used to say "you may go grey son, but there will be plenty of it". 

My BiL and I were joking yesterday about how our hair looked ( after our wives were questioning theirs ) and I told him he may want to sit down as I had some bad news.....then I told him he didn't have any. There was an awkward silence, then a few belly laughs.   His hair was parted by Moses.   

Don't worry about wiring, that stuff practically fits itself, but do give us a shout when the pipes are due to go in 

[Barney12]

Welcome. Looking at the third picture it looks like someone once started before? 

[SteamyTea]

Looks like you are going to need a retaining wall of some sort.

Have you thought about how you are going to cope with the rain?

Edited July 31, 2016 by SteamyTea

[TheMitchells]

Looks like a great plot though that back slope would give me some worries - I am a natural born worrier.  Good luck and keep us informed of progress.

 

[Grosey]

Thanks all, yes a fair chunk of my budget is going in to that retaining wall. Builder has quoted me £85k to build a watertight shell which I was pretty happy with, I'll then be managing/completing the build myself inside. 

 

I I bought it off a older chap who lives in the other house you can see in the trees, it's been his project for several years hence the footings are dug (a big reason I was happy to proceed was that building control was ok with the excavation depth). Age and poor health brought him to the realisation that he was never going to complete the build himself...

 

2 days after the sale went through he had a Range Rover Sport and a new boat parked on his drive so he's obviously not feeling too poorly

[janedevon]

Nice one and close by, Tavistock,here looks a great plot and £85000 sounds like a great price to get watertight i didnt manage that lol.

 

 

[Ferdinand]

A workshop the same size as the house has precedent.

 

Can I take the opportunity to repost a linbk to one of my favouirite pieces of writing:

 

http://annaraccoon.com/2014/09/14/one-man-and-his-shed/

 

Ferdinand

[joe90]

37 minutes ago, Ferdinand said:

A workshop the same size as the house has precedent.

 

I fully agree, I have finished my workshop  and my wife asked if the house was going to be as big ?

 

 

Edited July 31, 2016 by joe90
Typo

[Grosey]

The house was designed by the previous owner, a retired builder and now a full time tinkerer so he had much need for a workshop, as well as the double garage.  We will no doubt end up converting it at some point in to a more useable space, a gym, music room, kids (not that we have any yet) play room, or maybe just a studio flat.  Budget and priorities mean for now it will just be left as a cavernous open space to keep a lawnmower in. 

Ground floor plan.pdf

cross sections.pdf

1st floor plan.pdf

loft space plan.pdf

elevations.pdf

[Crofter]

Welcome to BuildHub- yay, I'm no longer the baby of the group!

 

What are you thinking about build method? I presume you will be somewhat constrained by the existing footings.

[JamieM]

Nice site, looks quite private too. 

 

You're probably not looking for any suggestions but have you considered making the dinning/kitchen open plan? Or even just a double door between the two?

 

Also if it were me, I'd change the W.C. to a closet or a walk in wardrobe for bedroom 1 and just have the one main bathroom on the 1st floor. I'm just not a fan of the Jack and Jill bathrooms like you have in your plans (but maybe I'm just odd).

[Grosey]

2 hours ago, JamieM said:

Nice site, looks quite private too. 

 

You're probably not looking for any suggestions but have you considered making the dinning/kitchen open plan? Or even just a double door between the two?

 

Also if it were me, I'd change the W.C. to a closet or a walk in wardrobe for bedroom 1 and just have the one main bathroom on the 1st floor. I'm just not a fan of the Jack and Jill bathrooms like you have in your plans (but maybe I'm just odd).

 

 

Youve basically summed up our own thoughts, I managed to get hold of the original architect and although he is now retired (this house was first designed around 14 years ago!) he has agreed to redraw it with some changes we would like. 

 

Firstly the kitchen/diner/lounge will be all be open plan. 

 

Balcony and rear patio doors will be change to 4000mm wide, then either bifold or 2/4 pane sliders, still undecided. 

