Windows delivered - wrong internal finish/colour

[AppleDown]

Hello all. Been a long time since I updated you on our build. We have just taken delivery of the windows - I'll not mention the company at the moment, but they're Rationel AURAPLUS (ali clad timber, triple glazed).

 

We were very clear with the company that we wanted anthracite exterior (on the ali clad portion) and internal we wanted a plain timber finish so we could oil/stain/paint whatever colour we wanted. Every conversation we had with the sales person taking the order mentioned this, and at no point have we ever said we wanted anthracite on the inside (only ever plain or washed white).

 

They turn up yesterday and it's solid anthracite both external and internal.

 

I've checked back through our comms and the initial contract with the details - this didn't include a specific reference to the internal colour, as it was clear in the email comms with the sales person we hadn't decided, only external colour being anthracite. We then followed up with the sales person two weeks later to confirm the internal colour preference - non-painted, plain wood. In fact, he was the one who reached out to us - and then he confirmed in reply the colour choice and stated they would inform the surveyor too. At that point the surveyor attended site, took measurements and confirmed that. From then on there was no further request for clarification on colour etc.

 

Where do we stand? I've raised it as quickly as possible with them, and they have replied on email stating they will look into this ASAP.

 

I would assume that because it's clear in the comms what we wanted and confirmed by them, that we're in a good position. They are obviously not going to want 20+custom windows returned.

[Redbeard]

2 minutes ago, AppleDown said:

They are obviously not going to want 20+custom windows returned.

But that's their (or the sales person's) problem. They have delivered what you didn't order, and you want what you did order. You have every right to ask them to take these away and let you know when the correct ones are ready for delivery. If this will screw up your timetable then maybe there is a 'bird-in-the-hand argument which could be won by an additional discount.

 

AFAICS you hold all the cards at this stage.

[craig]

What did you sign off and approve?

 

Communication is great and that clear instructions have been supplied but generally, speaking

 

1: no finish by factory and just plain wood, invalidates any warranties (usually). 

2: Signed order is yours or your appointees responsibility to check, amend/approve.
 

They could play hardball here, what you signed is what you ordered. Do they have any responsibility? Morally I would say yes but contractually is a different thing. 
 

Edit: Of course they won’t be wanting the windows returned, they’ll need to reorder the whole order at their cost.

 

Are the windows all the right size, just internally the wrong colour? Be prepared to negotiate. This will have a negative impact on the build, additional costs incurred for other trades and you.

 

Think of accepting a settlement at 50% refund and go from there.

Edited 19 hours ago by craig

[Nestor]

Did they not supply a schedule for each window to sign off, similar to the example below.

[Conor]

We had a similar issue with a door frame. We didn't want the faff of removal and waiting months for a replacement, so we compromised and they sent somebody out to spray paint the inside. Flawless and you woulnt know the difference unless you got down and had a really close look. 

 

Start thinking along those lines and what compromise you might be willing to meet. 

 

As above, all comes down to the spec / order sheet you signed. our window were very thorough and clear in this regard. Had a simple one pager with the big items like quantity, colours, spec, and then a full booklet with the extreme details of every individual unit.

Edited 18 hours ago by Conor

[ProDave]

When we bought our Rationel windows, a timber internal finish was not an option.  I understand it has been reinstated but it won't be bare wood, it will be laquered.

 

As above we had a full schedule to check including internal ans external colours and RAL numbers etc.

 

If painting the inside yourself is your plan this may not be a deal breaker though?  Only such if you really wanted a timber finish.

 

Time to dig out ALL the paperwork and go through it with a fine tooth comb.

 

I caution that because I know someone that ordered an Oak staircase and all the communication mentioned the floor to floor height they wanted, but then when the final schedule arrived for checking, that drawing showed the floor to floor height wrong, and the stairs did not fit.  But because they signed that drawing without properly checking, the manufacturer rejected any claim.

[AppleDown]

Thanks all. I think it's a bit hazier than I originally thought.

 

@craig and @Nestor this is where it does get a little confusing. The initial signed contract order form mentions the grey RAL for both internal and external - BUT, the conversations around this (and within the email chain where this was returned) clearly state that internal is TBC and will be confirmed. It is then confirmed with the same Sales rep a week later in an email he sent me requiring confirmation of our choice, and then acknowledged that this would be sent to the surveyor and amended. At no point during any of our conversations prior to or after the contract did we ever say we wanted grey internally - and in fact, we clearly stated we wanted plain wood or white washed from the very first email conversation.

 

In addition to the confirmation on colour - the same email also contained confirmation of in/out opening, hanging side etc. which was clearly taken on board as those are correct in what they have installed.

 

I'm sure they will do everything possible to highlight the signed document as confirmation - but the specific requests and replies from the Sales rep in my eyes forms a confirmation of change.

