Robert Clark Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Considering heating options for our renovation project. No mains gas here so was thinking about LPG as it’s clean and a cheaper installation and servicing option. Spoke to a local contractor who suggested that ASHP would be a better option in the long term. He gave a verbal estimate for fitting an 11kw Mitsubishi ASHP. £10-£12k Seems expensive to me. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joth Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Remind us if you're in the exorbitant SE? Did it include a large unvented cylinder and plumbing and buffer tank and stuff? For just an ASHP that's way to high but I find they tend to assume a lot more in the quotes and yes, that sort of "ball park figure" is very typical for first contact I made with 3 or 4 suppliers around here (Herts). Obviously MCS certified etc etc and obviously like every other part of a build can be undercut if you're happy/able to DIY install. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 The Mitsubishi Ecodan 11.2kW ASHP itself, with all the parts needed for installation of the ASHP unit, is around £4.5k or so, plus VAT. A straightforward installation shouldn't take longer than maybe a day, perhaps two if the job's a bit more complex. For example, we had our old gas system boiler changed, including removing the old hot tank, re-plumbing the house to accept a gas combi boiler and it took two chaps 1 1/2 days, with half a day spent flushing out the old radiators before connecting up the new boiler. To get to £10k to £12k sounds like there must a fair bit of additional work involved. Fitting a new hot water tank might be included, and could add maybe another £1k or so to the price. Changing the radiators for larger ones to better suit the lower flow temperature from the ASHP might be included, and could potentially add another couple of thousand. In terms of labour, plumbers/heating engineers seem to be up near the higher end of the daily rates, so maybe £250 to £300 per day each for your neck of the woods, perhaps? Around here I can get a decent heating engineer for around £220/day, but I dare say that's relatively cheap compared to the South East. Best get a detailed breakdown to see what is and is not included. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Clark Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 minute ago, joth said: Remind us if you're in the exorbitant SE? Did it include a large unvented cylinder and plumbing and buffer tank and stuff? For just an ASHP that's way to high but I find they tend to assume a lot more in the quotes and yes, that sort of "ball park figure" is very typical for first contact I made with 3 or 4 suppliers around here (Herts). Obviously MCS certified etc etc and obviously like every other part of a build can be undercut if you're happy/able to DIY install. Yes we’re in the SE (Sussex) Our house is quite large, so is suggesting we may need two 11kw ASHP (subject to survey) which would include a hw cylinder. I reckon we could run a LPG system for many years for the cost of an ASHP system or am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 That seems to be the going rate to pay someone to install it. Does that include the cylinder? A random search reveals the ASHP and pe plumbed cylinder will cost about £6700 https://www.wolseley.co.uk/product/mitsubishi-ecodan-heat-pump-112kw-and-300l-pre-plumbed-standard-cylinder/ That is not a recommendation to use that supplier or in any way to imply they are the cheapest, just the first one I found. Without the cylinder it appears to be about £4499 https://www.wolseley.co.uk/product/mitsubishi-ecodan-air-source-heat-pump-pack-ftc4-112kw/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Shop around But with building related wages so high I suspect that there is a good chunk for labour in there 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joth Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Robert Clark said: I reckon we could run a LPG system for many years for the cost of an ASHP system or am I missing something? The RHI compensation angle? With a ~11kW heat load expectation, you should get at least £7k - probably more - in RHi. Over 7 years. Edited January 16, 2020 by joth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joth Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Oh and to add a smaller point, are you comparing pre or inc VAT prices? The ASHP should be 5% rated vs 20% for the oil boiler (AIUI) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Clark Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 I’ll get a firm quote & spec and report back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionessHeart Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 Hi @Robert Clark- can I ask how much you ended up spending for the supply, installation, and commissioning of your AHSP. Did you go with a ~12kW Mitsubishi ahsp? For a 4-bed house in Kent (approx 240 sqm with a double-height entrance hallway), I've received various quotes for between 12kW-16kW ASHPs. In fact, GreenHome Technologies has quoted £24K for a full package (supply, install, commissioning, excl VAT) - it seems a touch too high? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Post and beam Posted April 27, 2023 Share Posted April 27, 2023 19 minutes ago, LionessHeart said: quoted £24K for a full package Seems very expensive when you can find the prices of the hardware yourself. Very similar to figures i have been quoted and moaned about on here. I dont have a solution yet. Most companies are actually only quoting for supply to me. I need a one stop shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Jones Posted April 28, 2023 Share Posted April 28, 2023 heat pump £4k, say £4k for rads. City Plumbing Plumber is 250/300 a day so would need to be onsite for months or else they are royally ripping you off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMo Posted April 28, 2023 Share Posted April 28, 2023 22 hours ago, LionessHeart said: it seems a touch too high? People have obviously got too much money, if that's a touch too high. Unless you specified gold plated radiators then it's ok. No wonder they are saying MCS is just tax relief for the rich. If someone came along with half that figure for a gas boiler installation they would be laughed at, but people are will to be royally screwed over for an ASHP - world has gone mad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelvin Posted April 28, 2023 Share Posted April 28, 2023 (edited) Ours is £11k design, installed, etc. which I thought was a touch dear. So yes that’s dear. The actual cost to us is about £2k though as in Scotland we get a grant to fit ASHP of £7500 plus another £1500 for the rural uplift. Edited April 28, 2023 by Kelvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesPa Posted April 28, 2023 Share Posted April 28, 2023 On 16/01/2020 at 16:41, Robert Clark said: Considering heating options for our renovation project. No mains gas here so was thinking about LPG as it’s clean and a cheaper installation and servicing option. Spoke to a local contractor who suggested that ASHP would be a better option in the long term. He gave a verbal estimate for fitting an 11kw Mitsubishi ASHP. £10-£12k Seems expensive to me. What do you think? If my experience, ad that of many on here is anything to go by, you wont get an MCS contractor (with the exception of Octopus if they will do yours) to quote less than about 10-15K after BUS, possibly up to 20K after BUS. The structural problem in the installation industry is that it is populated largely by fly-by-night companies set up to exploit the BUS grant, who arent interested in jobs costing less than about £15-£20K. So they quote for a whole load of work which often isn't needed, at rates which are extortionate. Because demand exceeds supply they get away with it. Local plumbers and electricians, whose bread and butter work is smaller jobs, are excluded by regulation. Your options appear to be get Octopus to do it if you can forgo the grant and use local plumbers and electricians, but bear in mind that Permitted development rights require MCS (bizarrely) pay the price demanded do it yourself There is a wildly raging discussion about this structural problem here, probably best read the first page then skip to about page 8, where some analysis of the underlying causes starts to emerge and some possible solutions also. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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