 

We have the same thoughts regarding the bathroom setup. With the current layout there will be a main family bathroom that will only actually be used by the 2nd loft bedroom, seems a bit extravagant. I like the downstairs WC just for convenience. Can't make my mind up on the Jack and Jill, some people say they are naff - I don't really have any strong opinions, these will be kids bedrooms and the alternative is just to dedicate the en suite to 1 bedroom, or remove it entirely?

 

Any advice or thoughts are appreciated?

[Ferdinand]

It looks to me as though the area you have got for your Jack and Jill - 1.5m x 3.7m , should be perfectly adequate for two ensuite shower rooms, one for each bedroom.

 

If you nicked an extra bit of width and made them 1.8 x 1.8 each, you might even have space for 2 bathrooms.

 

Personally I'd go for 800m x 1.7 shower trays back to back in the middle so that it would feel really spacious though a smallish room - ie make each bed about 2900 not 3000 wide, then you would roughly 1.7m x 900mm for a loo (corner loo?), vanity and whb in each one with a sliding door at the end.

 

That's not particularly tight, you just need to take care where you place the gubbins.

 

Giving a house several ensuites really affects the feel of the place.

 

Why not turn the main bathroom above in to an ensuite for Bed 3, or give Bed 3 a small ensuite shower room and make it a study?

 

Ferdinand

Edited August 1, 2016 by Ferdinand

[Grosey]

Hmmm, we hadn't thought about chopping the Jack and Jill in half, all our conversations were about giving it to one or the other bedroom. There is opportunity to make 4 en suite rooms quite easily, but not having a main "family bathroom" seems a bit strange.  

[Ferdinand]

13 hours ago, Grosey said:

Hmmm, we hadn't thought about chopping the Jack and Jill in half, all our conversations were about giving it to one or the other bedroom. There is opportunity to make 4 en suite rooms quite easily, but not having a main "family bathroom" seems a bit strange.  

Glad to be of service, as the Bishop said to the Other Bishop. Very generous showers (as opposed to telephone boxes). preferably with big glass screens and no door, are in my view the thing that makes a *huge* difference in making ensuites feel sumptuous if you can do it without making teh whole thing really cramped. If you make them the same footprint as a bath that works well, and can be swapped around later if need be.

 

If you were able to buy 3 or 4 of everything for ensuites that could make quite a saving.

 

You clearly don't belong to Generation Snowflake who have all had ensuites at University in their student bedrooms :-D in exchange for ridiculous charges.

 

Your current design doesn't have a main family bathroom except on the Second Floor which is perhaps itself a little unusual.

 

However, you could easily mitigate that "missing bathroom" feeling in the future by either:

 

1 - create a small ensuite in bed 3, and leave your current main bathroom as a study but with pipes etc behind the studwork so you could make it a family bath room as required eg to sell.

2 -  alternatively leave provision in one of your big ensuites on Floor 2 to insert a door to the landing, and remove the bedroom at that point, so that it could be a family bathroom when required.

 

I have a thing about double bedrooms of at least 10sqm and ensuites because I sometimes rent out shared houses, and it makes it so much easier / civilised.

 

Ferdinand

 

Edited August 2, 2016 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

I've adjusted my view on this layout.

 

I think a consideration should be that the loo flush for each bedroom - the noisiest part of the ensuite - should be next to the wall of the bedroom for which that is the ensuite, so that when A flushed the loo at 3am, B does nto get the noise.

 

One way of doing that would be to put the shower at the far side of each ensuite as you enter from the bedroom.

 

Ferdinand

 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Ferdinand

[Grosey]

1 hour ago, Ferdinand said:

I've adjusted my view on this layout.

 

I think a consideration should be that the loo flush for each bedroom - the noisiest part of the ensuite - should be next to the wall of the bedroom for which that is the ensuite, so that when A flushed the loo at 3am, B does nto get the noise.

 

One way of doing that would be to put the shower at the far side of each ensuite as you enter from the bedroom.

 

Ferdinand

 

 

 

Thanks Ferdinand, we are seriously considering your idea, probably 1 ensuite bathroom and 1 ensuite showeroom. Bathroom would have the window. Need to find a suitable way of scale drawing the layouts and playing around with sizing etc

 

Any suitable design software packages or shall I just go for good old graph paper?

