Insulhub Isotex Voluntary Liquidation

[Kelvin]

13 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

you had to pay cash ?

Bank transfer I expect. It’s how we’ve paid for our timber kit. As I said above I tried for months to get them to commit to some form of financial protection including not paying the stage payments until they came up with a solution. I was technically in breach of contract. In the I had no choice but to pay it or we wouldn’t have hit my deadline of April. 

[Kelvin]

7 minutes ago, Jamie Kent said:

what should we have done?

It doesn’t sound as if you had many options. The one thing I considered was an insurance policy but it was too dear (20% of contract value) 

[Dave Jones]

9 minutes ago, Jamie Kent said:

what should we have done?

 

paid a small amount on either a debit card linked to an account with an overdraught or bank transfer from same account. Either way you would be fully protected.

[nickw]

Yup just heard , took our last payment only last month or so , blocks due now , must have known they were in trouble , didnt stop them taking my money , with durisol gone and now these clowns , shafted would be how i feel right now, same as alot of people I guess.

[nickw]

4 hours ago, Jamie Kent said:

No to all the above. They wouldn't take card payment- I voiced my concerns but they said their order books are full and they have no problems.   Big lesson learnt..! 

 Full order books , yeah they took on some from Durisol , so i feel if anyone has lost out twice

[Kelvin]

47 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

paid a small amount on either a debit card linked to an account with an overdraught or bank transfer from same account. Either way you would be fully protected.

Can you link to where this protection is documented as it would helpful for others to be aware of it

[Chanmenie]

3 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

 

paid a small amount on either a debit card linked to an account with an overdraught or bank transfer from same account. Either way you would be fully protected.

So how does bank transfer give any protection ? 
I’ve  been told by my bank that I have no protection because I did a bank transfer 

[Kelvin]

11 minutes ago, Chanmenie said:

So how does bank transfer give any protection ? 
I’ve  been told by my bank that I no protection because I did a bank transfer 

I’ve been googling and can’t find anything providing the full protection that’s being suggested. 
 

Section 75 only applies to credit cards up to £30k and sometimes more than this. 
 

Your bank might voluntarily provide debit card protection via chargeback. 
 

I can’t find anything about being protected when using an overdraft (or bank loan for that matter) under section 75. 

[Marvin]

Hi @Chanmenie

 

This might help:

 

https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/credit-and-purchases/how-youre-protected-when-you-pay-by-card

[Marvin]

Quote:

 

Section 75 protection if you pay a deposit by credit card

You don’t need to pay the full price by credit card to get section 75 protection. It’s enough to just pay the deposit to get you the legal protection.

For example, if you bought something costing £200 but paid a deposit of £20 on your credit card and the rest by other means (eg via debit card or cash) you’d still be covered and you would be able to claim the whole £200 (and not just the deposit) from your credit card company if the goods didn’t arrive or were faulty.

You can also make a claim for more than just the price of the items. For example, if you could claim from the supplier for additional expenses (such as postage) or consequential losses (such as damage caused by a faulty item), then you can also make a section 75 claim for these with your credit card company.

[Chanmenie]

1 minute ago, Marvin said:

Hi @Chanmenie

 

This might help:

 

https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/credit-and-purchases/how-youre-protected-when-you-pay-by-card

Yeah I know that but we didn’t pay by card it was bank transfer hence we won’t get anything back 

[Susie]

2 hours ago, Dave Jones said:

 

paid a small amount on either a debit card linked to an account with an overdraught or bank transfer from same account. Either way you would be fully protected.

It doesn’t sound like the purchasers had much choice it was pay by credit transfer or go else where.  Many companies only take money in by direct transfer.  My company does not take credit cards mainly because we do mostly business to business transactions but do get asked occasionally and I have to say no because of the fees involved in taking the payment by card. 

I’m not aware how having an overdraft makes any difference for protection. Do you have any info on this @Dave Jones
 

I hope when the time comes for me to pay for my ICF blocks the company accepts cards. 
 

it must be very difficult for all the purchasers my thoughts are with you all.

