Haven't a clue !

[don atkinson]

Hi I'm reaching out in the hope I've come to the right place I have a village shop which was previously two terraced houses opened out to one , the business is no longer viable and would not sell as a commercial and I'm of that age now the quiet life beckons .

So my question is who do I seek advice from  on what to do eg convert back to two / leave as is  / convert to one or whatever to make the best return .

Obviously I'm no builder or developer but quite  handy at DIY .thanks in advance Don.

[gaz_moose]

id ask a local estate agent which would give the best return.

[Jilly]

Cynical me, I would ask for 3 estate agents’ opinions…

[don atkinson]

Thanks but we've done that several times with no clear answer from any of them obviously it's a complicated valuation.

[Nickfromwales]

Have you run this past a planning 'officer' to firstly ensure the change would not be contested?

 

My mates house is an old grocers shop that he and his wife ran for years in an area of greenbelt and away from supermarkets etc.

 

When there was a selection of reasonably close supermarkets his clietele started to go there and not to him. He and his wife said let's close the shop and convert to a nice big family home, the locals went berserk.

 

They claimed he should not be able to deprive them of this essential local amenity. He attended the local meeting and said, if you lot didn't go to Tesco I'd still have a business, so you've fallen on your own sword, sorry.

 

PP went in his favour, but just food for thought.

 

Estate agents look from their angle, eg can they make money from you. Planners will say "yes or no" to the viability. Talk to the right people  

[don atkinson]

Thanks that's exactly our situation and we are  fairy confident change of use being approved and you're right about speaking to the right people, we need to find someone to tell us the cost effective/profitable way of selling.

[Nickfromwales]

5 minutes ago, don atkinson said:

the cost effective/profitable way of selling.

Sometimes that is to cut your losses and run, selling quickly for less to a developer who then has to do the hurdle-jumping. Factor in time as well as costs, as none of us are getting any younger, and a complex build project can be an arse.

 

Have you considered getting planning and doing the property conversion yourselves, via a costed and programmed builder, for full retail sale?

[G and J]

We’ve successfully employed a very professional local estate agent, (more of a land agent type than a bunch of lairy suited 20somethings) on a fee basis for comparative valuations.  If you’ve one in your area. 

[ProDave]

Do you want to convert it yourself and continue living there, or are you just wanting to sell and go somewhere else and trying to work out how to get the best price for it?

 

Auction might even be a way?

[Marvin]

Hi @don atkinson

 

In my humble opinion, towards retirement age, I would reduce my risk by selling it as it is. Health, stress, financing the work and uncertainty would all factor for me

.

Adding the price you could sell it at, along with the cost of conversion, may not give you as much money after costs as just selling it. It's all a risk...

 

I will not list all the costs or risks but there are loads of items involved.

 

Good advice above from @ProDave.  

 

The costs to you from selling at auction can be added to the buyers fees by contract these days....

 

For further thoughts here, more info is required. 

 

Good luck Don.

 

M

 

 

 

 

 

[don atkinson]

Really appreciate all above comments thank you I've got an architect booked for a feasibility chat (£200) and after looking I agree auction seems favourable maybe just do some essential renovations to make it more appealing I.e new roof(felt in tatters) and new suspended floor above basement( joists rotting hence sagging floor) or should I not even do that ?

Sorry if these questions are stupid and repetitive.

[Nickfromwales]

I'd just walk away and auction as is. Likelihood is anyone developing this will do the work anyways, quicker & cheaper, and you may do work that they'd be doing routinely; the money lost / time invested won't boost the sale price much if at all. A developer, for eg, may want / have to convert the roof to a warm roof so the work you first suggest may be one of the first things to go in the skip  

[saveasteading]

Is the whole project a conversion? Presumably upstairs is accomodation already, and only downstairs is a conversion.

On that basis a private buyer might leave the roof alone, or until cash allows.

 

Otoh, the new owner should seek  a VAT rebate on the whole project, not only half of it.

