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Timber frame passive standard build


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Good morning all,

I am building a house with a frame supplied by MBC Timberframe.   I have been very impressed with the service so far.   We are not finished yet although the frame is up and my windows and doors are in.  Roof covering is also on and the render guys are on site at the moment.   We are using Parex rendering by the way.

 

I also had MBC install a passive slab and this made me thing about how to finish the works below ground and up to what will be my finished ground level.  if I was building with block/brick i would have installed several courses of them agains the insulation.  But since we don't have conventional trench foundations that isn't ideal. The passive slab sits on hard EPS insulation as you probably know.  I asked Peter Gray who is my project manager at MBC if he had any suggestions and he told me about a previous installation he had designed for a client.

 

I involves fabricating a trim of powder coated aluminium which is attached to the bottom of the frame with a layer of Geotex waterproof membrane protecting the EPS as this is below ground level.   Peter was very helpful, sent me a drawing of it and talked me through the process.  I had a local fabrication firm (Barnett Engineering in North Wales) make up the metal.  They also made me a selection of inside and outside corners which neaten up the corner element of the trims.   The cost of the metal came to just over 2K.   I applied the Geotex to the outside of the EPS and then attached the metal trim to the bottom of the frame which was very straightforward to do.  

 

I have attached some pics and I hope that this might be of interest to others who are self building!   The battens in the pics are the carriers for the render board.  if you have any questions, I would be happy to help, and I'm sure Peter would be too.

 

Derek

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Edited by Scotrock
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Hi Lizzie

My build is just outside Wrexham.  Where are you building?  We better be careful here.....Peter will be thinking of patenting this solution ?. 

 

I only wish I had thought to specify that it is finished in matt powder coat rather than gloss, which seems to be the default finish at my metalworkers.  Still, it is a very good solution and my renderers are impressed with it, as am I.

 

Derek

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Great job -this is a very well considered detail and I wish I had seen it a couple of years ago when I was building my MBC house. I did ask around at the time and received various ideas. In  the end I developed my own approach as follows:

 

I installed an 300mm alumium flashing, it was actually the black powder coated aluminium roll used for seamless gutters but rolled as straight pieces with a seam rolled seam for strength. It seems to have worked out well - it is screwed and stuck to the EPS

 

It was installed to form a flashing from underneath the external rendered finish , going across the soles plate and over the EPS to well below the nominal DPC level at which the extermal paving is installed. See the phot os attached, which should give you an idea. I had this flashiing made by the company that supplied and installed my seamless gutters, but they seem to be no longer installing seamless gutters and are concentrating on aluminium pressings , etc.

 

I had some special aluminium flashings, coated to match the window frames, made for below the french windows/doors, ariund the garage doors etc.

 

I attach some photos, during construction (though it at that stage still covered/protected by the blue external wrapping sheath used by MBC to keep render and other rubbish off the coating the flashing)  and some taken today, to show the finished look.

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2 hours ago, Scotrock said:

Hi Lizzie

My build is just outside Wrexham.  Where are you building?  We better be careful here.....Peter will be thinking of patenting this solution ?. 

 

I only wish I had thought to specify that it is finished in matt powder coat rather than gloss, which seems to be the default finish at my metalworkers.  Still, it is a very good solution and my renderers are impressed with it, as am I.

 

Derek

Ha ha I think Peter will be alive to possibilities, he is no slouch! There was much debate before finally settling on this as a solution and it works well enough. We did get ours done in a matt finish I was very clear no gloss on anything, think you are right about gloss being default,  we are very modern style and gloss would have been wrong for us. Ours looks to be deeper over the EPS than yours it goes down quite a way and yours perhaps higher up the wall. We are part render (alumasc) and part larch clad with internorm 3g aliclad windows and doors.

 

Did you only have Peter helping you for  MBC for that part of your build, are you going it alone for the rest?

 

We have been at it nigh on 2 years now and you look more finished than we do LOL We had a lot of issues to get past. Still getting there on some things but light beginning to appear at the end of the very long tunnel.

 

We are on the Warwks/Worcs border near Stratford upon Avon. On the top of the Ridgeway with clear views across nearly 40 miles to the  Malvern Hills and home beyond  - I am Welsh but South, don’t know your part of the world at all Derek.

 

Kitchen fitting going on at the mo but outside is a nightmare of mud, groundworks not finished yet.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Lizzie,

Looks super.  Ours is a cottage look on the outside.   We still have to back fill around the house to get back up to ground level so that's why it might look higher right now.  

Peter only got involved just before MBC laid the passive slab.  We had been dealing with Keith in the UK and David in Ireland beforehand.   I have been pleased with our timing.  We started demolishing the old house on Aug 5 last year.   The site was ready for MBC by end August/early Sept.  They arrived on Oct 3 to lay the slab and started to erect the house on Oct 17.   Since then I have been concentrating on the outside first - slates on, windows in etc.   MVHR ducting is in now and all wall penetrations have been made.   Render should be finished this week, then temporary guttering can come down for fascias and soffits, the proper guttering up and At Last, the scaffolding can come down!!  And then MBC can return to install the insulation and do the airtightness test  After that we're on the inside and remaining groundworks and garden.  I am project managing it myself and it does help to be there to keep an eye on things.

