Neighbour’s ‘Temp’ building maybe ignoring building regs.

[G and J]

Our new next door neighbour put in for planning permission for a building to house one set of aging parents in their garden. That was refused flat, it was completely outwith anything likely to pass. 
 

They simultaneously put in a certificate of lawfulness to formally recognise that the same building was legally a caravan or moveable building. 
 

It arrived today. It’s a panelised, single storey, flat roofed timber framed building on screw foundations. It’s as moveable or temporary as any other modern estate house.  
 

So I’m left scratching my head as to how this can get through building control.  I think it’s getting on towards 100m2 internally with two bedrooms. 
 

It’s well within a metre of our boundary yet appears to be principally made of combustible material.  
 

It’s on medium elasticity clay built over where they cut down a mature tree a couple of weeks ago.  When we built they made us go down 3m in the same circumstances for strip foundations.  Their screw foundations are about 1.5m into the ground. 
 

I would be very surprised if they had applied for building regs, so I presume they are either ignoring the rules or they are under a building notice (which in fairness I don’t understand). 

My belief is that they do have to comply with current building regs.  
 

Can I quietly check if they are under a building notice?
 

If under a building notice do they get inspected?  And if so is it automatically the responsibility of the local authority?

Until today I assumed they would be craning in a ‘static’ beloved of many seaside caravan parks, that could abd would be craned out again when no longer needed.   But this is a 140mm studwork based timber framed bungalow avoiding all the planning requirements, and maybe, all the building regs too. 
 

What best to do to understand how legal this thing is?

 

[marshian]

Sounds a lot nicer than a park home……..

[SteamyTea]

5 hours ago, G and J said:

What best to do to understand how legal this thing is

Explore the rules about fire safety, that should trigger a bit more official investigation.

[DevilDamo]

Get in touch with Planning and Building Control and let them investigate.

[joe90]

1 hour ago, DevilDamo said:

Get in touch with Planning and Building Control and let them investigate.

+1

[Jilly]

So did the ‘Certificate of Lawfulness’ application succeed? 
 

There are a lot of granny annexe companies who offer to do a planning application with the sale. I’m guessing they are hoping it should come under Permitted Development, also the caravan regulations are slightly open to interpretation. 

[ProDave]

They probably would not need planning or even a lawful development certificate for a "caravan" and that would be legal if the occupants at least used some of the services in the house.  To legally qualify as a "caravan" it needs to be within certain size limits which does allow a building of about 100 square metres. And it needs to me moveable as a unit.  It does NOT have to be on wheels. Lifting by crane onto a low loader would qualify.  So the test would be is it build on a strong frame or would it collapse like a pack of cards if you tried lifting it.

 

The "caravan" is exempt from building control but BC would be needed for any connection to a drainage system.

[kandgmitchell]

2 hours ago, DevilDamo said:

Get in touch with Planning and Building Control and let them investigate.

+2

[Onoff]

All councils generally have portals like this where you search for an application with just the postcode:

 

[G and J]

9 hours ago, Jilly said:

So did the ‘Certificate of Lawfulness’ application succeed? 
 

 

 

Yes, they put in a planning app and a Certificate of Lawfulness app in for exactly the same building before they'd even moved in

12 hours ago, marshian said:

Sounds a lot nicer than a park home

 

Would be if they hadn't chosen to have it clad like a park home with brilliant white uvpc windows ......we are in farmland and of course they don't want to see it from their house, so they've put it right on our boundary

9 hours ago, ProDave said:

is it build on a strong frame or would it collapse like a pack of cards if you tried lifting it.

 

It's on screw foundations and the materials/construction would suggest won't have structural integrity if lifted.

 

Are we p......d, oh boy yes. Are we lucky enough to be planning our build...thank goodness...yes.

 

Do we just have to get over it and hope it does less damage to our  spring house sale 🤞 than  the application did when we tried to sell earlier this year.

 

There, I feel better already.

[Jilly]

@G and J Get planting a hedge then?

[G and J]

🤔 we have a 6ft hedge, soon to be taller.....building circa 13ft....so hoping for a LOT of Spring growth😉

[joe90]

1 hour ago, G and J said:

Do we just have to get over it and hope it does less damage to our  spring house sale

No reason anyone should flout rules, it could set a precedent 

1 hour ago, G and J said:

It's on screw foundations and the materials/construction would suggest won't have structural integrity if lifted.

I agree, a neighbour in Devon had a park home (we rented till my build was finished) but that was on a steel chassis that was lifted in in two sections so move able.

[ETC]

19 hours ago, G and J said:

Our new next door neighbour put in for planning permission for a building to house one set of aging parents in their garden. That was refused flat, it was completely outwith anything likely to pass. 
 

They simultaneously put in a certificate of lawfulness to formally recognise that the same building was legally a caravan or moveable building. 
 