[Nestor]

44 minutes ago, AppleDown said:

Thanks all. I think it's a bit hazier than I originally thought.

 

The initial signed contract order form mentions the grey RAL for both internal and external - BUT, the conversations around this

As you say a little hazy.

 

The signed contract is a legally binding agreement, unless you are the government but hopefully you have written email evidence confirming your conversations.

 

I would try and keep the suppliers onside for as long as possible before you go medieval on them, perhaps a significant discount would be best.

 

Good luck.

[Temp]

7 hours ago, AppleDown said:

and then he confirmed in reply the colour choice

 

I hope that was by email.  Contact them ASAP. 

 

Perhaps decide beforehand how much of a discount would persuade you to keep them.

 

I would also measure them all to make sure there aren't other issues.

[Kelvin]

Hence the importance of receiving a final window schedule that you approve. There were several errors in our window schedule.  
 

Why can’t they still be painted whichever colour you want? Negotiate a discount and for them to cover the cost of painting. Windows have a long lead time so you really want them installed. 
 

Ours are clear coat, which was an option, raw timber wasn’t an option as it impacted the warranty. 

Edited 13 hours ago by Kelvin

[AppleDown]

13 minutes ago, Kelvin said:

Hence the importance of receiving a final window schedule that you approve. There were several errors in our window schedule.  
 

Why can’t they still be painted whichever colour you want? Negotiate a discount and for them to cover the cost of painting. Windows have a long lead time so you really want them installed. 
 

Ours are clear coat, which was an option, raw timber wasn’t an option as it impacted the warranty. 

Correct, I believe there would be a clear coat - my comms just referenced 'plain wood' compared to painted.

 

It's a super smooth finish, so I would expect that they need to be sprayed. So glass etc. protected, sanded down, sprayed. But it'll be a big job. Happy for them to do that, but just trying to understand what my moves should be...

 

At the moment it sounds like the best strategy is to say we don't want them and that it wasn't what was ordered - so either you take them all and make good, or you fix the issue and compensate us for the trouble.

[JohnMo]

Did you pay additional money for the two finishes, one colour inside and out, requires no masking up, so is easy. A different finish inside and out costs due to the additional time needed. We had to pay quite a premium to get two different finishes inside and out.

[bmj1]

While we're on the topic, we ordered some bespoke internal doors. We had ~10 iterations of the drawings.

 

On the 9th drawing, all looked good, apart from a minor issue on one of the doors. We requested this was amended and a 10th drawing was issued.

 

On the 10th drawing, our designer reviewed the change and signed off the drawing set.

 

However, inexplicably, the handle positions on another set of doors changed between the 9th and 10th drawing. And suddenly, instead of the handles being positioned for a double pocket door, they were positioned for a regular double door set (so both in the wrong place).

 

Unfortunately, this all becomes rather shaky territory.

 

A compromise is likely in order..

[AppleDown]

2 hours ago, JohnMo said:

Did you pay additional money for the two finishes, one colour inside and out, requires no masking up, so is easy. A different finish inside and out costs due to the additional time needed. We had to pay quite a premium to get two different finishes inside and out.

As they're aluminium clad, it should just be the aluminium portion that's grey - it would probably end up cheaper by not painting them.

[craig]

Where the confirmations before or after the signed order? It’s what is on the signed order report that’s important here.

 

Clearly they have ****ed up and not followed instructions. As for extra costs incurred for two tone, I still don’t get that tbh. and I’m in the industry.

 

Timber is sprayed inside and out the same colour/lacquer. Aluminium cladding is from their supplier and powder coated.

 

Different colour costs for two tone, just don’t make sense. They don’t have to change the spray booth to paint the cladding a different colour.

 

Trust me, sanding, spraying will not be done or offered. The costs alone are prohibitive.

 

It’s make a deal on what you have, they accept and make new windows or a legal battle.

Edited 8 hours ago by craig

[Andehh]

Am easy Internal paint job for a magic man type mobile painter.....and you'll be better off for it without the risk of wet wood from condensation. 

 

We went through similar, wanted one large single pane of glass and some bastard stuck central mullion in them all... Was devastated for weeks, but on the survey paperwork it had been added and builder had missed it.

 

Builder paid for whole new windows in the kitchen where the mullion was in your face, and was apologetic and mee and we accepted the rest. We just ducked it up, and 2 years later it's not cross my mind for weeks.

 

We could have gone to war with the builder, but whichever way you cut it... We'd have ended up paying one way it another. 

 

 

[Bonner]

Suggest you accept compensation and then get them painted when the build has finished. You might even come round to liking the colour! I have slate grey inside which contrasts with the internal walls and frames the views nicely.