READERS BEWARE. RANT. Architects and other Building related Pen Pushers.

[Patrick]

10 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

 

So you think being an architect is neither of these?

That was not the point. Was talking about being in Retail . Not much brainwork happening there. Just Robotic work under time pressure.

But if you re asking , i believe that stress is a matter of perception and difficult to measure. What might be easy for me , might be extremley stressfull for you. And the other way round.

All I know is that there is a massive difference between being in a stressfull job that gives you more than just income is a complete different story than a high pressure environment job that you just do to earn a living. 

But no one really argues that anyways. Sometimes people just dont have a good choice.

Since bills have to be paid and kids have to be fed.

 

 

[Patrick]

1 hour ago, JSHarris said:

The sort of cars people drive can often be an indicator as to their income.  None of the architects that popped in to our build were driving new cars, or expensive ones.  From chatting to the couple of local ones I've got to know reasonably well now, I'd say they probably weren't earning anything near as much as some might think (don't know for sure, but that's the impression I've gained).

People making these assumptions work in their favour.

I dealt with a guy importing goods for Poundshops from China and he had 4 cars. 3  for private use (a G class, a Porsche and Maserati) and one for business. (a 15 year old vauxhall vectra) .

He was convinced that he can negotiate higher prices if they see him coming with that old Vectra (in combination with a 99£ Suit that looked it) .

He was right.

 

[SteamyTea]

29 minutes ago, Patrick said:

He was convinced that he can negotiate higher prices if they see him coming with that old Vectra (in combination with a 99£ Suit that looked it) .

He was right.

That is more a reflection of his customers shallowness than any real, measurable, business methodology.

If someone turned up in a £100k car and was selling an identical product to a man in a cheap suit and a wobbly Vectra, I would pick the one that was offering the best service.

If you make business decisions based on emotion, it is time to retire.

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, Patrick said:

This has to do with a lot of things, but partly with how we value ones work as a society.

True, we overvalue diamonds and celebrities and undervalue clean water and social care.

[the_r_sole]

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Edited September 26, 2019 by the_r_sole

[Patrick]

Just now, the_r_sole said:

 

Every business decision is made on emotion then post-rationalised with the evidence people need to convince themselves

I was starting a long text about studies being made with "beautiful" people vs. "ugly" people ..........

 

But you made that point with 1 sentence  , so I can safe my time there ??

[Jeremy Harris]

When we had some (expensive) angled blinds supplied and fitted to our gable glazing, the chap that turned up to do the measurement survey, take the order, etc was driving a pretty high end Merc, and used a custom app on his big iPad to note everything down, handle the order, payment etc.  The impression I had was that they were probably adding a heck of a lot to the price of the blinds, just to support the way they chose to portray themselves.  We had little choice, as there are very few companies around that can supply and fit angled blinds, and all seem to be in the same, fairly expensive, sector of the market.

 

My wife wanted the same pattern of blinds fitted to the French windows in her room, but as these were just rectangular, I looked around and found a supplier in Germany that made absolutely identical blinds to the ones we have on the gable, but with much more substantial aluminium (rather than plastic) operating handles (for the manual ones).  They made blinds to measure for about 30% of the cost of the same type of blind we have on the gable (the gable has two sets of triangular blinds and three sets of rectangular ones).

 

This confirmed my view that the people that supplied and fitted the gable blinds were on a massive mark up, some of which went to pay for the high-end appearance of their staff, systems etc.

[SteamyTea]

This may be worth a listen to understand things a bit more.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00088mc

[SteamyTea]

11 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

This confirmed my view that the people that supplied and fitted the gable blinds were on a massive mark up, some of which went to pay for the high-end appearance of their staff, systems etc.

The marginal difference between the cost of lease cars is pretty low though.

Not as if these people go out and buy them with earnings they have generated on the last few sales.

 

They may have been getting the blinds from the same company.

Reminds of this:

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by SteamyTea

[Ralph]

This is probably not the correct term but with regards to value and perception is this forum not a bit of a self selecting group? On here people are generally willing to get there hands dirty and DIY most things, even professional services and design so the perception of value is possibly slightly skewed.

