Boundary retaining wall failure

[SilverShadow]

Hey all - another day, another quandary that I'd appreciate your guys awesome advice on please 😁

 

We recently moved into a house on a hill, and the boundary wall adjacent to the neighbouring property is also a retaining wall (approx 10m long and up to 1.5m high). Our property is the higher of the 2, so essentially the retaining wall keeps our land from spilling into theirs

 

We introduced ourselves to the neighbours of this boundary (who seem a decent bunch) & they mentioned the wall has 2 big cracks in it.

 

We'd like to ensure this is fixed, but realise it'll be costly (maybe £3k, maybe more???). Fixing it ensures no land slippage our side & keeps them from worrying

 

The neighbours said our old owners built the wall, which suggests it's our responsibility. However, I've checked our deeds & there's no indication its our responsibility to maintain

 

In some ways were happy to pay for fixing it ourselves. But likewise, this might then imply its our responsibility, when it may be shared. Especially when maintaining it in the future 

 

We'd ideally like to share the responsibility/cost with the neighbour, but don't want to suggest it if we're likely liable for it

 

Does anyone have advice on what we could check & go from here please?

 

Many thanks for your time as always 😁

Shadow

[Gus Potter]

12 minutes ago, SilverShadow said:

Hey all - another day, another quandary that I'd appreciate your guys awesome advice on please 😁

 

We recently moved into a house on a hill, and the boundary wall adjacent to the neighbouring property is also a retaining wall (approx 10m long and up to 1.5m high). Our property is the higher of the 2, so essentially the retaining wall keeps our land from spilling into theirs

 

We introduced ourselves to the neighbours of this boundary (who seem a decent bunch) & they mentioned the wall has 2 big cracks in it.

 

We'd like to ensure this is fixed, but realise it'll be costly (maybe £3k, maybe more???). Fixing it ensures no land slippage our side & keeps them from worrying

 

The neighbours said our old owners built the wall, which suggests it's our responsibility. However, I've checked our deeds & there's no indication its our responsibility to maintain

 

In some ways were happy to pay for fixing it ourselves. But likewise, this might then imply its our responsibility, when it may be shared. Especially when maintaining it in the future 

 

We'd ideally like to share the responsibility/cost with the neighbour, but don't want to suggest it if we're likely liable for it

 

Does anyone have advice on what we could check & go from here please?

 

Many thanks for your time as always 😁

Shadow

What a good post and example of approaching things pragmatically.

 

For all. Retaining walls like this often don't have an indefinite life span.

 

A bit of tecky stuff. From time to time the wall gets frosted and this causes the soil behind the wall to swell up a bit right at the top where it can apply a good overturning force, mind you it needs to be a hard prolonged frost. This pushes the wall sideways as the ice crystals grow for example. Then you have settlement of the retained soil and surcharge loading, can be just the wieght of a big tree locally, trees can be heavy! Now you may have heavy rain and this excess water causes the soil to weaken behind the wall so it shoves the wall sideways and then you can add a bit of water pressure. Any trees or big shrubs can push the wall sideways as the roots grow. If you have a timber fence attached to the top or down the side of the wall then the wind loading can push the wall.

 

Now in goetechnical terms (we have many) it's easier for the soil to move than to shove it back into place. We call this active (the soil moving) and passive soil pressure.. shoving the soil back into place. It can often take roughly 2 -3 times the effort to shove the soil back to where it was.

 

Now once the wall moves a bit then cracks tend to develop in the retained soil. These can get filled with muck.. in other words the wall often never can recover it's position... it a slow progessive failure.

 

Odd that there is no mention in the deeds.

 

Anyway. If I was you I would try and figure out what has caused the cracks in the wall. Do what you can to mitigate this if it is on your side. Then have a chat with the neighbours and say.. I've done everything I can on my side to stop it geting worse. Let's see how it goes. Any good will on your side will stand you in good stead later.

 

 

 

 

[SilverShadow]

Many thanks, Gus. That was a very excellent & detailed response, which explains the soil mechanics aspect brilliantly 😁

 

I will have another scan of the deeds, in case it's something I've missed.

 

Looking at the house from the street, the retaining wall is on the right hand side of the property. I'm not sure, but think there's some unspoken rule that left-side boundaries would usually be our responsibility?

 

I could always ask our conveyancer- hopefully they could clarify without it costing much 🤞

 

The wall itself is fairly sturdy, but I noticed it has no drainage outlets, so I imagine the trapped water from excess rain & frosts have caused the swell over time, as you mentioned 

 

As a side note, does anyone recommend a type of wall construction (materials & design)?

 

Additionally, is this something we should ask a structural engineer's advice on, or just trust a builder with retaining wall experience?

 

 

Many thanks again

Shadow

Edited 20 hours ago by SilverShadow

[SilverShadow]

In response to Gus's comments earlier: a double check of the plans/register confirm there is no mention of ownership of the retaining boundary wall.

 

Looking on various legal sites, it seems as though the responsibility lies with the owner who's land it being retained in place. Given that, then i think the onus is on us to maintain this

[TommoUK]

37 minutes ago, SilverShadow said:

In response to Gus's comments earlier: a double check of the plans/register confirm there is no mention of ownership of the retaining boundary wall.

 

Looking on various legal sites, it seems as though the responsibility lies with the owner who's land it being retained in place. Given that, then i think the onus is on us to maintain this

The Land Registry entry and plan is essentially a summary of the ownership details, covenants, charges etc. Tgis entry wont necessarily describe every boundary maintenance obligation. You need to try and get a copy (filed copy) of the original sale agreement (Deed). These are often 'filed' at the land registry and can be obtained for a fee. It's a postal request service unless your solicitor does it via their online account.

[scottishjohn]

2 hours ago, SilverShadow said:

Given that, then i think the onus is on us to maintain this

but is it your wall or theirs  or shared?

depends where the actual boundary is 

and considering it is retaing their land I would suggest it is their problem  not yours 

 

which house was built first ?

 

 i would doubt your land was reduced in height to build your house  ,why would anybody do that ?

 far more likely they wanted to build up some sloping ground to make a flat garden

finding orginal planning drawings if possible of your  house would show that would it not ?

 

Edited 7 hours ago by scottishjohn