 

Also slightly concerned about water efficiency calculations - to be honest this is something I'm going to have to research a lot more but is increasing the number of bathrooms going to affect this?

 

Thanks

 

Neil

[Ferdinand]

36 minutes ago, Grosey said:

 

 

Thanks Ferdinand, we are seriously considering your idea, probably 1 ensuite bathroom and 1 ensuite showeroom. Bathroom would have the window. Need to find a suitable way of scale drawing the layouts and playing around with sizing etc

 

Any suitable design software packages or shall I just go for good old graph paper?

 

Also slightly concerned about water efficiency calculations - to be honest this is something I'm going to have to research a lot more but is increasing the number of bathrooms going to affect this?

 

Thanks

 

Neil

Start a separate thread on that unless there is an existing one as others have experience.

 

Presumably things like aerating taps etc have an effect, and there are quirks in the calculation which iirc is a little eccentric and down to local interpretation.

 

You could also eg arrange your "Jack and Jill" in such a way that it could be split in 2 with the addition of a stud wall and the extra fittings etc, or make half of it into a walk in wardrobe for the first year.

 

Ferdinand

 

[Nickfromwales]

I'd seriously consider smaller ensuites to 1&2, and have the soil and vent pipe outboard unless it can be first fixed sympathetically to the new split design. I'd also look at two windows, one and one, and making each one say 300mm wide x 800mm high so both rooms get natural light and an opening window for fresh air circulation. Having any bathroom without a window isn't preferable IMHO. Go for smaller cube or rectangular showers and if there's room left at the end of each one them, then that's the best place for the towel rads so you don't burn your arse when brushing your teeth.  

Some very good advice from @Ferdinand there. , particularly like the idea of first fixing the study for conversion later down the line. Deffo go all ensuite now, as converting the study later will get you ready for retail sale comfortably. You could even use that as a sales tool " you choose the suite and the tiles, and we'll fit it ready for you to move in ". 

Leave some strategically places hot / cold / central heating pipes in the ceiling void of the ground floor 'mother of all mower sheds' for attachment to later in life, likewise with a gas / large electric cable for the cooker ( if it ever becomes self contained eg you take to long building it and YOU end up living with the mower  ). 

 

[Ferdinand]

There is a further option for 1 and 2 which I haven't discussed, and that is to have 2 narrow ensuites back to back - which I assume is what @Nickfromwales is implying by 2 windows.

 

If pushed, an ensuite shower / loo / whb can be fitting into around 0.8x1.8m or 1.0x1.4m, which would let you do 2 back to back in the space you have or a little more generously in the space with a little extra nicked from the bedrooms, and have more left over for something else.

 

An example of a not particularly compact example is here:

http://ukbathroomguru.com/adding-a-small-en-suite-shower-room/

 

These are 2 links you may find useful:

 

Plans: http://www.houseplanshelper.com/small-bathroom-floor-plans.html

Rules: http://www.houseplanshelper.com/bathroom-dimensions.html

 

Also lots on Pinterest but they spam you to register.

 

I have an Ikea whb called a Lillangen, which is 400 deep and 600 wide, with a "stand things here" build-in shelf behind the bowl and vanity unit for about £200 iirc. Good but needs effort to keep clean (wipe every day). The extra width prevents it feeling mean and it is the right shape for cleaning boots.

http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/00135419/#/30135432

 

But there are plenty of options about. Just take the time to let the concept steep in your head.

 

There is also a thread on ebuild about thin partition wall construction, where amongst others Jeremy talked about his compact walk-in-wardrobe. Photos are inaccessible but that wouid be a good thread for someone to move over (you know you want to). You could get your partition wall down to 60mm thick or so. 

http://www.ebuild.co.uk/topic/14367-building-a-thin-partition-wall-how-thin-can-i-go/

 

If you could take your space depth up to 1900mm or 2000mm between the two rooms, you could even plan a 1.8mx0.8m to 2.0m x 1m shower ensuite each side (760mm x 1m shower inside side with no door and shower head on bedroom wall to avoid splash (*), whb facing, loo against external wall with window - big mirror above the whb facing the sliding (?) door to make it feel larger), and then leave space for a 1.5m x 900 deep L-shaped "stand in" wardrobe for each room, with storage at the back and the side.

