Acceptable gap between frame and structure?

[joe90]

Don’t talk to me about judges decisions 🤯(rant over)

[craig]

20 hours ago, saveasteading said:

 

Can i suggest that it isn't as simple (one way or the other,) as some are suggesting here?

 

Can I counter this by saying that the responsibility for the survey lays squarely at the suppliers feet. Their measurements and unless based on incorrect information being supplied, their fault.

 

There is a reasonable claim that these can be made good but they do need to accept some responsibility & @ggc on the options of making good and the supplier paying towards the costs.

[saveasteading]

6 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

how come the appeal judge who got it wrong and wasn't sacked after being proven wrong ? 

Because judges "don't get it wrong. They make a decision based on the law. Then at appeal that may be reversed  and at reappeal it may be reinstated. 

Common sense does not necessarily have anything to do with it.

Try reading the judgments. 

 

If it was simple then there would be no need for juries or judges.

[saveasteading]

6 hours ago, Adsibob said:

Ruxley

Yes Ruxley indeed. The number of times I have heard this quoted by lawyers, either in seminars or real cases.

The main point they were making was that this judgement seemed ludicrous but was strictly what the law stipulated.

In Ruxley, if I remember, the minimum depth of the pool was even stressed as a fundamental requirement, yet the ruling was that it was not so important.

Logically if your windows end up 1% smaller*, I can see the judgement being for a credit of 1% of the contract. 

 

* smaller than what?  We don't have the drawings or spec.

 

The last thing ggc needs is to be famous (and impoverished) for the case of ggc v Bloggs Glazing.

 

I'm not saying for a moment that the glazing co is blameless. Just to stress...is it such a big deal?  And don't get legal.

 

(I think there was another swimming pool case where an Olympic pool was short between touch pads. That was however judged to be crucial.) i

Irrelevant to ggc of course.

We should have a button for " transfer discussion  to new topic".

[Iceverge]

@ggc

 

Sorry to hear about this mess. It's really no fun at all.

 

The large gap between the frame and the wall isn't acceptable. If they plan to just foam it a rat could easily make a nest in there.  They should employ some joiners to make the window openings fit the windows by adding timber rips to the openings and compensate you for the change in rendering. 

 

It would be nice to have brand new correctly fitting windows but some allowance needs to be made for human error I think.

 

Some people drive perfectly to the rules of the road and still have crashes where a more sympathetic driver might have allowed for someone else's mistake. It's taken me a while to realise that the second driver is better for us all. 

 

If buying off plan you probably wouldn't even notice the 30mm but a good supplier should be happy to meet you in the middle here. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by Iceverge

[saveasteading]

17 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

Stabbers go free yet a farmer who dredged a short stretch of river gets locked up. Madness

They don't equate. No comment on 'the stabber' because i know nothing of the case.

 

I wouldnt normally get drawn into this, as being political, but it is to do with drainage and the environment so is a diversion, but construction relevant.

 

Here is what the farmer did to an SSI.

 

For some reason, some farmers seem to think that deepening a river locally makes it flow faster. I've come across this before.

 

Taking away the banks does, and increases flooding downstream, and aids his fertiisers and runoff passage to the river.

I suspect he just thought he would get away with it.

 

 

[Dave Jones]

8 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

They don't equate. No comment on 'the stabber' because i know nothing of the case.

 

I wouldnt normally get drawn into this, as being political, but it is to do with drainage and the environment so is a diversion, but construction relevant.

 

Here is what the farmer did to an SSI.

 

For some reason, some farmers seem to think that deepening a river locally makes it flow faster. I've come across this before.

 

Taking away the banks does, and increases flooding downstream, and aids his fertiisers and runoff passage to the river.

I suspect he just thought he would get away with it.

 

 

 

what im saying is what is the point of jail time, not like he's a risk to the community. Idiotic decision and a cheaper more relevant punishment should have been used. re- stabbers - judges failing to send just under half of all repeat knife carrier to prison. 

 

Judges should be replaced with a small (say 3 or 5) panel of normal joe public to decide their fate should a jury convict, nothing off the table punishment wise that is within the law. Hard labour being one of the options. Ask a trade who's van has been emptied a couple times by burglar if he thinks a community order would be sufficient deterrent for example. 

 

 

 

 

[joe90]

3 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

what im saying is what is the point of jail time, not like he's a risk to the community. Idiotic decision and a cheaper more relevant punishment should have been used. re- stabbers - judges failing to send just under half of all repeat knife carrier to prison. 

I totally agree, fine him heavily (money put to good use) rather than cost the taxpayer £££££ to house and feed him for months.

[saveasteading]

4 minutes ago, joe90 said:

 

 I'm not responding again because it is so off the subject.

[joe90]

8 minutes ago, saveasteading said:

 I'm not responding again because it is so off the subject.

Sorry, yes I would not worry about 100mm frame off 75mm wall plate.

[Ferdinand]

8 hours ago, saveasteading said:

They don't equate. No comment on 'the stabber' because i know nothing of the case.

