Electric Shock

[Hecateh]

Yep - i'm considering that.  Not sure it is very feasible but definitely worth looking at.  

Problems Challenges with doing that

The road is quite a steep slope

The wall between the road and the garden is brick at the top and stone at the bottom

between the brick wall and the house is concrete - and the wall is leaning away (very longstanding - the bungalow was built by/for my grandparents and as kids we used to dare each other to stand under it so has been like the for more than 50 years but not sure how it would stand up to being disturbed

The stone wall below, follows the slope and is held together by crumbling mortar, a section fell out a few years ago when it was very cold - I mortared it back in - very badly, so again not sure how much disturbance it will stand.  

I'll talk it through with the builder and if he thinks it's a goer then I'll discuss with the surveyor

 

[Nickfromwales]

A previous customer had two heads off one cable, andcwhen it came to the refurb they had to pay to excavate for a new supply. Been fine for 35+ years up until then mind you .  

 

If they can get you to pay to upgrade them they will. 

[ToughButterCup]

1 hour ago, Hecateh said:

[...]

My new kitchen plan is getting more basic by the day.

 

But don't lose sight of what you really want. Put the infrastructure in ready for it when you finally can shell out. We've resigned ourselves to having to do that for our bathrooms as well. 

And being a really mean penny-pincher in the meantime.

[divorcingjack]

My sympathies - we are having a drainage nightmare, waiting for the hideous quotes to come in to dig up 15m of Caithness stone slabs, cobbles and tarmac in the main road through the town 

 

We had a hideous quote from our electricity supplier (north of 11K) as I recall. However, we just kept arranging "pre-start" meetings until we got a sensible engineer who would listen to our arguments. Eventually (after some arguing and cake based bribery) came down to £350 ish. But there 'aint no arguing with Scottish Water. Buggers. 

[Ferdinand]

2 hours ago, ProDave said:

That's a bit of a bugger.

 

One way you could reduce the cost would be for the cable to come off the road into the front garden of your existing bungalow and from there across the front garden close to the road.  You (or your chosen contractor) could dig the trench for that bit, and it would reduce the length of road or path to be dug up.

 

That would have complexities around Easements that will need exploring and finessing.

Edited February 1, 2018 by Ferdinand

[Hecateh]

Double Whammy!!!

The council have said that the work cannot be done during the week because of access, so only on Sunday

So they can't do it the day they planned.  It will have to happen over at least 2 weeks and there is of course Sunday rate to pay.  The new price hasn't been confirmed yet but he gave me a ballpark of 5 to 6k extra. 

 

I really am beginning to wish I had done a simple downsize.  I am going to end up in a smaller (albeit modern and energy efficient) house hardly any better off.  It would have been easier to get another job for a couple of years.

 

[lizzie]

28 minutes ago, Hecateh said:

I really am beginning to wish I had done a simple downsize.  I am going to end up in a smaller (albeit modern and energy efficient) house hardly any better off.  It would have been easier to get another job for a couple of years.

 

I know how you feel.....thankfully a 2 year nightmare is coming to an end for us.  We are broken by the whole process  - physically, mentally and financially. I could have just bought a lovely house 2 years ago saved myself an absolute fortune not to mention the stress.......I would need to live to a hundred now to make back the difference in energy costs but the equipment for that is only a small part of the financial roller coaster of £££££'s that has haemorrhaged out over 2 years . It has totally wrecked our retirement plans.

 

I hope it gets better for you....our gas cost £13k to get in, our water took 18 months, electricity by comparison was easy. We are in the garden of an existing house ...like you we thought it would be simple to do.

[Hecateh]

So similar - My gas was a doddle though - only £360.  It was quoted at £1400 and then discounted.  not sure why but I'm grateful.  If it had been the gas that was the expensive one then I probably wouldn't have bothered but can't manage without electric.  

 

Mine was done for a retirement fund as I have very little private pension and have withdrawn most of it to live over the past couple of years.  Last 10k to come out April.  

