My extension & my neighbour

[Gummo]

2 hours ago, joe90 said:

IMO, if it’s his chimney, the chimney breast will be in his rooms, party wall will be roughly 9” brickwork so boundary is 4 1/2 “ from your side of chimney line!!!!, anyway I would not be happy with fixings in my wall which could lead to damp issues.

So, using that logic, it is almost certainly a party wall.  If so, how do I have the right to stop such fixings?

[joe90]

2 minutes ago, Gummo said:

So, using that logic, it is almost certainly a party wall.  If so, how do I have the right to stop such fixings?

Tell him it’s not a party wall, it’s yours and let him prove otherwise ?. From your photo it’s difficult to prove either way but if you were to measure if you’re internal party wall between houses matches the outside wall to your extension then it is a party wall!,!

[Gone West]

4 hours ago, Gummo said:

His chimney and mast.

Do you have a fireplace that has a chimney in that stack or is that solely for his use? If you have use of that stack then it's shared and the centre line of the stack is the boundary. If the stack is entirely his, then the boundary would normally be on your side of the stack. I say normally because there are cases where the boundary can dog-leg inside the houses.

[Mike]

6 hours ago, joe90 said:

I would not be happy with fixings in my wall which could lead to damp issues.

It would be helpful to know more about the structure of the wall and the proposed means of fixing, but I can't see an obvious reason why damp - or anything else - would be a significant risk. The biggest long-term issue could be rust staining, but stainless steel fixings could be used to avoid that.

 

The biggest source of potential 'damage' would probably be the formation of green algae in the shade of plants grown next to the wall, but you can't stop a neighbour growing plants (unless, perhaps, ivy gets seriously out of hand).

 

 

[Gummo]

4 hours ago, PeterStarck said:

Do you have a fireplace that has a chimney in that stack or is that solely for his use? If you have use of that stack then it's shared and the centre line of the stack is the boundary. If the stack is entirely his, then the boundary would normally be on your side of the stack. I say normally because there are cases where the boundary can dog-leg inside the houses.

The chimney is his (my fireplaces are on the other side).  It's looking very much like it's a party wall after all. ?

[Gummo]

1 hour ago, Mike said:

It would be helpful to know more about the structure of the wall and the proposed means of fixing, but I can't see an obvious reason why damp - or anything else - would be a significant risk. The biggest long-term issue could be rust staining, but stainless steel fixings could be used to avoid that.

 

The biggest source of potential 'damage' would probably be the formation of green algae in the shade of plants grown next to the wall, but you can't stop a neighbour growing plants (unless, perhaps, ivy gets seriously out of hand).

 

I'd need some expert advice on the integrity of his fixings and the joists' impact on my wall - on an extension whose join to the old house has been filled several times in its history due to settlement.  That's my main concern; the next concern is the parties that undoubtedly will ensue.

[Roundtuit]

If it's your extension that you had built, presumably on your property, why would it be a party wall? Unless there's some agreement that you built partly on your neighbours yard, surely it's all yours?

 

Or is that a whole new debate...?

Edited May 13, 2020 by Roundtuit
further thought...

[Gummo]

7 minutes ago, Roundtuit said:

If it's your extension that you had built, presumably on your property, why would it be a party wall? Unless there's some agreement that you built partly on your neighbours yard, surely it's all yours?

 

Or is that a whole new debate...?

The extension, built in 1981, runs along the line of the old scullery that was there beforehand.  You may infer from the attached diagram that the old scullery's exterior probably aligned with the furthermost line of the party wall.

[Roundtuit]

12 minutes ago, Gummo said:

The extension, built in 1981, runs along the line of the old scullery that was there beforehand.  You may infer from the attached diagram that the old scullery's exterior probably aligned with the furthermost line of the party wall.

 

 

Ah.  Let's call it a Party wall then! In that case, I think all you can do is politely insist that it's all done properly (planning app, party wall surveyor etc) and hope the cost puts him off!

[Gummo]

11 hours ago, Roundtuit said:

 

Ah.  Let's call it a Party wall then! In that case, I think all you can do is politely insist that it's all done properly (planning app, party wall surveyor etc) and hope the cost puts him off!