 

I wouldnt normally get drawn into this, as being political, but it is to do with drainage and the environment so is a diversion, but construction relevant.

 

Here is what the farmer did to an SSI.

 

For some reason, some farmers seem to think that deepening a river locally makes it flow faster. I've come across this before.

 

Taking away the banks does, and increases flooding downstream, and aids his fertiisers and runoff passage to the river.

I suspect he just thought he would get away with it.

 

 

 

Reading that one (and off topic) I'm surprised the old scroat got off so lightly.

 

He's done similar before going back 25 years, and clearly thinks he is above the law where the law is inconvenient for him, even when it comes to damaging an SSI for which he is responsible, a salmon (and other species) river.

 

He has a long history of similar vandalism, reading the history.

 

It was an open and shut case, as he entered a guilty plea - so the sentence would be more like 18 months than the 12 he received. Plus 1.25m court and reinstatement costs.

 

I'd be happier with more like 4 years for a (£25m) multimillionaire who thinks laws simply don't apply to him. Pour encourager les autres.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-65339969.amp

[SteamyTea]

22 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

Judges should be replaced with a small (say 3 or 5) panel of normal joe public to decide their fate should a jury convict,

I have done jury service.

If you want to see ignorance of the law, unbridled hatred of certain groups of people, having to put up with the workshy who prefer being in a clean and cosy courthouse as they get paid the same as working in the cold meat processing factory, a self elected jury foreman that had egotistical and bullying tendencies. And one bloke that had an IQ if probably 75. Plus half of the jury doing private research i.e. googling and discussing with 'outsiders'.

Swapping evidence, as presented in court for opinion, scenarios and by bigotry was normal.

 

Then, all but two of us, totally ignored the judges guidance, and found the person guilty.

The guidance was that the the witnesses had been made to lie by the plaintiff, and the plaintiff was unreliable.

Even the police said the plaintiff was a fantasist and had accused many people in the past.

Jury trails, no (expletive deleted)ing way, it is as corrupt as the target driven CPS.

30 years since Steven Lawrence for murdered. The spotlight is on the MET, not on the thugs that did the crime.

30 (expletive deleted)ing years, half my life.

Only 2 or the 5 suspected of the murder got locked up.

Edited April 23, 2023 by SteamyTea

[Dave Jones]

there isnt a better alternative to a jury of your peers. Police standards have slipped soo low i would not believe a word they said in court without irrefutable evidence to corroborate it.

 

We should adopt more of the American system as well, elected Judges, Elected Local sheriff, Elected Prosecutor.

 

This would focus their minds to concentrate on the publics priorities not woke crap coming out of whitehall.

[SteamyTea]

2 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

We should adopt more of the American system as well, elected Judges, Elected Local sheriff, Elected Prosecutor

Really.

So recent US events concerning women's fertility don't bother you at all?

 

[saveasteading]

This is getting very Daily Mail.

 

I'm turning this discussion off.

 

Ggc good luck with your windows. 

Start the question again if you want to.

[Adsibob]

1 hour ago, Dave Jones said:

We should adopt more of the American system as well, elected Judges, Elected Local sheriff, Elected Prosecutor.

Good grief no. I bet you voted for Brexit and would vote for Trump if you lived in the US.

[SteamyTea]

31 minutes ago, Adsibob said:

vote for Trump

Enough party members voted for Truss, so Trump is unneeded as the Truss legacy is still carrying on.

[Nickfromwales]

21 hours ago, saveasteading said:

 I'm not responding again because it is so off the subject.

Thanks!

 

@All

Ahem!

 

Lets shut this digression down please, as it is now doing nothing for the topic / OP!!

[HughF]

On 21/04/2023 at 10:25, saveasteading said:

 

It assumes that a glazing company is aware of all possible construction options, and that it was clear on detailed drawings (if they existed) or on site, that the windows were not to be in the block section.

 

If a glazing company doesn't know what a check reveal is, and how to measure one, they shouldn't be in the glazing business...

[saveasteading]

3 minutes ago, HughF said:

they shouldn't be in the glazing business...

I suppose I'm saying that the drawings aren't always clear (or exist at all) and the construction may be partial. But I'm not a glazier and always used the one we knew and trusted....I have met others I wouldn't. 

[HughF]

1 minute ago, saveasteading said:

I suppose I'm saying that the drawings aren't always clear (or exist at all) and the construction may be partial. But I'm not a glazier and always used the one we knew and trusted....I have met others I wouldn't. 

You don't even need drawings... Scotland = check reveals...

 

Simple...

[saveasteading]

3 minutes ago, HughF said:

Scotland = check reveals...

But 97% of my work was in England, and I don't think I ever had a window to do in Scotland.   I have no idea if that is relevant though!

I may look up ' check reveal' later.

[HughF]

1 minute ago, saveasteading said:

But 97% of my work was in England, and I don't think I ever had a window to do in Scotland.   I have no idea if that is relevant though!

I may look up ' check reveal' later.

I would 100% expect a window company to know that check reveals are a thing in Scotland. It's really unacceptable that the OP has been messed about because of this incompetence by the window companies surveyor.