 

You then need to work out how to get it past the regulators :-).

 

(Update: you *could* look at ensuite pods, which could simplify your construction, as used in student accommodation etc - from a couple of thousand each. Suspect most here won't go for that option, though - too easy! )

 

Ferdinand

 

(*) I hate moving doors on showers.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said:

I'd seriously consider smaller ensuites to 1&2, and have the soil and vent pipe outboard unless it can be first fixed sympathetically to the new split design. I'd also look at two windows, one and one, and making each one say 300mm wide x 800mm high so both rooms get natural light and an opening window for fresh air circulation. Having any bathroom without a window isn't preferable IMHO. Go for smaller cube or rectangular showers and if there's room left at the end of each one them, then that's the best place for the towel rads so you don't burn your arse when brushing your teeth.  

Some very good advice from @Ferdinand there. , particularly like the idea of first fixing the study for conversion later down the line. Deffo go all ensuite now, as converting the study later will get you ready for retail sale comfortably. You could even use that as a sales tool " you choose the suite and the tiles, and we'll fit it ready for you to move in ". 

Leave some strategically places hot / cold / central heating pipes in the ceiling void of the ground floor 'mother of all mower sheds' for attachment to later in life, likewise with a gas / large electric cable for the cooker ( if it ever becomes self contained eg you take to long building it and YOU end up living with the mower  ). 

 

Thought you might like that, Nick.

 

More work for plumbers !

 

F

[Grosey]

1 hour ago, Ferdinand said:

There is a further option for 1 and 2 which I haven't discussed, and that is to have 2 narrow ensuites back to back - which I assume is what @Nickfromwales is implying by 2 windows.

 

If pushed, an ensuite shower / loo / whb can be fitting into around 0.8x1.8m or 1.0x1.4m, which would let you do 2 back to back in the space you have or a little more generously in the space with a little extra nicked from the bedrooms, and have more left over for something else.

 

An example of a not particularly compact example is here:

http://ukbathroomguru.com/adding-a-small-en-suite-shower-room/

 

These are 2 links you may find useful:

 

Plans: http://www.houseplanshelper.com/small-bathroom-floor-plans.html

Rules: http://www.houseplanshelper.com/bathroom-dimensions.html

 

Also lots on Pinterest but they spam you to register.

 

I have an Ikea whb called a Lillangen, which is 400 deep and 600 wide, with a "stand things here" build-in shelf behind the bowl and vanity unit for about £200 iirc. Good but needs effort to keep clean (wipe every day). The extra width prevents it feeling mean and it is the right shape for cleaning boots.

http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/00135419/#/30135432

 

But there are plenty of options about. Just take the time to let the concept steep in your head.

 

There is also a thread on ebuild about thin partition wall construction, where amongst others Jeremy talked about his compact walk-in-wardrobe. Photos are inaccessible but that wouid be a good thread for someone to move over (you know you want to). You could get your partition wall down to 60mm thick or so. 

http://www.ebuild.co.uk/topic/14367-building-a-thin-partition-wall-how-thin-can-i-go/

 

If you could take your space depth up to 1900mm or 2000mm between the two rooms, you could even plan a 1.8mx0.8m to 2.0m x 1m shower ensuite each side (760mm x 1m shower inside side with no door and shower head on bedroom wall to avoid splash (*), whb facing, loo against external wall with window - big mirror above the whb facing the sliding (?) door to make it feel larger), and then leave space for a 1.5m x 900 deep L-shaped "stand in" wardrobe for each room, with storage at the back and the side.

 

You then need to work out how to get it past the regulators :-).

 

(Update: you *could* look at ensuite pods, which could simplify your construction, as used in student accommodation etc - from a couple of thousand each. Suspect most here won't go for that option, though - too easy! )

 

Ferdinand

 

(*) I hate moving doors on showers.

 

 

 

 now my brain really hurts!