I talked to the planners yesterday - they say that planning permission isn't required before installation but, if he contravenes regulations, the structure will be in trouble.

[Mike]

19 hours ago, Gummo said:

I'd need some expert advice on the integrity of his fixings and the joists' impact on my wall - on an extension whose join to the old house has been filled several times in its history due to settlement.

I'm sure that we can help with that, if you share details of your neighbour's proposal & the structure of the wall. BTW, if it's a new extension, I presume that it's the original house that's moving, not your extension?

[Ferdinand]

9 hours ago, Gummo said:

I talked to the planners yesterday - they say that planning permission isn't required before installation but, if he contravenes regulations, the structure will be in trouble.

 

"Not us, Guv - see BCO" 

[Gummo]

6 hours ago, Mike said:

I'm sure that we can help with that, if you share details of your neighbour's proposal & the structure of the wall. BTW, if it's a new extension, I presume that it's the original house that's moving, not your extension?

He plans to run joists from the top of his single-storey extension wall, across his narrow yard to my extension wall and top it with decking.  Both walls are plastered concrete block with cavity.

[Temp]

15 hours ago, Gummo said:

I talked to the planners yesterday - they say that planning permission isn't required before installation but, if he contravenes regulations, the structure will be in trouble.

 

Humm... He may not need planning permission to build a car port or roof over part of his garden but he DOES definitely need permission if he wants to build a raised deck/balcony to sit up there. The problem is proving what it's for.

[Onoff]

I'd take the extension down or move the party wall in to my side and erect a rickety fence.

 

Just to f*** him up.

Edited May 15, 2020 by Onoff

[Onoff]

Presumably when you fid your extension it was done properly and somewhere along the line someone considered thd structural engineering implications.

 

Surely your neighbour should be having any such calcs before the build is done rather than throwing it up ad hoc and only then will the council get involved?

[Gummo]

10 hours ago, Temp said:

 

Humm... He may not need planning permission to build a car port or roof over part of his garden but he DOES definitely need permission if he wants to build a raised deck/balcony to sit up there. The problem is proving what it's for.

Presumably he'll need a safety railing.

[Temp]

Yes. If this was part of a new house Building Control Approval would be needed for the whole house and the Building Control Officer would require railings (with a minimum height and spacing). He would probably also insist on proper access eg steps or a door.

 

If the neighbour just claims its to provide shade in the garden and doesn't fit railings, steps or an access door then I don't think Building Control Approval is required either. If he later starts using it as a terrace/decking you might have a hard time getting Building Control to take an interest. It depends how proactive they are in your area. There isn't much funding for their department and they are reluctant to initiate legal proceedings if someone just ignores the regulations. It would be a different matter if it was a hotel or similar.

[Gummo]

I've just learned of "adverse possession" which suggests that my 39 year-old extension is potentially entirely on my property and that the wall in question is not a party wall.

 

Any thoughts?

Edited May 16, 2020 by Gummo
Attachment

[joe90]

Just depends if your neighbour challenges it. If you think his fixings won’t damage your wall then why not let him, he won’t be able to oversee your property and any infringement of Building regs his problem!

[Gummo]

19 hours ago, joe90 said:

If you think his fixings won’t damage your wall then why not let him...

I'm not qualified to know if they will or not and I'm fairly sure building control and planning won't be consulted.

[joe90]

38 minutes ago, Gummo said:

I'm not qualified to know if they will or not and I'm fairly sure building control and planning won't be consulted.

if it looks like he is doing it ask what type of fixings he proposes (as it’s your wall) then post it here for a view!

[Temp]

If I was building it, I'd probably drop some posts onto pad foundations rather than bolt it to the neighbours house.

[Gummo]

5 hours ago, joe90 said:

if it looks like he is doing it ask what type of fixings he proposes (as it’s your wall) then post it here for a view!

Because of the diverging views offered, I'm unsure what my rights are to the extent that I may have no grounds for asking let alone having a say on whether he does work to the wall.  Indeed, I'm not sure if I own the wall.