I thought I would be able to get 80 - 100k more for this house than the one I am building will cost which would have easily covered the next 3 years and then supplemented state it's now down to 30 to 50 depending on what the current house sells for.  

 

If this was to take 2 years I would be bankrupt way before it was finished.  Started just before Christmas and roof going on just after Easter.  - That a whole new story.

 

Roofing people have said they can't get a crane here so somehow the droof structure is going to have to be handballed into position.  Not quite sure how that is going to work - even if it is only single storey

[newhome]

That all sounds horrific. Luckily there was water here already, no gas in the area anyway, and whilst I thought at the time that £1200 was a lot to run a cable from next door to provide electric I now feel quite fortunate. Things in other areas did cost a lot more however so I was mean and shrunk the budgets elsewhere to accommodate (kitchen and bathrooms mostly), but there are things that I wish I hadn’t economised on as I see them every day. Rock and hard place though! 

[Hecateh]

8 minutes ago, newhome said:

 ... shrunk the budgets elsewhere to accommodate 

Yep - done that - but not made a huge amount of difference as was going fairly budget anyway - I live alone so, although I want them to look good they are not going to get a lot of wear.  Couple of fancy units got the boot.  I wanted all drawer/pullout (as there are things at the back of current cupboards that come out once a year for a wash) but they are so much pricier than cupboards. I wanted new fridge, freezer, washer, dryer, dishwasher bed and suite but looks like I'll be taking them with me.  At least until I sell this. 

 

 

[newhome]

2 minutes ago, Hecateh said:

Yep - done that - but not made a huge amount of difference as was going fairly budget anyway - I live alone so, although I want them to look good they are not going to get a lot of wear.  Couple of fancy units got the boot.  I wanted all drawer/pullout (as there are things at the back of current cupboards that come out once a year for a wash) but they are so much pricier than cupboards. I wanted new fridge, freezer, washer, dryer, dishwasher bed and suite but looks like I'll be taking them with me.  At least until I sell this. 

 

 

 

We did manage new appliances as most of the appliances in the old house were integrated so we had no choice, but I did economise on the make of the units and appliances. I’m on my own now too so like you nothing gets loads of wear especially in the kitchen since I’m no domestic goddess anyway . I did buy a fair bit of new furniture but only because things took so long I managed to earn the money to buy them in the interim . If I’m lucky I might get back what the house cost to build when I sell but that doesn’t cover any of the work my hubby did (or me to an extent as I did a lot of painting and general stuff). In contrast my old house went up by 150k since I sold it and it was resold last year and it looks like they had done nothing to it at all apart from putting a shed up! This game is not for wimps for sure! 

[lizzie]

5 minutes ago, Hecateh said:

If this was to take 2 years I would be bankrupt way before it was finished. 

Its touch and go...............we never expected it to take 2 years either, we have no pensions left to cash in the build has swallowed every penny and more, we are in a rented house, sold ours to build this. Still working now at 70.  My fault OH never wanted this it is my folly, He is so lovely he just said ok if thats what you want when I found the plot.  Almost every single costing we have been given has been wrong by miles when it actually came to the final bill.....my bits kitchen, bathroom etc are exactly what I expected them to cost, and were allready bought (in sales) when this started to go off the rails big time.  Our original budget (all the cash we had plus a fair bit for contingencies) has been so far exceeded it makes me feel ill to think about it.  The final tally will be 50% more than we expected, you couldn't shave that sort of money off a kitchen and bathroom.  Our budget was not small to start with compared to some I read on here and was 100k more than QS had told us for basic house so a decent kitchen and bathroom not too much of a stretch from that extra you would have thought.

 

It is complete madness but we have been unable to stop the runaway train merely slow it where we can.  If I tried to sell it I would probably get 250k less than we have spent.....its a complete nightmare. We were not silly we had QS costs before we started but where we  have ended up beggars belief.  I can't even think about it all without feeling physically sick.

