Paul29 Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 Hi all, abit of a long post but hopefully will get some advice. im looking at building a temporary home (max 2 years) while we build our house. We have four small kids so the idea of a static caravan doesn’t cut it. My build will not be to regs but should be fine. Raised timber base with 200mm rock wool. Walls 100x50 stud walls with 100mm cavity battens/rock wool. The roof is the thing that is keep me thinking… I’d prefer a flat roof for the ease but I’m not going to be able to span 8m. I’m now thinking along the lines of a vaulted ceiling with pir inbetween the joists. What are your thoughts? it’s going to have an open area for living room and kitchen, small bathroom, two medium sized bed rooms and one master. This is going to be build well away from anywhere in Ireland so I’m not going to have issues with planning etc. would love to know people’s thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilDamo Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 1 hour ago, Paul29 said: My build will not be to regs but should be fine. How so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe90 Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 Fine IF you can getaway with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conor Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 Rent. Save your energy for building your home. You'll need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 19 Author Share Posted September 19 1 hour ago, DevilDamo said: How so? How so fine or how so not to regs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 19 Author Share Posted September 19 1 hour ago, joe90 said: Fine IF you can getaway with it. True Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilDamo Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 Just now, Paul29 said: How so fine or how so not to regs? Both. Why are you not going to build to BR’s and/or how can you avoid it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 19 Author Share Posted September 19 32 minutes ago, Conor said: Rent. Save your energy for building your home. You'll need it. The rent here will be 2k/month so that’s a non starter plus it’ll be a useful addition when main house is up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 19 Author Share Posted September 19 Just now, DevilDamo said: Both. Why are you not going to build to BR’s and/or how can you avoid it? It’ll be cheaper to build. Once main house is done it’ll be a guest house so not much use. Ultimately it’s a temporary building. It’s going to be in the middle of the country side well away from most public Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe90 Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 3 hours ago, Paul29 said: We have four small kids so the idea of a static caravan doesn’t cut it. Are you sure? A large static would be so much easier and probably cheaper, and leave you to spend your energies on house building . @ProDave got permission to keep his on site after the build 🤷♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 19 Author Share Posted September 19 2 minutes ago, joe90 said: Are you sure? A large static would be so much easier and probably cheaper, and leave you to spend your energies on house building . @ProDave got permission to keep his on site after the build 🤷♂️ We looked at the statics even the big ones are abit pokey, and we have four little ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell griffiths Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 10 hours ago, Paul29 said: It’ll be cheaper to build. Once main house is done it’ll be a guest house so not much use. Ultimately it’s a temporary building. It’s going to be in the middle of the country side well away from most public You need to build it to comply with building regs, I don’t care about your planning, but for future use if you allow anybody to sleep in it and you have a fire and somebody is hurt they will crucify you. what if after the build you want to chuck it on air b+b, it will need to have a fire safety plan to let it. doing it right will not cost much more and you will end up with a usable building, doing it on the cheap I bet two or three years after you move out it will be scrap. have you looked at the timber cabins and add more insulation and stuff. I agree about renting £25 grand down the drain build something that will be useful. will the house have a big garage. how about a big triple garage with granny flat above, build that first and it’s there forever. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 Yes definitely get a static caravan as large as you can find. Then spend the time and effort to add external insulation and clad it if you want it to be warmer and look nicer. It will comply with all the rules it has to and be fit for habitation. I don't know the law in Ireland, but in the UK a static caravan comes under a different set of rules to building control. Assuming you have planning for the house build, it should be easy to get permission for the static and do it legally. Alternatively as you are building a house, why not design it so you can build one wing of it first and kit that out to live in while you build the rest? That way all your work is permanent and gets you to a finished house quicker. You can think of outbuildings for holiday use after the main house is built, but do them properly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saveasteading Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 Do what everyone says. Build it properly for 5% more than for a bodge. Why 8m span? Add a wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjc55 Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 (edited) Was going to ask about the problems with an 8m span, as savasteading asks why cant you add a wall? Edited September 20 by mjc55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilDamo Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 