 

I agree just sell. As @Nickfromwales says, the prospects for private or commercial buyers are very different.

 

 

 

[torre]

From your last picture it looks like this is a Post Office? Is there value in that as a commercial sale on its own, or splitting into a smaller shop plus single residence?

 

Converting from a shop to residences should be permitted development so it may be worth getting prior approval as it gives certainty to potential buyers about one option at least, at little cost to you.

 

I'd expect a local estate agent to have a good feel for whether there's more potential value in other options (single large residence, multiple flats) versus a straight split into two terraces. The only 'development' option I'd think about getting into would be doing the absolute minimum to split this back into two terraces, if valuations leave you confident this will be the best developed option, or at least looks like giving you some certainty of a reasonable return without much risk (and probably selling each as a 'fixer upper' rather than fixing roofs and floors etc)

[Tosh]

If you wanted to convert it back to residential then you'd need a change of use first which, without being in place, would probably scare most propestive domestic purchasers away. You say it would not be commercially viable but have you tested that i.e. advertised it as a business for sale etc. I'm anticpating the planners may want to see that before permitting a change of use but best to talk to them. A pre-app may give you some pointers.

[Bancroft]

2 hours ago, Nickfromwales said:

I'd just walk away and auction as is.

+1 for this if you don't plan on re-developing it for yourself.

 

I think people doing re-furbs would generally prefer to do everything themselves - that way they don't have concerns about how well/badly prior work might have been done.  Also, they probably feel that they'll get it for a better price (even if they don't).

 

Certainly when I've done re-furb work in the past I've always wanted things to be as stripped back as possible so that I can see the whole situation.  Freshly painted bits in an auction property ring alarm bells!

[Nickfromwales]

2 minutes ago, Bancroft said:

Freshly painted bits in an auction property ring alarm bells!

100%. Folk will prob bid more on the devil they can see and therefore know. 

[Jilly]

4 hours ago, torre said:

 

 

Converting from a shop to residences should be permitted development so it may be worth getting prior approval as it gives certainty to potential buyers about one option at least, at little cost to you.

 

 

Definitely explore this option. Loads of shops and commercial buildings are being converted into residential units by this method near us. It’s much less onerous than regular planning permission. 

[saveasteading]

4 hours ago, torre said:

Converting from a shop to residences should be permitted development

I'm afraid it is the opposite. Loss of local services.

You will likely get opposition from locals, and then the council will want proof that it is not viable as a business , in any way or form.

 

I would suggest that you start by talking to the Parish Council. They may well support you and that would be very significant.

If they resist then you may have  a long process of being seen to try to sell as a going concern.

 

The complaints are often from people who never use the shop/ pub etc.

 

OTOH If you have the community onside, then it will be easy enough.

 

[don atkinson]

Again thanks , all valid points and totally agree about opposition from locals who never use us but I'm fairly confident the parish councillors who we know quite well are well aware of the recent commercial developments  e.g large co.op just down the road a farm shop two minutes away and a cafe/coffee shop a couple of doors down all of which have affected the business badly.

[torre]

@saveasteading permitted development of commercial to residential

[don atkinson]

Thanks that's useful.

[saveasteading]

Thanks @torre. I will have a read of the official government paper on this if readily findable.

But I've seen this recently, ore than once  definitely not happening quickly due to alleged loss of facility... they had to prove it was non viable.

[G and J]

12 hours ago, Marvin said:

In my humble opinion, towards retirement age, I would reduce my risk by selling it as it is. Health, stress, financing the work and uncertainty would all factor for me

Oh dear.  We are both long retired, but for us I think that means more time to apply to the build. But to each their own. 
 

I feel strongly that to benefit from it the end result of building or renovating has to be something you want to live in.  To do either for profit rarely works for most peeps, the uncertain uplift in value comes at a price of a lot of stress, as a minimum. 

[Marvin]

Building your own home, or renovating, where profit is not the motive, is a different game, assuming you don't have ideas above your finances..