VAT on Polish imports?

[KTB]

By way of an update - And, a warning to others on the site.

 

The installer has been paid 60% of the total cost for the job in Nov and Dec (Tens of thousands of pounds). He has obviously not passed all of this on to the supplier but spent a fair proportion of it, implying major cash flow issues, then panicked and asked for another 8K in VAT when we were not due it and would never have seen it again had it been paid. He then came back again, saying unless we paid the FULL BALANCE of the whole supply/install by 4pm that day, the windows and doors would not be loaded on the lorry in Poland.

 

We then contacted the supplier directly, in an attempt to pay the balance of the materials and expedite delivery, but they refused direct payment and backed up their installers position, stating he was a "trusted partner". The position now is that the supplier will not answer our emails or telephone calls, referring us to sort it out with the installer, the installer continues to demand the whole balance by tomorrow and is unable to take a credit card payment to protect our outlay. We are, effectively, being extorted.

 

We feel that, if we pay the balance in full tomorrow, we will be left with a lorry load of kit dumped on our site and will never see the installer again. At no stage has any customer service or consideration been anywhere near this transaction. We are simply left, pondering legal action, with our build on hold.

 

The supplier of the windows/doors is a major European company based in Poland.

 

Their agent is based in Central Scotland.

 

If anybody wants details at this stage, PM us and we are happy to share. We are consulting solicitors re: hitting social media and going public.

 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by KTB

[Bozza]

I feel terrible for you. 
 

Personally I would stand my ground, if your contract is water tight.  Yes there is a risk you won’t get the windows and potentially lose what you’ve paid if the fitter goes under.  

 

Giving them the remaining 40% is high risk in my opinion.  You are in a Mexican stand off.  If you don’t back down that’s going to be a problem between the “trusted” fitter and their supplier that not bring your problem.

 

If you do lose the money, what percentage is that v your ultimate profit made through your self build.  See it like that, if that helps in any way. 
 

during my project i stood my ground on the cost of putting right a mistake my builder made.  I reverted back to nice guy thereafter.  
 

 

 

[Bozza]

What do you decide to do @KTB?

[KTB]

We are still in a Mexican stand off. Installer demanding all the money, supplier saying it's nothing to do with them. We have offered the balance of what he owes the supplier, with the rest lodged at our solicitors until the job is finished to our sign off. Don't think he has the cash to pay for the windows and doors, as it appears he has spent it. Awaiting his next move. Meanwhile, another week of scaffolding costs and another week lost from the blockwork schedule.

 

Very frustrating and costly. Read the small print and never do anything that isn't in writing. Lesson learned.

[Temp]

What did the original quote say about stage payments? 

 

[KTB]

23 hours ago, Temp said:

What did the original quote say about stage payments? 

 

Nothing - He's been making it all up as he went along. Going to the solicitor tomorrow morning.

[markharro]

Did you finally manage to get this resolved - sounds a nightmare?

 

On a connected point we are thinking of buying doors direct from a Polish company. From reading this thread if I contract directly for purchase as a self - builder I can expect that UK vat will be added to the price but I can then reclaim at the end of the build?

 

Someone mentioned import duties - anyone know anything about that? Brexit literally makes me angry every single day!

[andyscotland]

@markharro yes - if you buy direct you will be charged UK VAT (same as if you bought supply-only from a UK company) and can reclaim that along with your materials, assuming you're eligible for the self-build scheme.

 

Import duty is complex but I *think* if the doors are wood https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/headings/4418?day=8&month=2&year=2023 or aluminium https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/commodities/7610100000?country=PL# and all components are made in Poland then the rate is 0% - but I'm not certain on this.

[CalvinHobbes]

On 08/02/2023 at 07:22, andyscotland said:

@markharro yes - if you buy direct you will be charged UK VAT (same as if you bought supply-only from a UK company) and can reclaim that along with your materials, assuming you're eligible for the self-build scheme.

 

Import duty is complex but I *think* if the doors are wood https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/headings/4418?day=8&month=2&year=2023 or aluminium https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/commodities/7610100000?country=PL# and all components are made in Poland then the rate is 0% - but I'm not certain on this.

We are in NI and getting a quote from Fenbro in Poland for our windows and doors. This is what I was told..