12 hours ago, Paul29 said: Ultimately it’s a temporary building. No such thing in Planning or Building Regulation terms. How are you going to explain this “temporary” building to Planning and Building Control when they carry out their visit and inspections for the main house? This could go massively against you and you don’t want to be on the back foot with the Council from the outset. But ultimately, it’s your choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 160m² is enormous! Sounds like a lot of effort for a temporary building. The materials to build something that size, even if you cut a few corners, are going to add up to many tens of thousands. You could use engineered timber joists for that span. According to the JJI span tables you could use 450mm deep joists at 300mm centres. So that's nearly 70 joists. Which will be a fair chunk of money. Admittedly that's to support a habitable floor rather than a roof, it's possible that you'd get away with a bit less given the lighter loading of a roof. The other options would be trusses, and you lose the flat roof, or mid span supports. I'm not familiar with the planning and building regs situation in Ireland. I'm up in the Highlands of Scotland and there's absolutely no way you could get away with building something that size, and then living in it, without attracting attention. Especially if you're doing a self build straight afterwards on the same site. Over here we have a planning exemption for agricultural buildings. Could you erect a big agricultural shed, and get permission for one or two static caravans to live in beside it? The shed could provide useful extra space. If you tried to move too much stuff in there you might be breaking a few rules but I think you'd be on much stronger ground than your plan of building a huge temporary building with no permission. And you'd end up with a massive shed afterwards. I've yet to meet anybody who thought their shed was too large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjc55 Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 (edited) Where does the 160m come from? Edit: Apologies, thread title! 160m that's bigger than our build, probably bigger than a lot on here! Edited September 20 by mjc55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 20 Author Share Posted September 20 3 hours ago, Russell griffiths said: You need to build it to comply with building regs, I don’t care about your planning, but for future use if you allow anybody to sleep in it and you have a fire and somebody is hurt they will crucify you. what if after the build you want to chuck it on air b+b, it will need to have a fire safety plan to let it. doing it right will not cost much more and you will end up with a usable building, doing it on the cheap I bet two or three years after you move out it will be scrap. have you looked at the timber cabins and add more insulation and stuff. I agree about renting £25 grand down the drain build something that will be useful. will the house have a big garage. how about a big triple garage with granny flat above, build that first and it’s there forever. You’re spot on about the regs. I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 20 Author Share Posted September 20 4 hours ago, ProDave said: Yes definitely get a static caravan as large as you can find. Then spend the time and effort to add external insulation and clad it if you want it to be warmer and look nicer. It will comply with all the rules it has to and be fit for habitation. I don't know the law in Ireland, but in the UK a static caravan comes under a different set of rules to building control. Assuming you have planning for the house build, it should be easy to get permission for the static and do it legally. Alternatively as you are building a house, why not design it so you can build one wing of it first and kit that out to live in while you build the rest? That way all your work is permanent and gets you to a finished house quicker. You can think of outbuildings for holiday use after the main house is built, but do them properly. Really good point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul29 Posted September 20 Author Share Posted September 20 3 hours ago, mjc55 said: Was going to ask about the problems with an 8m span, as savasteading asks why cant you add a wall? Load bearing walll to split the span? was looking at rafters instead, mainly to keep the living area open plan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 Once you go over 4.8m span you're in a different world of cost and difficulty. Stay within standard timber lengths wherever possible. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saveasteading Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 4 hours ago, Paul29 said: rafters instead, mainly to keep the living area open plan It's great to be ambitious. A temporary and cheap building, without regulations, but luxurious too. Wouldn't it be good if you didn't need rafters at all. It's just reality though. Also a big empty box is very weak against dominoing. Cross walls stiffen the building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozza Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 Two static caravan linked together by a canopied communal area. Convert the living end of one of them to sleeping areas so you have one for pure sleeping. The other one for daytime use with adjacent fully insulated storage building nicely done out inside for the kids to hang out in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaymd_123 Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 On 20/09/2024 at 08:38, Russell griffiths said: how about a big triple garage with granny flat above, build that first and it’s there forever. May be a stupid question, but wouldn't this cost a small fortune (i.e. 4x more than his £25k rent). Curious because we considered a granny anex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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