 

I so hope yours works out better. I have a shattered dream, 2 years of life and health than can never be recovered and as for the money well now I guess we just need to work until we drop to survive, our comfortable retirement is now no longer even a dream.  Most days I hate the site of the place as you can imagine.  My guys on site now are lovely and have saved my sanity these last months. Superstar carpenter and great brickie/groundworker. We don't talk about anything other than build problems of which we have had a lot but I am sure they must pick up my stress I must have aged 10 years in the last 6 months.  

 

Moving in finally will be bittersweet and I don't know if I will ever get past the way I feel now.  Just want to get it as finished as we can for sign off,  get in and spend the next year and umpteen £££'s finishing the rest.  Probably time to move into a care home by then!  How to wreck your life in one easy lesson!!

 

Fingers crossed for you at least it sounds like you have a builder you can rely on to do the right thing so that may save you from some of the nightmare scenarios we have had.

 

 

[Hecateh]

7 minutes ago, lizzie said:

Fingers crossed for you at least it sounds like you have a builder you can rely on to do the right thing so that may save you from some of the nightmare scenarios we have had.

 

I'm hoping my faith in my builder is justified.  He's a great bloke and is always reassuring but I was warned that he was too inexperienced.  Working to a fixed quote with only changes to be variations to original plans and agreed in writing.  

 

But it doesn't look to me like there is enough money left to finish. I've arranged a meeting for next week to discuss - largely because of the bad weather

 

 

[Mr Punter]

Would @lizzie and @Hecateh like to say how much their projects have come in at per metre, inc fees and services?  We are just completing a project which will cost about £2,100 per metre.

 

Obviously as with the rest here I am sorry you had such a bad experience and I really hope you will see things in a more positive light a while down the road.

[Moira Niedzwiecka]

@Hecateh & @lizzie Same here.

I suspect we will be about 20% over by the time its finished, if it ever is.

It was the ground works & drainage that accounts for most of the overspend, but the rest has all been more than expected.

Also we have been unable to do much of the work ourselves that we had planned because of a change in personal circumstances.

Long past the point of no return so we will just have to soldier on.

I have been out of love with the build for some time now.

However, just last week I was alone in the house doing some airtightness work.

Cutting up little bits of very sticky tape to cover nail & screw heads.

I actually realised that I was feeling happy & enjoying myself.

I think I must now have tipped over the edge into complete madness. 

[Hecateh]

7 minutes ago, Moira Niedzwiecka said:

It was the ground works & drainage that accounts for most of the overspend, but the rest has all been more than expected.

Yep

 

the variations are groundwork, drains and foundations

 

[Hecateh]

9 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

Would @lizzie and @Hecateh like to say how much their projects have come in at per metre, inc fees and services?  We are just completing a project which will cost about £2,100 per metre.

 

Obviously as with the rest here I am sorry you had such a bad experience and I really hope you will see things in a more positive light a while down the road.

 

It's this site that has kept me sane and helping me not get too upset about the fact that I will probably have to allow for some adjustment on the quote because his original quote - that came in as expected was under 1k per sq m.  I say as expected because I had used an online cost calculator which said that 1k per sqm was doable and I was still basing my thoughts on my original plans which was a bungalow -  it's now one storey at the front and 2 at the back to take account of the slope. 

Without any more extras the build alone minus fittings is costing at about 1100 sqm.  Including everything except land (as the build is in my garden) it will be between £1400 and £1500 unless there are any more big shocks.  Top one is allowing for some leeway with the quote.

 

The finished build is important to him as well as me as it is first total new build

 

[newhome]

1 hour ago, lizzie said:

Moving in finally will be bittersweet and I don't know if I will ever get past the way I feel now.  Just want to get it as finished as we can for sign off,  get in and spend the next year and umpteen £££'s finishing the rest.  Probably time to move into a care home by then!  How to wreck your life in one easy lesson!!