[Nickfromwales]

37 minutes ago, Susie said:

I hope when the time comes for me to pay for my ICF blocks the company accepts cards.

Who are you going with? If you don't mind me asking of course.

[Nickfromwales]

For comparison.

 

I run a business, and for a couple of clients projects I didn't get paid back what I had shelled out from my account on variation orders ( 5 figures worth on each build ) which they now own and enjoy, daily. This ran me bone dry, and it was quite difficult to stay afloat.

Worse still, whilst owing me money, the same clients managed to see gaps in my bookkeeping and play that to their advantage, SUCCESSFULLY suing ME when I refused to continue making their project asset rich ( due to the chuffing non-payment!!! DUH!! ). It makes my blood boil typing this btw, as I ended up robbing Peter to pay Paul and that caused upset to some of my genuine clients when I had to delay ( long delay ) delivering on my promises to them. All since refunded and at zero balance, I hasten to add, with sincere apologies given. The 2 aforementioned assholes are not included, they can come get their money from my cold dead fingers, or die trying.

 

I have kept the 'doors open' despite being over £40k out of pocket, and I had always understood that I will recover, which I have done, ( because I am a tenacious bastard who makes lemonade when given lemons ), and that was the ethos upon which I kept taking deposits for new projects from my downstream clients. As folk above have said "lesson learned", but a bloody painful and expensive one to boot.

 

To hear that members here were asked for money as recently as March is just black and white, it is theft. Theft is generally defined in law as "an intent to deprive". That was demonstrated here, and I am sincerely gutted for those who have been fcuked over by this disingenuous behavior.

 

I frequent a lot of the public self-build exhibition shows, per annum, as an exhibitor. I have worked alongside Jamie and we often spoke at the shows, and I am shocked to hear this has gone on if I'm honest. Just goes to show, yet again, that the people I often aspired to become as successful as, are just putting on a show. He once shouted across the Farnborough exhibition floor "you're a knobhead" at me, as I had ( in his eyes ) berated the Isotex woodcrete block on here. Doubt that I need to finish this anecdote.....

[Susie]

8 hours ago, Nickfromwales said:

Who are you going with? If you don't mind me asking of course.

If we ever manage to get a local builder to quote I will use RWall blocks simply because they are local. My plan now is to make payment and collect same day.
Started back in October getting quotes for next year as every one says you need to book the builder early a few have been round seemed interested then not responding. had one quote so far. 
ICF Homes are also on my list but no quote back yet I think they use Nudura and Jackon. I hope they take card payments. 
We need a new protection like we have with cards payments when we pay direct through the bank. 

[Nickfromwales]

47 minutes ago, Susie said:

If we ever manage to get a local builder to quote I will use RWall blocks simply because they are local. My plan now is to make payment and collect same day.
Started back in October getting quotes for next year as every one says you need to book the builder early a few have been round seemed interested then not responding. had one quote so far. 
ICF Homes are also on my list but no quote back yet I think they use Nudura and Jackon. I hope they take card payments. 
We need a new protection like we have with cards payments when we pay direct through the bank. 

If you want contact details for an excellent guy for Nudura, let me know. I've mentioned him on here a couple of times, and he has  recently completed one BH members house, and is 2/3rds of the way currently on another BH members build. His work is fantastic, straightest walls I've seen since being in this industry, and super reliable / trustworthy, ( caveat is, that he is quite expensive, but this is value for money as putting a wonky finished ICF house straight is a 5-figure setback ).

[Marvin]

5 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

His work is fantastic, straightest walls I've seen since being in this industry, and super reliable / trustworthy, ( caveat is, that he is quite expensive, but this is value for money as putting a wonky finished ICF house straight is a 5-figure setback ).

As my brother says if your paying the money you make the choice!

Edited April 7, 2023 by Marvin

[Nickfromwales]

Just now, Marvin said:

As my brother says if your paying the money you make the choice!

Indeed, just I've seen first hand what it takes to get woodcrete airtight, and the rain just gets into the house until you're 100% complete outside. Worse detail of the Isotex block is the woodcrete bridge in the cavity, which joins water and air directly to the house interior leaf.

