Roger440

Have to say i didnt really consider that. Good point, well made.

I bet the planners can though. I know ive said it already, but i simply cant afford to find out post purchase if i can do it. And that really is the biggest issue. Ive only got one more move left in me.

Yep. That would be big enough. How "far out" are you? But im guessing you applied after you bought? What would you have done if it was a no?

Because its Q class. The landlord of our old business premises is using the Q class route on the building. So thats been agreed (because they cant refuse) But they wont allow him to add any opening for windows and doors. So its quite a risk. Even if its a small risk, its a risk i simply cannot afford to take. I buy it and fail to get the necessary planning, then what? No choice but to sell. That process will cost big.

Indeed. But that will require a significant divergence from the principal of class Q planning as i understand it. It may or may not be possible, but would need a very compliant seller, while you try and get planning. They may not want refusals on record either.

In america there is a whole movement, they like to call barndominium living. But i dont live in america so have to struggle on with our system

No, no. Stop it!!!!! Id do this tommorow if i could.

I think we are talking cross purposes I meant costs of conversion of existing barn to domestic use.. Im well versed in costs of actual modern steel structures!

Any suggestions as to the right places? My looking has revealed little so far

Hence my original question of simply building a box inside. Ive insulated 2 of these type buildings. As you observe, a bit of a mission to do.

Budget is circa 450-500K for everything, be that, new build and barn, old farm and barn + refurb, modern AG barn + conversion. Norfolk is doable, as is west country. Really dont want to go north. Thats quite a good deal on the face of it. Had the whole thing been enclosed that would fit the bill perfectly. As its only actually half the 18x18 its a no go to use as a workshop as well. If ferdinand numbers are right, conversion would be 60-70K! Given it probably has no services, id guess that could go up quite a bit. Workshop aside on this particular one, it is, otherwise, ideal. What a great place to live.

Thats quite a low figure. My thinking was not dis-similar as the structural elements are taken care of. At those sorts of numbers its a very do-able proposition.

Thanks for your post. Food for thought. Ive looked at a few roadside things like old garages etc. Whilst id probably go for that, my wife wont, and too be honest, now i dont have road noise any more, im not sure i want that back in my life! Yes, i know, i probably dont have enough money to adopt that point of view! As per my post above, most pre-existing stuff is invariably a major project looking for somewhere to happen. I dont mind work, up to a point. I suspect, ultimately, its what i end up with. I just fancy the modern ag barn idea. But im struggling to get a grasp on likely conversion costs. New build is releatively well understood by comparison

What you say makes sense. Most thing pre-existng are leftover bits of old farms, but getting ever harder thanks to class Q. Realistically north devon is as close as i can get and buy what i want. And thats marginal. Generally older houses, which to make efficient and low maintenance will require significant expenditure. Hence the attraction of a large Q class barn. Everything under one roof. I currently rent a barn, but im in the south east. Over 20 years that would be a lot of cash. While im working its do-able, but i plan on semi retirement in a few years max, at which point it becomes definitely non-doable. Combine with the fact its not on site, i cant really make it the way i want it, and i have zero security of tenure, makes for a pretty unappealing long term plan.

This is correct. Not required if you can comply with everything. What i did. BC were happy too. In england.

Nobody else got any thoughts on this?

Cars primarily. (currently 9). Do all my own restoration etc. Lots of gear. Woodwork stuff. Really want some space for a model railway too longer term. Obviously i could abandon all my hobbies and the problem would go away. But im not ready to accept defeat just yet. But i dont want a big house. Just a 2 bed bungalow would be fine.

Nobody believes its basically because i have out of control hobbies. Immediately the conclusion is "running a business" so on a residential plot, thats a no no. The sheer size is likely to be a problem, but i guess thats rather more location specific. 2 of my near neighbours had multiple rejections of a straightforward triple garage. To high, too big, out of keeping, wrong location, too visible etc. etc. Indeed the 2nd one in the end used the plans from the first to get it through on the basis it was the same and they were immediate neighbours. At a slightly more practical level, nobody is selling a plot with planning for a big barn. Which means that i would have to try and "add" the barn to the planning permission afterwards. Given the difficulties in doing so, thats way to high risk post purchase. If they refuse, you are stuffed at that point. How on earth did you justify a building like that on a new build? Is this easier in scotland? But regardless, i couldnt and wouldnt buy any kind of plot unless it was cast iron that i could build one.

