Passivhaus window suppliers to UK - recommendations

[markharro]

Apart from Green Building Store, Internorm and Rationel can anyone recommend any other suppliers of triple glazed PH rated windows? Ideally you have installed yourself and can speak from experience in terms of dealing with the company/cost etc? Thanks

I should say that I am particularly interested in any Lift and Slide doors that have low profile frames but are still passive rated. For standard windows this is less of an issue.

Also any tips on PH rated entrance doors would be useful thanks.

[Wumpus]

You could take a look at Norrsken, who are doing our windows. They are certainly at the level of insulation and air tightness needed for PH and found them to be competitive on pricing. Their lift and slide is not super slim, 202mm deep, but very solid.

[SimonD]

I can recommend Nordvest windows - https://nordvest.co.uk/  - very flexible re designs, PH level where required and bang on re delivery timescales. When I ordered mine, they gave me a delivery week and delivered that week absolutely as promised and this was in the middle of Covid. They were the only window company that could provide all my windows and door sizes without any compromises.

 

[Nickfromwales]

1 hour ago, SimonD said:

I can recommend Nordvest windows - https://nordvest.co.uk/  - very flexible re designs, PH level where required and bang on re delivery timescales. When I ordered mine, they gave me a delivery week and delivered that week absolutely as promised and this was in the middle of Covid. They were the only window company that could provide all my windows and door sizes without any compromises.

 

How did they compare on price? Did you get ( like for like ) quotes from anywhere else?

[SimonD]

5 hours ago, Nickfromwales said:

How did they compare on price? Did you get ( like for like ) quotes from anywhere else?

 

I got as close to like for like quotes as I could from the list of:

 

Norrsken
Nordan
Rationel
Green Building Store

Jeldwen (priced direct with them rather than through a merchant)

and a couple of others.

ages ago I'd also got a quote from Velfac but this was for Aluminium windows the architect spec'd rather than timber we eventually went for.

 

They were competitive price wise and rather than relying on a ridiculous negotiation process for the sake of it, just gave us a good price up front. About 7k or so less than GBS for 3g windows that had a whole window average u-value of 1.05 including the doors (We weren't looking for PH performance in ours so didn't spec this) . The Nordvest windows were slightly better on G-value (we've got lots of south facing windows shielded from summer sun with large overhang but wanted the winter gain - and can attest now that this works well). Rationel was the best quote on base price but Rationel couldn't do our 1st floor egress window as designed, nor could they do our front door IIRC, nor did they include the sills or transport in the quote.

 

With Nordvest they quoted including timber sills, pretty much everyone else wanted extra for the sills of course, especially the aluminium ones. Nordvest also included transport in their quote so you basically knew everything was covered.

 

What really made the difference with Nordvest is that they actually looked at the designs and window schedule and instead of just quoting for what was on there, they came back and suggested alternative arrangements for window openings etc. So, for example, they suggested tilt and turn windows at some places and fully reversible top swing in others etc. With the front door, I think only one other company could do our size and Nordvest said they only supply front doors with an Accoya external face and it was to be steel reinforced due to the size, which was reassuring.

 

I also like their window profile which was 109mm deep x 56mm. This helped because with their frames I was able to bring them out further from the timber frame to cover the 50mm  insulation installed externally and not have to use deep aluminium sills. I only needed 65mm timber sills rather than the 120 + mm aluminium ones.

 

There are also some other neat additions to the design. For example, even on the timber only windows they include aluminium profile as cladding on the top of the bottom rail which clips on just above the bottom bead. As I understand it, this is one of the weaker areas of a timber window and this profile provides better protection.

 

We ended up spending more with them as we decided to increase some sizes, like for the french doors and up the spec of a few bits and bobs but we still ended up paying marginally less less than Rationel would have been with sills and transport included. In total it was just over 20k plus VAT. Can share full schedule so you can see all the details if you'd like.

Windows & doors not long after installation. Bays have fully glazed returns:

Edited February 13, 2022 by SimonD

[tonyshouse]

Go 3g - I went for the best, was expensive but proving to be an excellent choice ?

[Chanmenie]

That looks a lot of windows and glass for £20k 

are they timber or Alu-clad timber

[SimonD]

28 minutes ago, Chanmenie said:

 

are they timber or Alu-clad timber

 

Timber but with the alu-cladding on the bottom rail.

[markharro]

Thanks for this - Nordvest and Norrsken are new to me.

I've have actually just found another source - Katzbeck from https://www.phstore.co.uk/katzbeck-windows-and-doors

Anyone know about them or used them? thanks

[SimonD]

5 minutes ago, markharro said:

Norrsken

 

I'm not sure Norrsken make their own windows, or at least I know they don't make all the windows themselves. I got in touch with Viking Windows and they referred me to Norrsken as their UK partner. The Viking windows website has changed a bit since I last visited and it now has a get a quote link and sales telephone number so maybe things have changed.