 

All the best 

Derek

 

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Derek I admire you doing your own project managing I would be lost particularly on groundworks etc.

 

We have had Peter with us all the way along. We met Peter way before MBC was decided on I dont think he had any formal connection with them then, we did deal with Keith initally too - very nice chap.

 

 Good luck with it all, keep us in the loop with pics.  My kitchen going in at the mo....v v happy with that!

 

Best 

 

Liz

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  • 1 month later...

Really interesting post everyone! We're about to commit to MBC Timberframe and are just checking up on them so-to-speak. I haven't found a bad word said about them yet, and Derek/Lizzie the solution you've got for finishing around the perimeter looks great. Thanks very much for posting details, we will most likely do the same. 

Can I be cheeky and ask which windows you chose? We're going for the same look as in these pics and are interested in other people's experiences of window firms ...

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@MirandaPoth hello and welcome. 

 

We went for Internorm windows.  We are quite exposed up on a ridge and wanted the most robust we could find....will be fine I'm sure once we sort out the leaks on the big sliders LOL.....not sure if its an install problem or an issue from the problems we had with our slab not being level. We await expert opinion on the cause and solution. Leaks aside they are beautiful windows.

 

They do not usually have these issues with their windows and are now trying to help resolve it. I hope we can sort it soon as its holding up my build now and I want to get on and get moved in.

 

 I do urge you not to wear rose tinted specs, its so easy to be excited at this stage and think all are great and it will be wonderful and problem free - no-one is perfect, including the frame and slab suppliers,  everyone is capable of making mistakes and you need to watch and check and check again everything with everyone at every stage not only at drawing stage but on site too, I didn't at first and was probably a bit naive about it all....Lessons learnt  - I go to site pretty much every day now even if just to show my face and check around and try and field issues before they become headaches. I have/had some major problems mostly sorted but compromises have been needed to deal with some of the things and inevitably a lot of the extra cost involved has fallen on me too.

 

What is important is that the relevant suppliers sort out their cock ups promptly when notified not try and pass the buck. Some are better than others at this as I'm sure a browse around the forum will tell you.

 

Latest cock up example  that I have to sort out as relevant contractor long gone..............found out this week our (now sacked) groundworkers did not connect the toilet in the en suite to the foul drains the pipe was just left coming out under the slab and covered in sand etc so would have just been draining  (slowly) into the ground under the patio....thank goodness we have not put the concrete base down for patio yet and so when our 2nd fix plumber alerted us to the problem of toilet pan not draining properly we were able to go and dig about outside and find the unconnected pipe. Now have to dig a new trench and put another manhole in etc  Could have been a nightmare. Thank goodness for a plumber who took the trouble to tell me he thought we had a problem.  You need eyes in the back of your head with some of these people! Thankfully have lovely new groundworker who I have a lot of faith in.

 

Have you got some PM help from Peter via MBC lined up like Derek? If you are a rookie like me then some prof input and the excellent help available this forum will make a huge difference to you.

 

Finishing line looking tantalisingly close for us now......so want it to come quickly am so fed up of living in a rented house....2 years and counting!

 

Good luck keep us in the loop with progress.

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@lizzie thanks for the welcome and for your excellent advice! Much appreciated. We'll be living on site in a caravan (oh joy) so will be very close to the action but yes of course things will go wrong. We will be vigilant and learn as quickly as we can. Good luck with your windows and hope you get to move in very soon!

Edited by MirandaPoth
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13 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

 

Perhaps we should add it to the "banned words list"? :D

 

That would just ruin my fun of correcting people :), it’s one of the things I remember from college that I thought might be useful in the future. Along with brainstorms offend epileptic people so they are now called “mind maps”....... 

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One forum I use had the "naughty word" filter set to change the name of any popular car, like BMW, Audi etc, to Landrover, simply because the then forum owner was a Landrover fanatic................

 

We could do the same here, as long as we don't make the mistake that Ebuild did that prevented anyone from using the word "stopcock"....................

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6 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

One forum I use had the "naughty word" filter set to change the name of any popular car, like BMW, Audi etc, to Landrover, simply because the then forum owner was a Landrover fanatic................

 

We could do the same here, as long as we don't make the mistake that Ebuild did that prevented anyone from using the word "stopcock"....................

Love it, best laugh of the day!

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18 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

One forum I use had the "naughty word" filter set to change the name of any popular car, like BMW, Audi etc, to Landrover, simply because the then forum owner was a Landrover fanatic................

 

 

This place would soon fall into mayhem if I had access to such controls xD 

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5 hours ago, Construction Channel said:

 

That would just ruin my fun of correcting people :), it’s one of the things I remember from college that I thought might be useful in the future. Along with brainstorms offend epileptic people so they are now called “mind maps”....... 

Brainstorming

 

should we be offended - not according to the epilepsy organisation or the epilepsy foundation BUT YES according to the Daily Fail (and others).

 

Although no longer available an epilepsy magazine used to be call 'Brainstorm'

 

Another example of PC gone mad 

 

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