It arrived today. It’s a panelised, single storey, flat roofed timber framed building on screw foundations. It’s as moveable or temporary as any other modern estate house.  
 

So I’m left scratching my head as to how this can get through building control.  I think it’s getting on towards 100m2 internally with two bedrooms.

It didn’t get through. My money’s on unauthorised works.
 

It’s well within a metre of our boundary yet appears to be principally made of combustible material.

Gets better - not a change of getting approval.
 

It’s on medium elasticity clay built over where they cut down a mature tree a couple of weeks ago.  When we built they made us go down 3m in the same circumstances for strip foundations.  Their screw foundations are about 1.5m into the ground. 
 

I would be very surprised if they had applied for building regs, so I presume they are either ignoring the rules or they are under a building notice (which in fairness I don’t understand).

Can’t use a Building Notice for the erection of a new dwelling.

My belief is that they do have to comply with current building regs.

Correct.
 

Can I quietly check if they are under a building notice?

Yes. Ring the Council and ask.
 

If under a building notice do they get inspected?  And if so is it automatically the responsibility of the local authority?

It shouldn’t be under a BN - but yes inspections will be carried out for all applications.

Until today I assumed they would be craning in a ‘static’ beloved of many seaside caravan parks, that could abd would be craned out again when no longer needed.   But this is a 140mm studwork based timber framed bungalow avoiding all the planning requirements, and maybe, all the building regs too. 
 

What best to do to understand how legal this thing is?

Speak to your friendly neighbourhood BCO.

 

 

[Gordo]

The interpretation of "movable" for a temporary building would be at the discretion of your local council. Most wouldn't accept craning in as movable. Even then it has a maximum term (6 or 12 months maybe but cant recall) before it must be moved. If its not temporary or under 30m" with no sleeping accommodation it is not exempt from building regulations.

 

If not exempt it would be treated as any other dwelling in any way. Screw piles or whatever foundations on whatever sub-soil may be suitable if certified by a structural engineer.

 

This is definitely unauthorised works under B Regs if it hasn't been notified to council before completion. It is also most likely contravening many regulations.

 

If you dont formally complain nothing will be done and it may even eventually be statutory barred from enforcement action.

Edited November 26 by Gordo

[DevilDamo]

@ETC Why can’t you submit a BN application for a new dwelling?

[Gordo]

7 minutes ago, DevilDamo said:

@ETC Why can’t you submit a BN application for a new dwelling?

Because it proved to be a shit show of non-compliance, so it was withdrawn (in N Ireland anyway)

Edited November 26 by Gordo

[ProDave]

You need full plans to get a building warrant in Scotland as well.

[Gordo]

15 minutes ago, ProDave said:

You need full plans to get a building warrant in Scotland as well.

Good for Scotland.

The rest of UK submit plans and start work same day. Hence a shit show of non-compliance. Shitty drawings/specifications, ignorant first time self builders lead by sub-contractors of varying pride levels with no interest in the overall build. Complaining about building control for their own short comings and not offering professional design advice. Its really a joke but the public are funding one of the biggest investments the are likely to make on it, so its not funny.

Edited November 26 by Gordo

[G and J]

12 minutes ago, Gordo said:

Good for Scotland.

The rest of UK submit plans and start work same day. Hence a shit show of non-compliance. Shitty drawings/specifications, ignorant first time self builders lead by sub-contractors of varying pride levels with no interest in the overall build. Complaining about building control for their own short comings and not offering professional design advice. Its really a joke but the public are funding one of the biggest investments the are likely to make on it, so its not funny.

I suspect that that’s kinda like one of the neighbours next door to our new house assume/believe we will be in demolition and building.   We’re trying hard at being planned, prepared, tidy, thoughtful, considerate and very effective.  Time will tell. 
 

 

[G and J]

Anyway, back to our posts about our errant neighbours.  
 

I really have calmed down now and hopefully got a bit more perspective.  Yesterday I (G) felt like the bath spider.  You know, the one that keeps falling back down however hard I try at climbing, all the time knowing instinctively that any time soon the shower will be turned on and I’ll be washed down the stinky rapids to oblivion.  
 

Every thing I tried to progress didn’t and I had some other non building worries on repeat too.  So I was tired and emotional (but technically sober however unhinged) and had a rant.  Will try not to let that happen again.  
 

I've carefully had a good look at the screw foundations of next doors illegal building (nice, balanced language there) and they are more than a metre from our boundaries.  And looking at what they appear to be doing I see no actual danger to life or limb.  OK I think the screw foundations will sink and the building is likely to eventually become unusable but that’s not a safety issue.  
 

So I stand back and think about our build which requires us to sell our house.  And that sale is probably more likely if next door aren’t in a bitchy battle with our council.  
 

Yes I think it’s wrong and stupid of them to flout planning law and building regs but I need to focus on getting the house sold so we can build at our new location.  
 

But thank you for listening folks.  My rant did help me get some sleep.