[Thorfun]

38 minutes ago, SimonD said:

 

I'm not sure Norrsken make their own windows, or at least I know they don't make all the windows themselves. I got in touch with Viking Windows and they referred me to Norrsken as their UK partner. The Viking windows website has changed a bit since I last visited and it now has a get a quote link and sales telephone number so maybe things have changed.

this is correct. we have Norrsken windows and are very happy with them but they are made by Viking windows. 

 

personally I would highly recommend Norrsken.

 

[Chanmenie]

Thanks for the info guy's

 

I have asked Norrsken and Nordvest for quotes so will see what happens 

[craig]

23 hours ago, SimonD said:

Nordvest windows were slightly better on G-value

 

G Value is based on the glass spec only.

10 hours ago, markharro said:

I've have actually just found another source - Katzbeck from https://www.phstore.co.uk/katzbeck-windows-and-doors

Anyone know about them or used them? thanks

 

Know them well but they aren't cheap on par with Internorm/Gaulhofer and the likes. Transport costs are ridiculous and my installer does the service work for Katzbeck.

[JohnMo]

Why not passivhaus spec manufactured in the UK instead of imported?  Keep your money in the UK instead of sending overseas.

 

A passivhaus window only needs to an average of Uw of 0.8.  So any good 3G will meet this.

 

My windows were manufactured a couple of miles down the road.  U values fixed windows 0.74, opening 0.84. Supplier had full responsibility from measuring to final install.

 

Roof windows are by Roof Maker Passivhaus certified with a u value of 1.0.

 

 

[craig]

I'd supply from UK manufacturers for PH suitable windows in a heartbeat "if" the quality was good and I have yet to find a UK timber alu clad window supplier that actually supplies a decent quality window. uPVC are pretty much imported profiles (some may be extruded here) and aluminium profiles are pretty much European profiles (Reynaers/Schuco for example).

 

Bottom line, I've yet to be convinced by a UK timber composite product or as I said, I would supply in a heartbeat. They're just not very good.

[SimonD]

4 hours ago, JohnMo said:

Keep your money in the UK instead of sending overseas.

 

I definitely believe in going local if I can and have opted to do so with as many products and materials as practically possible. I tried two local companies, one of which is a medium size window maker, the other smaller joinery company specialising in windows. The first wanted about 38k for the windows, with no discernable difference in spec to the other manufacturers, the other couldn't fit me in for another 7 months.

 

I was also a bit nervous because the last time I bought timber windows for a whole house refurbishment, it was from a UK company. The windows were pretty, but the attention to detail and longevity were dissappointing. They always rattled when some traffic went past, not just one but all of them, and I could never establish what was rattling. It actually seemed to be the window panes themselves and when the paint finish and wood started to deteriorate within the warranty period, despite maintaining them as required, I was promptly told by the manufacturer that they never warrantied their product for that long, despite the fact I had the catalogue and written confirmation from the merchant. They told me I'd have to take it up with the merchant and the catalogue was clearly a misprint. They refused to discuss it further. This was a relatively large and well know joinery company.

 

On the other hand, I do know someone who had replacement sash windows made by a local joiners that were very nice and good quality so accept that there are going to be some good ones out there.

[JohnMo]

That's all pretty rubbish from the supplier and manufacturer.

[Rishard]

@Chanmenie-Would love to hear how your quotes compare from nordvest and norrsken. 

[Chanmenie]

39 minutes ago, Rishard said:

@Chanmenie-Would love to hear how your quotes compare from nordvest and norrsken. 

I’ll let you know 

[DragsterDriver]

I had a quote from Norrsken- a lot more expensive than Velfac plus a super long lead time.

[Rishard]

Are the velfac windows a good spec? 

[Thorfun]

we saw Velfac at a show and discounted them early on as we didn't think they felt that good quality. might just've been us though I guess but, in my opinion, Norrsken are vastly superior quality but I am a bit biased seeing as we bought Norrsken! ?

[Rishard]

What build quality are we talking? Similar section sizes and wood engineering do you know? I’ve seen whole house window quotes locally from small (ish) joinery manufactures with 10k difference on price yet very similar product. This job was mainly accoya double glazed units with identical spec. 

[Thorfun]

1 hour ago, Rishard said:

What build quality are we talking? Similar section sizes and wood engineering do you know? I’ve seen whole house window quotes locally from small (ish) joinery manufactures with 10k difference on price yet very similar product. This job was mainly accoya double glazed units with identical spec. 

if that's aimed at me, then we found the Velfac windows just didn't feel solid when opening and closing. but everyone sees things differently so, seeing as windows are a very big ticket item normally, the best advice I can give is to go and see LOTS of window companies. the big shows are a great way to see the majority but then there are others that don't go to the shows so a visit to the company/reseller is required. 

 

we must've visited/seen at least 10 different window companies and 'tried' them out at shows before whittling our choice down to 5 or 6 that we got quotes from.

[Rishard]

@Thorfun- I agree, nothing more re-assuring then personal quality testing! Who did you have in your top 5 list? I once visited a lovely conversion with 3g windows by George Barnsdale who have been making windows since 1884. Very efficient and well engineered.