newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 6 minutes ago, MikeSharp01 said: @newhomeHave you got a cooking thermometer anywhere? If so touch the end on the pump and lets see how hot it actually is. Don''t think so sorry. I think I burnt my hand on the small round thing in the middle. It's not 100 degrees hot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Right I can tell you why when the UFH is on, the tank empties in 20 mins. Those red valves supply the manifolds for the UFH - they should blend the floor supply water to 38-42c in a standard setting (not a super insulated house is it ..?) and not supply it to the floor at 65c..! I’ll let @Nickfromwales continue on his TS / boiler quest then I may have a quick look at the UFH as I think we can do something there too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 9 minutes ago, PeterW said: Maybe that pump is pushing against a closed valve .... @newhome did you say all the red topped Reliance valves are set to 65c..?? Max = fully open yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, newhome said: Max = fully open yes? Ok - that’s something that needs looking at. The manifolds themselves for the underfloor heating - when they get warm do all the pipes get warm too..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 16 minutes ago, PeterW said: Maybe that pump is pushing against a closed valve .... @newhome did you say all the red topped Reliance valves are set to 65c..?? It shouldn't be spinning at all! No call for heat from the HM controls means no heat out of the TS to anything. I think cock-end has bypassed everything in a blind frenzy of "must make it work somehow so I can leave with money" Grrrrrrrrrr. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 10 minutes ago, newhome said: Don''t think so sorry. I think I burnt my hand on the small round thing in the middle. It's not 100 degrees hot. Thats the vent cap so directly next to the bearing. If its significantly hotter than all the boiler pump / pipework / PHE pipework then its either fecked or on its way there. The reason we cant get the TS hot is perhaps there is flow going from the TS to one, or maybe, more bypass ufh loops. Are any of the UFH manifolds getting as hot as the pump you burned your hand on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, PeterW said: Ok - that’s something that needs looking at. The manifolds themselves for the underfloor heating - when they get warm do all the pipes get warm too..? So the temp dial on the manifolds is: 30 degrees on both downstairs (15 on the cold one) and 10 degrees upstairs on both hot and cold, ie both pipes are cold whereas downstairs the hot one is mildly warm,. All room stats are set to frost still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 As an interim observation, this lot needs rewiring before its safe and reliable. Thats the minimum to move forward. The pics show the other ( highest ) TMV that I couldn't previously see. Is that one set to max too? Its the one that blends the return from the TS to the boiler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, newhome said: So the temp dial on the manifolds is: 30 degrees on both downstairs (15 on the cold one) and 10 degrees upstairs on both hot and cold, ie both pipes are cold whereas downstairs the hot one is mildly warm,. All room stats are set to frost still. So you have heat getting to at least two of the manifolds with everything turned off on the room stats He's bypassed the lot. Tidy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Nickfromwales said: As an interim observation, this lot needs rewiring before its safe and reliable. Thats the minimum to move forward. The pics show the other ( highest ) TMV that I couldn't previously see. Is that one set to max too? Its the one that blends the return from the TS to the boiler. Yep they are all fully open / max. They were before, I didn''t alter anything, although there have been a number of people here looking at this so who knows if they've been altered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Nickfromwales said: So you have heat getting to at least two of the manifolds with everything turned off on the room stats He's bypassed the lot. Tidy Well assuming they weren't still at 30 from when they were on first thing this am? Dunno There is an immersion heater switch in the boiler room that I only turned on if I needed to use it. He has wired a switch from that to the other side of the wall so the switch in the boiler room is now on all the time just so that I can use the one the other side of the wall when needed, that I didn't need as I already had a working one. Even I know the theory behind that is super flawed! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Just now, newhome said: Yep they are all fully open / max. They were before, I didn''t alter anything, although there have been a number of people here looking at this so who knows if they've been altered. The one to the Ufh / space heating ( assuming you dont have any radiators anywhere ? ) should be set at 400C max as thats the temp of the water going into the ufh loops. Anything more is deemed dangerous. If the floors have been running at the higher UFH flow temp and the floors have not been getting uncomfortably hot, that says to me there is heat starvation there too. All of the house space heating and DHW is travelling ( or trying to ) through that PHE from the boiler, and I think thats just unfit for purpose. @PeterW, any cons that you can think of with piping boiler to TS direct and pressurising the whole system? @newhome can you confirm TS is upstairs / downstairs please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 So in summary I guess it's all super fecked?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, newhome said: So in summary I guess it's all super fecked?! Sorry but you have to go to college for 4 years before you can say that ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Just now, newhome said: So in summary I guess it's all super fecked?! Nope it just needs commissioning properly ..!! That Heatmiser system is good when it works - has it got a connection to the internet somewhere ..?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Not super fecked but in need of a visit. Nowt can be sorted by the tappings of these few keyboards sorry. At least were getting some clarity now, rather than just wondering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Nickfromwales said: @newhome can you confirm TS is upstairs / downstairs please? TS is downstairs off the utility room. 2 set of manifolds upstairs (I don't think they even work anymore), and 2 sets of manifolds downstairs that work after a fashion but given how quickly the boiler heats up and how slowly the UFH heats the room up I don't think it's working very efficiently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, PeterW said: Nope it just needs commissioning properly ..!! And rewiring squire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, PeterW said: Nope it just needs commissioning properly ..!! That Heatmiser system is good when it works - has it got a connection to the internet somewhere ..?? Nope, way older than all the super dooper stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: And rewiring squire At least the name of the topic is accurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, newhome said: TS is downstairs off the utility room. 2 set of manifolds upstairs (I don't think they even work anymore), and 2 sets of manifolds downstairs that work after a fashion but given how quickly the boiler heats up and how slowly the UFH heats the room up I don't think it's working very efficiently. If one pair of 22mm flow and return pipes, travelling through a TMV, and circulated by one single half dead pump, no bloody wonder lol. Each UFH manifold should have its own pump so there is the full potential of a dedicated pump to force the water in the ufh loops around, and they should do nowt else. The pump at the TS and the TMV that services it should only be circulating the heated water PAST the manifolds and the manifolds should just be drawing whatever heat they require at any one given time, eg when the floors are up to temp there is only a little heat required. Im pretty much sewn up here tbh, as I now know what needs doing to sort this mess out.......just got to find a way of breaking it to you gently. Go get some more voddy. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 8 minutes ago, newhome said: Nope, way older than all the super dooper stuff. Ok it looks like the Network version which would explain the bit of dymo tape on the controller ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 @newhome Are you ok to get things running as it was for tonight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 Just now, Nickfromwales said: @newhome Are you ok to get things running as it was for tonight? Yeah, I just turn the white dials up to 70 (but they do feck all anyway), put the cock clock and cock pump clock back on the timer, and set the room thermostat(s) back on I guess. Thanks so much for all your help, and others who contributed. Collective genius in action. I am in awe 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 4 minutes ago, PeterW said: Ok it looks like the Network version which would explain the bit of dymo tape on the controller ...... Don't think so. Will see if I have the manual somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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