 

 

I’ve never been in love with this house sadly. I was a very reluctant self builder as it was my hubby’s dream, not mine. After 4 years of weekly commuting to Edinburgh from Kent I was offered a company assisted move but it meant relocating to Scotland. Hubby was reluctant to move here but said that he would do so if he could build his own house. So he bought the first plot he saw, and we had to build the house that had been agreed here apart from some internal changes as the foundations were already here. And later I ended up having to complete the work on my own which I found very difficult given the circumstances and my lack of knowledge. I wish that I’d found this forum back then as the support, advice and camaraderie is amazing. I certainly may have felt less daunted and alone. 

 

So now I’m on my own in a house that’s far too large for me, and given the location quite isolating too. And the heating doesn’t bloody work either!  As soon as I retire I will sell up and move back down south. It was supposed to be our forever home but it’s anything but for me now. 

 

I hope once you’ve moved in that you start to love the house you have created. It sounds like it was completely designed for your needs so I really hope you do. Time heals, but it will take time I’m sure xx 

 

 

[lizzie]

32 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

Would @lizzie and @Hecateh like to say how much their projects have come in at per metre, inc fees and services?  We are just completing a project which will cost about £2,100 per metre.

With land costs included our total factoring in all will be £5000 per sqm without land £3500 per sq m and no I do not have a perfect house clad in marble with gold taps.  I have a  timber framed bungalow with a rubber roof which may look fine to the untrained eye but due to construction issues is a bit lop sided but we have overcome that cosmetically, at some cost to us of course! One good thing is I'm told it will get a good EPC result and it is nice and warm in there.

 

Original budget was £3600psqm inc land £2100psqm ex land

 

Not exactly a tiny starting  budget for a 180sqm timber framed bungalow and we had prepared ourselves for as much as £2500 psqm for overruns but nothing could have prepared us for where we have ended up. As @Moira Niedzwiecka says the edge of madness was passed when we realised we had no choice but to keep going until the end.

 

That positive light is a long way off I'm afraid!

[Hecateh]

Mine 100 sqm and standard block and brick

[newhome]

1 hour ago, Mr Punter said:

Would @lizzie and @Hecateh like to say how much their projects have come in at per metre, inc fees and services?  We are just completing a project which will cost about £2,100 per metre.

 

Mine sounds like a bargain bucket compared to others. Without the land (and most of the foundations as they were here already) it cost circa £750 per square metre including fees and services. That’s probably reflective of my husband doing such a lot of the work here to keep costs down however, and maybe there are some economies of scale too as the house is 350 square metres. It’s also a pretty ‘normal’ house in my view. Nothing architecturally inspiring, it looks exactly like the house next door! It’s still very touch and go in terms of being able to recover the cost if I sold it however, and there are still things that need to be done here if I ever manage to get someone out here to do them. 

 

It’s a timber frame house with blocks and rendering. We did pay 10k extra for ‘Supawall’ from the timber frame company which meant that we had pre insulated panels delivered and installed. We had some very good trades in and some fairly hopeless ones too. As newbies to the area it was difficult to get the better ones at times. 

 

 

 

[Gone West]

The subject of cost per m2 is something I have commented on before on here. How is the area calculated, presumably external area, but does it include balconies, verandahs or garages? What about integrated garages? How are costs calculated, do they include all the paperwork, professional fees and testing. If the work has been done by the owner has the cost of tools been included, and has the VAT refund been included? The cost of ours is difficult to calculate in order to compare costs. When we did our budgeting we were naive and just used a costs estimator at the back of a building magazine. We are pretty close to our budget but can't yet work out accurately a cost/m2.