[Jeremy Harris]

6 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

They may have been getting the blinds from the same company.

 

 

 

They definitely were.  The blinds are made by Luxaflex, and I'd recommend them, as they are  well made.

[Jeremy Harris]

2 minutes ago, Ralph said:

This is probably not the correct term but with regards to value and perception is this forum not a bit of a self selecting group? On here people are generally willing to get there hands dirty and DIY most things, even professional services and design so the perception of value is possibly slightly skewed.

 

Very good point, although we do have one or two that have pretty much gone down the turnkey route, really commissioning a new house rather than self build, perhaps.

[Construction Channel]

59 minutes ago, Ralph said:

This is probably not the correct term but with regards to value and perception is this forum not a bit of a self selecting group? On here people are generally willing to get there hands dirty and DIY most things, even professional services and design so the perception of value is possibly slightly skewed.

 

One thing everyone on here has in common is the ability/willingness to do some research for themselves. 

[Jeremy Harris]

28 minutes ago, Construction Channel said:

 

One thing everyone on here has in common is the ability/willingness to do some research for themselves. 

 

That's true.  I started seriously researching self build around 2008, about the time I joined this forum's predecessor, although we'd talked about it for a few years before that.  My first post there was more than a bit naive, and answered patiently by @Temp, who pointed out the importance of finding a plot before thinking about house design.  Interesting that we're both still around on here.  Off the top of my head I think there can't more than a small handful from that long ago still here.

 

All told I spent two years or so doing part time research, before I retired, then another two years of full time research and plot hunting, then another year sorting out the design of the house after that, before submitting the planning application.

[SteamyTea]

5 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

Off the top of my head I think there can't more than a small handful from that long ago still here.

Guilty

[Ralph]

28 minutes ago, Construction Channel said:

One thing everyone on here has in common is the ability/willingness to do some research for themselves. 

There has been a couple of occasions in architect meetings when I've looked like I know what I'm taking about only because I'm armed with advice from here. 

[Jeremy Harris]

2 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Guilty

 

I can think of four of us from that era, you, me, @Temp and @caliwag

[jack]

7 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

We all know what a house looks like, and what we like.

 

Sure, I know what "a" house looks like. Indeed, I know what several look like. I also know what elements I've liked and disliked in the 20+ houses I've lived in over the years.

 

What I didn't know was how to design a house that would fit my family now and in the future, would work with the significant plot restraints that we had, and would feel amazing to live in. I get it, lots of people know what they want and can't see the point of architects. Personally, I'm really sensitive to my surroundings, and wanted to live in something that was a joy to arrive home to. We've accomplished a lot of that, I think, in a way we wouldn't have managed had we come up with something ourselves.

 

The first architect we engaged I really didn't gel with, ideas-wise. She was a Passivhaus specialist, but I eventually got the impression that she wasn't great at residential houses (long story as to how we ended up with her out of the four or five architects we initially interviewed).

 

The second architect couldn't have been more different. He nailed the design brief almost perfectly with his first shot, presenting a layout that hadn't occurred to me in the hundreds of attempts I'd made myself. We ended up building a tweaked version of that design.

 

Incidentally, the external appearance was something the architect had surprisingly little to do with. He had various ideas for pitched roofs and materials, but in the end I came up with my own external treatment that we preferred to anything he'd done. He was cool with that (and why wouldn't he be).

 

In the scheme of things, he wasn't that expensive, added a lot to the project, and reduced our stress levels. I know others have had different experiences, but that's ours.

[Bitpipe]

4 minutes ago, jack said:

 

Sure, I know what "a" house looks like. Indeed, I know what several look like. I also know what elements I've liked and disliked in the 20+ houses I've lived in over the years.

 

What I didn't know was how to design a house that would fit my family now and in the future, would work with the significant plot restraints that we had, and would feel amazing to live in. I get it, lots of people know what they want and can't see the point of architects. Personally, I'm really sensitive to my surroundings, and wanted to live in something that was a joy to arrive home to. We've accomplished a lot of that, I think, in a way we wouldn't have managed had we come up with something ourselves.

