Driveway rainwater control & flooding

[pudding]

Hey all, 

 

I've had a longstanding issue with our driveway and rainwater runoff from the fields above us on the hillside. When we bought our plot and built our house about 10years ago, the fields were grass and had livestock in them. We had a channel drain put in at the top of the new driveway to catch rainwater running down the road. This was all fine for a couple of years, rain soaked into the grassy fields and just the rain falling on the road went into the channel drain which coped fine with that amount of water.

 

Then the tenant farmer changed in the field, he now plants crops, which drastically increases the amount of rainwater that runs off the fields, through hedges and onto the roads, as half the time, such as the last few months, the fields are just mud with nice trenches in from ploughing and the tractor wheels which channel large amounts of water from the whole field and dumps it onto the road.

 

This water is usually muddy and full of silt which clogs up the drain and slotted grills on top. I removed the grills and cleared all the mud last week thinking that might sort it, but despite that, the sheer amount of rain water that runs off fills and overwhelms the capacity of the drain which happened the very next day after clearing the mud out. This muddy water then flows down our driveway, and unfortunately we're the bottom of the 3 properties on the site, the water now goes straight down to our front door and house. There is another channel drain in front of our house, but that again doesn't cope with the huge amount of water that's now filling it. It was only designed I think to take the water falling directly on the tarmac driveway. This drain then overflows right in front of our house giving rise to a few inches of water, and has in the past been just cm from entering our front door. Now in the last couple of weeks, the soakaway where all this water goes has been backing up and water coming up and out of the metal lid, so I assume the soakaway is getting clogged with all the silt and crap going into it.

 

Here's some pics of the area. This is looking up the lane, fields on the right, and channel drain in the middle with a few grills off from when I cleared the mud.

Looking down the lane.

Here's the channel drain full and the water is just flowing over the top. This was before the mud was cleared out and it was just lightish rain. When it rains heavy, a LOT more water flows at this drain and even with the mud cleared, just fills it and then flows straight past it as if it weren't even there.

We then get a nice stream going down our driveway down to our house at the bottom around the corner there.

Then the ACO drain, hidden beneath the muddy water, in front of our house just fills up before this amount of water can drain away, and theres a couple of inches or water up against the stone wall there.

 

So, I need to come up with a solution to stop this before the soakaway is completely buggered, and so our front door can be used without having to navigate a stream and sludge with the potential flooding, and ensure the water doesn't get into our house.

 

My thinking is some kind of hump/lump/slope at the top of the driveway to completely stop the water getting onto the driveway in the first place, although I'm not sure of the best way to build that. Tarmac/concrete/granite setts/speed bumps/something else? And then build the bump in front of the drain, or behind it?

 

Or, dig the channel drain out completely and put in something else better? Or.....

 

Any suggestions and comments appreciated. Would love to get this sorted soon before the next deluge. Not too nice wondering if the next downpour is going to make its way into the house. Pretty stressful and anxiety inducing as I work away from home and can't always be there to put concrete blocks and things in the way to try and divert the water away from the house and front door. Also slightly complicated by the fact the driveway isn't owned by is, its the neighbours and we just have access rights over. They're not affected by this problem, so cheaper solutions the better in the hope of splitting costs.

 

Cheers.

 

 

[Conor]

Feckin farmers. The hoops I had to jump through and measures I had to take to stop silt running off my site in to the river was huge. I had to provide a report with photos proving I'd taken the required steps. Mean while farmer Willie up the road has a 10 acre field ploughed bear all winter, loses 10s of tonnes of soil every time it rains. Totally fine....

 

That's serious run-off... I think you need something like a cattle grid with massive sump, with overflow going to a ditch or watercourse. 

 

Or speak to the council / highways? 

[Jilly]

He needs to learn about ‘no-till’ farming which is becoming all the rage. Groundswell try to educate farmers away from this type of farming which depletes the soil and is not sustainable in the long term. 

[ProDave]

What is needed is drainage ditches across the driveway.  I don't know how to describe what i see often but a 6" wide trench across the drive with a hard edge both sides, a car will drive over it slowly (inverted speed hump) and the water will run into the channel and off to the side.

 

Of course it relies on somewhere for it to run to but onto (note ONTO not under) a field will do.

 

The whole point is keep it on the surface and push it onto adjoining land to soak in or run off.  Trying to lose that much muddy water will just clog any underground soakaway.

 

A neighbour here achieves the same thing with a speed bump across his driveway, it pushed the water down hill past his drive to carry on down hill and be someone elses problem.

[Kelvin]

There’s a trail about the road that runs past our plot that runs with water in the winter so much it overflows onto the road and into our garden. I cut shallow trenches in the trail at angle against the water and built up the back edge of each trench. The water now runs down the opposite side of the trail and into the ditch rather than across the road. It needs maintenance though every month or so. 

[saveasteading]

5 hours ago, pudding said:

hump/lump/slope at the top of the driveway to completely stop the water getting onto the driveway

That's the easy way. It is often best for it to be diagonal across the track, whatever keeps the water moving downhill.