Whilst i probably would, im not so sure the wife would go along with that!

Cladding type isnt that important, but steel framed, yes. (as above post) Having rented various steel building over the years, ive got plenty of experience at insulation, condensation etc. Hence my thoughts about effectively building a stand alone box inside the actual barn. If a bit of condensation forms on the cladding, thats no different to before you live in it. Im just unsure if this is an acceptable way forward. I cant see why not, but im certainly no expert on the subject. Just how expensive can a single story rectangular box with a flat roof that doesnt even need to resist rain possibly be?

The actual construction rather depends what comes up, but most of them are steel portal, with either steel cladding, or sometimes, especially the newer ones, concrete slab sides up to 1.8 meters then timber of steel cladding. You do see the odd one thats concrete portal. To all intents, an industrial unit! Is yours a steel frame building? Or an old stone/wooden barn? If so, yes, i can imagine its difficult. Thats exactly why i wouldnt want to take one on, much as i rather like them, i certainly dont have £450K to do one up! I already rent a barn here. To be honest, i have a problem with renting. Just the same as renting a house, one is loathe to spend money on the building to make it nice when its not yours, and ultimately you have no security that you wont be turfed out at some random point in the future. The biggest driver though is i dont want my barn/shed/toy store/workshop somewhere else. I want it at home. Which is why building a house is pretty much ruled out. If i ever bought a plot to build a house on, id want to buy something with outline permission at the very least. They dont, as a rule, come with 2000sq/ft barns included So im try to use a bit of lateral thinking to achieve the desired outcome. No doubt there are more attractive building types, but, thats a compromise i can live with if we get the other things we want.

Having considered forever, the various options for building a house, the one thing that trips me up everytime is our requirement for a small house & big barn / shed. By big i mean circa 1500-200sqft. So big! The planning system is not really geared up for this. Maybe not impossible, but an uphill struggle at best. So my options are to buy an old farm and renovate/ adapt etc. This is do-able, but as is always the case with old buildings, there will be lots of surprises, and therefore expense along the way. Whilst i can, if i have to, cope with the surprises i can do myself, im keen not to have expensive surprises as im wanting to get to the stage of not working full time sooner rather than later. So, one solution is to buy one of the Q class modern barns, fill only part of it with house, leaving the rest empty. Having seen some that do fit the bill, with fully approved plans, at a practical level, once the plot/barn is bought, my thinking is, this really shouldnt be too expensive? However, ive not really found much info on this. Has anyone here done similar. Now i appreciate you "can" make this expensive, but my thinking is that all i actually need to do is build a nice insulated box inside said barn. It may or may not have a concrete floor, but, especially if single story, this seems like a pretty simple build? I'm not looking for anything clever. " bedrooms, kitchen/diner/lounge and may a small cost room. From a building regs point of view, whilst not being an expert, is there any obvious tripping points in this, admittedly loose plan? Ie, things that one would likely encounter on a conversion of this sort versus a new build. I'm also attracted by my perceived reduction in risk. as always, there can be surprises in ground works. At least with this you have a decent modern structure in place before you start, thus in my mind de-risking it. And also that i can do most of it myself. With the obvious cost savings that will bring. Thoughts. Am i nuts?

Sounds like a "misinterpratation" of something. Just had mine done and its more than 5m away!

garagejournal.com flooring section will give you plenty of ideas!!

I investigated it some detail for retrofit in the cavity in my old house. Couldn't convince myself of any other system, especially has the bricks were rock hard, so much more likely that drivng rain would come through the mortar joints. I seen to remember it was £8K to do the whole house up to the roof. The other spinoff was air tightness improvement on an old house. The worry i had though was where the joists went through the wall, there were gaps. Lots of them. Realistically, they would need filling/taping before doing it otherwise loads of the stuff would fill up under you floor! Much easier on a new house where that problem wont exist. Ive toyed with doing it at my new please as there is a degree of flood risk, but the front half of the house is solid 9 inch wall, so probably wasting my time as that will fillup with water anyway! Just going to concetrate on re-plastering with lime, so it can just dry out again.