 

The first architect we engaged I really didn't gel with, ideas-wise. She was a Passivhaus specialist, but I eventually got the impression that she wasn't great at residential houses (long story as to how we ended up with her out of the four or five architects we initially interviewed).

 

The second architect couldn't have been more different. He nailed the design brief almost perfectly with his first shot, presenting a layout that hadn't occurred to me in the hundreds of attempts I'd made myself. We ended up building a tweaked version of that design.

 

Incidentally, the external appearance was something the architect had surprisingly little to do with. He had various ideas for pitched roofs and materials, but in the end I came up with my own external treatment that we preferred to anything he'd done. He was cool with that (and why wouldn't he be).

 

In the scheme of things, he wasn't that expensive, added a lot to the project, and reduced our stress levels. I know others have had different experiences, but that's ours.

 

Very similar to us Jack, ours designed a great building for us but was a bit traditional in how to build it so there we pleasantly parted ways but I considered it money well spent.

[the_r_sole]

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Edited September 26, 2019 by the_r_sole

[Patrick]

8 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

I find it a bit bizarre that people are designing houses without considering the construction 

Than you are obviously one of the good ones.

And in regards to other feedback on here, apparently there are more of you out there.

Maybe they all hiding in Scotland ?

[jack]

52 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

Did they not ask you how you wanted to build it? That's usually something ironed out in the early stages or at least options looked at, there's so many different technologies now that if you know (roughly) what system you are going to use then you can work with the materials to use them to their most effective - I find it a bit bizarre that people are designing houses without considering the construction 

 

The architect we went with was actually our first choice, but he baulked at being responsible for a passivhaus build. When we went back to him a year later, we'd found MBC. He looked into their construction method and airtightness guarantee, and that was enough to reassure him that he'd be able to give us what wanted, performance-wise. From the very first draft, his designs all took the construction method into account.

[Bitpipe]

2 hours ago, the_r_sole said:

 

Did they not ask you how you wanted to build it? That's usually something ironed out in the early stages or at least options looked at, there's so many different technologies now that if you know (roughly) what system you are going to use then you can work with the materials to use them to their most effective - I find it a bit bizarre that people are designing houses without considering the construction 

 

Nope because at that stage we had no idea and the passive / low energy idea came later. Brief was design us a nice house based on design ideas we like (white render, boxy) that fit the site, allowed for future site expansion and would get planning. 

 

After we got planning and were waiting for our rental to sell and release funds, I was researching basement build methods and found this site's predecessor. I then discovered the whole low energy idea and went from there.

 

As luck would have it, and the site constraints - we're in a build line that runs north / south - we have minimal south or north glazing, four windows & door to east facing street and big sliders to west overlooking garden.This performed well in the PHPP so no tweaks required aside from motorised external shutters to the velux on roof and the east windows.  

 

For quite a while we planned to build in ICF from basement up with a SIPs roof but the final costings made us pivot back towards timber frame.

[Oz07]

Just skipping from page 5 to say CDM and or principal designer what a load of rubbish 

I've been on a job lately 3 big Victorian terraces extended and converted into about 27 student studios 

 

So far without looking I've seen

First floor joists on wall plate with 2 storeys built ontop of this timber. 

Packs of celcon 2.9n blocks being used on 3 storey

Core holes directly below joists. 

Crap plank set up for skimmer on landing ceilings. 

 

This is a large regional well respected contractor too. All this crap isn't worth the paper it's written on. 

[Oz07]

8 hours ago, JSHarris said:

The sort of cars people drive can often be an indicator as to their income.  None of the architects that popped in to our build were driving new cars, or expensive ones.  From chatting to the couple of local ones I've got to know reasonably well now, I'd say they probably weren't earning anything near as much as some might think (don't know for sure, but that's the impression I've gained).

Bloody hell these council house tenants must be raking it in!