 

Farmers are supposed to plough along the contours, so the field holds maximum water. I don't think anyone imposes this  though.

 

[Andehh]

Are you able to divert the lower point of the aco back to the road or verge? Or cut the end off it and extend the cut beyond your grounds? Remove the metal top and just leave it as an exposed channel during the winter?

[Kelvin]

12 minutes ago, Andehh said:

Are you able to divert the lower point of the aco back to the road or verge? Or cut the end off it and extend the cut beyond your grounds? Remove the metal top and just leave it as an exposed channel during the winter?

The water is so muddy it will just fill up with silt. He needs to stop it getting down to the house. Enough rain and the house will be flooded. 

[pudding]

I tried leaving the top grills of the aco off, makes no difference when there's heavy rain, it just fills with water too quickly before it drains away and is then bypassed. The lowest point of the ACO currently comes out of a pipe onto the road, which then flows away fine carrying on down the lane. You can just see the top of the pipe in the puddle of water near bottom of first pic. So just need the best method of stopping the water getting onto the driveway and getting it to a similar point and it'll just continues to flow down the lane.

 

I'd like to get something in place so that I don't need to worry about what the farmer is doing. I could speak to him, and he might change his ways and plough the countours for a while, but then in future/new tenant farmer, who knows..? I want to take them out of the equation.

 

 

[joe90]

13 hours ago, ProDave said:

The whole point is keep it on the surface and push it onto adjoining land to soak in or run off.  Trying to lose that much muddy water will just clog any underground soakaway.

 

A neighbour here achieves the same thing with a speed bump across his driveway, it pushed the water down hill past his drive to carry on down hill and be someone elses problem.

I agree, stop the water from actually getting onto your drive/land, I have a similar drive near me where a tarmac “speed hump” stops the water flowing onto the drive and flows down the road.

[pudding]

So, best plan seems to be a speed bump. Is tarmac the best option, laid directly onto the tarmac behind the ACO drain? What kind, any in particular? And just a pile of tarmac moulded into shape or anything in/under it to form the bump? Ok to lay it straight onto the driveway tarmac? I guess I'll give it a good jetwashing to clean it, and then maybe blowtorch to warm it up and get it sticky before putting on the new tarmac to try and get them to stick together?

[Andehh]

Please let us know how you get on, but your approach seems sound!

[ProDave]

Another thought.  How many properties does that serve and who owns it?  It might be better to do any works needed right at the top and share the costs?

[Gone West]

5 hours ago, pudding said:

So, best plan seems to be a speed bump. Is tarmac the best option, laid directly onto the tarmac behind the ACO drain?

Many years ago I had a problem with water running off the road onto my drive. I spoke to Highways about it and they put a 40mm high mound of tarmac along the length of the drive. They said 40mm was the highest they could safely put it.

[saveasteading]

6 hours ago, pudding said:

blowtorch to warm it up and get it sticky before putting on the new tarmac to try and get them to stick together?

Memory tells me there is a bitumen tack paint, with a lot of solvent in it to make the existing bitumen sticky.

Failing that then any bitumen paint probably.

Tarmac is only about 5% bitumen, and the surface wears down to all stone, so there won't be much to melt.

[pudding]

The driveway serves 3 properties. The top one, the old farmhouse owns the land, we just have access rights down it to our property. The drain is right at the top of the driveway, then public highways for the lane, so the plan of tarmac bump behind the ACO is right at the top. I'll try my best to get them to share costs, hopefully they're feeling receptive to that, as the issue doesn't affect them, just us at the bottom of the driveway/courtyard. More importantly hopefully they'll be happy with me building a bump at the top of what is their land and their driveway!

 

I could try and contact highways, but I thought they wouldn't be interested as the road isn't flooding so it's not their problem?

 

Bitumen tack paint or paint sounds great, will look into that. Also, where's best to get bags of tarmac and any particular kinds/brands to get/avoid? Also, would it be worth cutting grooves or holes in the existing tarmac to help the new key/stick in and not flatten and spread, particularly going downhill?

 

Edited January 8 by pudding

[saveasteading]

4 hours ago, pudding said:

where's best to get bags of tarmac

Bags of tarmac are available in all builders' merchants and some diy stores.

However it isn't very strong. it is made with very small stones and high solvent bitumen, which hardens by evaporation.

It is for patching and potholes really.  this bag is about £8 and you'd need a few. Maybe try it?

 

Proper Bitumen Macadam comes from specialist suppliers, supplied hot. 

You can get it delivered or collect it.

It then has to be laid and compacted while hot, so it's best to use a specialist contractor.

It is made from a mix of stone, with the bitumen binding them, and goes very hard.

 

How much do you need?

eg if it is a 5m long bund, then you have say  400 wide x 30 average deep x 5m..   5 x .4 x .03  = 0.06m3 or 0.152 tonnes. Not a lot really.

So it might be a 'leftovers' job for a contractor after a bigger job up the road.

 

Or do it in concrete. It won't last long  but at least you are protected for a while.