• Is the purchase for an individual need? Or is this a business purchase (VAT 0%)?

  This is new build so we are exempt from VAT in the UK. I hope it applies with you too. 

  Unfortunately something like this doesn't apply here, we have to pay VAT regardless of whether this is new building or replacement. (with fitting it's 13.5%) 

   

  Presumably if we order direct and use their fitters we can reclaim the 13.5% from HMRC?

[Temp]

On 07/02/2023 at 21:22, markharro said:

On a connected point we are thinking of buying doors direct from a Polish company. From reading this thread if I contract directly for purchase as a self - builder I can expect that UK vat will be added to the price but I can then reclaim at the end of the build?

 

Someone mentioned import duties - anyone know anything about that? Brexit literally makes me angry every single day!

 

I ask if the company has exported to the UK since Brexit and ideally direct to end customers not just companies. Ask for any numbers they need from you.

 

In the EU companies are used to asking for an EORI number which is a bit like a company ID number. I don't think they need one to ship to the UK but I suspect some shipping companies always ask for it just to cover all bases and avoid hold up at ports. If I remember correctly someone on the forum was able to register and get an EORI Number but as I said I don't think it's needed to import to the UK. 

 

Remember to try and pay at least the deposit (>£100) on a credit card if you can.

 

[Temp]

2 hours ago, CalvinHobbes said:

We are in NI and getting a quote from Fenbro in Poland for our windows and doors. This is what I was told..

• Is the purchase for an individual need? Or is this a business purchase (VAT 0%)?

  This is new build so we are exempt from VAT in the UK. I hope it applies with you too. 

  Unfortunately something like this doesn't apply here, we have to pay VAT regardless of whether this is new building or replacement. (with fitting it's 13.5%) 

   

  Presumably if we order direct and use their fitters we can reclaim the 13.5% from HMRC?

 

Pretty sure you can't reclaim Polish VAT from HMRC any more. Was possible pre Brexit.

 

Think they are meant to export free of Polish VAT. If they say they cannot export without charging Polish VAT you might have to live with that. But beware you will probably get hit for UK VAT as well. At least the UK VAT you can reclaim.

 

In some cases EU countries can register with HMRC and charge you UK VAT (20%) but i think this is mainly companies like Amazon ES.

 

 

 

 

[markc]

Vat is a tax on consumption, anything exported does not attract VAT. No reason for any organisation to charge VAT as long as the goods are transported by courier or haulage company etc. as that is sufficient proof it will not be ‘consumed’ locally.

if you were to buy and collect yourself then you would pay VAT but be able to claim back when the goods cross the border.

[andyscotland]

17 hours ago, CalvinHobbes said:

We are in NI and getting a quote from Fenbro in Poland for our windows and doors. This is what I was told..

• Is the purchase for an individual need? Or is this a business purchase (VAT 0%)?

  This is new build so we are exempt from VAT in the UK. I hope it applies with you too. 

  Unfortunately something like this doesn't apply here, we have to pay VAT regardless of whether this is new building or replacement. (with fitting it's 13.5%) 

   

  Presumably if we order direct and use their fitters we can reclaim the 13.5% from HMRC?

 

As per @markc and @Temp an EU supplier should not charge any VAT if they are exporting to any customer outside the EU https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/taxation/vat/cross-border-vat/index_en.htm#outsidetheeusellgoods-1 - this is different to the rules for exporting within the EU (where it depends on business/personal status of the customer).

 

If the supplier incorrectly charges you foreign VAT you will not be able to reclaim it.

 

If you are not VAT registered you will be charged UK VAT on arrival of goods in the UK, this can be reclaimed from HMRC on the normal self-build scheme.

 

The only thing I'm not certain of is what VAT territory NI is in at the moment. I am pretty sure it's UK (therefore outside EU) but it's possible there's something in the protocol that fudges that and treats you as being within EU for exports... Worth double checking.

[CalvinHobbes]

Thanks, I think NI has some sort of different status re EU and negotiations appear to be firming up some sort of special status. 

Edited February 12, 2023 by CalvinHobbes

[Tosh]

From a polish importers site https://debesto.com/en/blog/import-windows-from-poland-to-uk-after-brexit/

[dpmiller]

^ that's GB-centric tho, by the looks of it. NI is a wee bit different...