[newhome]

1 hour ago, PeterStarck said:

The subject of cost per m2 is something I have commented on before on here. How is the area calculated, presumably external area, but does it include balconies, verandahs or garages? What about integrated garages? How are costs calculated, do they include all the paperwork, professional fees and testing. If the work has been done by the owner has the cost of tools been included, and has the VAT refund been included? The cost of ours is difficult to calculate in order to compare costs. When we did our budgeting we were naive and just used a costs estimator at the back of a building magazine. We are pretty close to our budget but can't yet work out accurately a cost/m2.

 

Mine was very rough and ready, done on a fag packet just now . Never worked it out before. I was told that the house was 350 square metres so didn't work that out but I think it might be a bit bigger than that if I look at the external dimensions of the footprint as it seems to be 12 metres deep by 16.5 wide x 2 as it's 2 storey, minus a bit as one room at the back is single storey. There are no balconies or verandas but I did include the cost of the detached garage but not the size of it. I included costs of the fencing, patio, steps, disabled ramp etc etc. but not plants. Didn't include the vat reclaim as I am hopefully getting that back. I included all fees, insurance, warranty and testing costs apart from the plot purchase / solicitor, and we didn't pay for the original building warrant or the planning permission as it had that already. The majority of the foundations were here already too so wrapped up in the plot purchase which I didn't include. I included the cost of the more significant tools / equipment such as the scaffold tower and any tools / equipment hire costs, but not general purpose things as hubby had quite a lot of tools already and I didn't track absolutely everything he bought, but that wouldn't add a significant amount to the cost anyway. So yes, it's not an exact science! 

 

We didn't use a cost estimator but I had looked at one before we put the budget together. I got the OH to break down the individual trades and phases and come up with an estimate for each as that was way out of my comfort zone. I did ask him to walk me through each cost element though and sometimes the simple task of doing that and my uneducated questioning uncovered areas that weren't quite right and were readjusted. We had to factor in labour costs for the areas that he wasn't able to do himself and that was a bit of a leap of faith as some of the things that were down to him he hadn't attempted before. My only involvement in this project to begin with was ordering, payments, and keeping control of the budget. I originally set the budget at 200k with a 20k contingency. We were pretty much on track with that with a bit of economising in areas when we went over in other areas. And then it all went a bit wrong when my hubby got sick as he got someone to build an extension on the back to house the bloody simulator that he bought and never used, so that pushed the cost up, and left me with an administrative nightmare with the council which one day I will write up to serve as a warning to others when you step outside of process! And I ended up paying about 30k in labour costs to get things done once my hubby was too sick to do anything himself and finish things off. He would have done many of those jobs himself previously. So that pushed it up to around 260k in the end which given the circumstances I didn't think was too bad. By that stage I was just relieved to get it signed off! 

 

 

Edited March 23, 2018 by newhome

[Hecateh]

3 hours ago, newhome said:

And then it all went a bit wrong when my hubby got sick as he got someone to build an extension on the back to house the bloody simulator that he bought and never used, so that pushed the cost up, and left me with an administrative nightmare with the council which one day I will write up to serve as a warning to others when you step outside of process! And I ended up paying about 30k in labour costs to get things done once my hubby was too sick to do anything himself and finish things off. He would have done many of those jobs himself previously.

This is a situation that no contingency allows for and, for most of us luckily, isn't common.

 

Such respect fo you for carrying on in these circumstances.  

 

My son keeps telling me the ways in which I am making my new house less sellable or lower value.  And I keep telling him 'I don't care'.  If there were grandkids or even a chance then it may be different but, as that  isn't the case, this is about me and my lifestyle.  To be fair he now usually beats me to it.  

[newhome]

7 hours ago, Hecateh said:

My son keeps telling me the ways in which I am making my new house less sellable or lower value.  And I keep telling him 'I don't care'.  If there were grandkids or even a chance then it may be different but, as that  isn't the case, this is about me and my lifestyle.  To be fair he now usually beats me to it.  

 

I agree totally. If you are going to the effort of building your own home it definitely should be about you if you intend staying there for a decent length of time. I don’t think I could be bothered with the effort of it all if that wasn’t the case.