Velox wasn't much easier, but they use a metal tie to keep the internal and external leafs in place, but all the way up to having the UFH pipes installed and getting the screed down, there would often be a little river appear and start meandering through a room. That only stops with woodcrete once you're totally weathertight externally, which is a ball-ache if you're building through a winter, not so impactful if not.

 

EPS systems are weathertight from the moment you plonk the last block down, really allows you to get going on the inside without delays.

 

I could also see daylight out of a lot of the bottom corners of the Isotex project, where the concrete pour didn't get to the slab, which likely answers somewhat for the AT score of 3.....  

 

The Velox build was one where the builder and his team were meticulous and easy to engage with, so I managed to liaise with the builder and the client to parge / seal with Passive Purple ( liquid AT membrane ) and install membranes appropriately, and that got a score of 0.88. This was let down by the Ideal Combi doors, so I am expecting a better result when it gets tested as-built. If the doors were sealed for the provisional test, I am confident we'd have got that under 0.6 ACH. Quite a result for a woodcrete structure tbh.

[ChrisDL]

I have also fallen foul of the Insulhub liquidation. Slightly different from some of the poor people here in the fact I have probably 3/4 of the materials to finish the house - but not enough to finish and no garage....

 

What is also so disappointing is the support and knowledge has been pulled from under our feet as well...

 

I notice @Nickfromwales comments in not recommending a Woodcrete block... which is a shame since I have one! I was considering a parge coat and was relying on Insulhubs team to guide me.... unlikely to happen now I suspect. I am wondering what the recommendation to might be to those of us with a partially built project? Just mix in Nudura?

 

Many thanks,

 

Chris

[Nickfromwales]

1 minute ago, ChrisDL said:

I have also fallen foul of the Insulhub liquidation. Slightly different from some of the poor people here in the fact I have probably 3/4 of the materials to finish the house - but not enough to finish and no garage....

 

What is also so disappointing is the support and knowledge has been pulled from under our feet as well...

 

I notice @Nickfromwales comments in not recommending a Woodcrete block... which is a shame since I have one! I was considering a parge coat and was relying on Insulhubs team to guide me.... unlikely to happen now I suspect. I am wondering what the recommendation to might be to those of us with a partially built project? Just mix in Nudura?

 

Many thanks,

 

Chris

Sorry to hear that. Is yours their 380mm ( iirc ) block?

[ChrisDL]

16 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

Sorry to hear that. Is yours their 380mm ( iirc ) block?

Hi Nick - Yes it is the 380's.

[Nickfromwales]

2 minutes ago, ChrisDL said:

Hi Nick - Yes it is the 380's.

I'll PM you now.

[Dave Jones]

11 hours ago, Susie said:

It doesn’t sound like the purchasers had much choice it was pay by credit transfer or go else where.  Many companies only take money in by direct transfer.  My company does not take credit cards mainly because we do mostly business to business transactions but do get asked occasionally and I have to say no because of the fees involved in taking the payment by card. 

I’m not aware how having an overdraft makes any difference for protection. Do you have any info on this @Dave Jones
 

I hope when the time comes for me to pay for my ICF blocks the company accepts cards. 
 

it must be very difficult for all the purchasers my thoughts are with you all.

 

When paying with borrowed money you are covered by cca. Martin Lewis brought it up ages ago.

 

So easy to fully protect yourself when doing a bank transfer.

[Dave Jones]

12 hours ago, Chanmenie said:

So how does bank transfer give any protection ? 
I’ve  been told by my bank that I have no protection because I did a bank transfer 

 

perhaps my English isnt good the key word is, O V E R D R A U G H T

 

You are paying using borrowed money same as a credit card.

[PeterW]

8 minutes ago, Dave Jones said:

 

When paying with borrowed money you are covered by cca. Martin Lewis brought it up ages ago.

 

So easy to fully protect yourself when doing a bank transfer.

No you’re not - you’ve got this confused over the protection under the CCA and product specific loans.

 

If you had taken out a credit agreement with the supplier, for specific products and the payment is made from the finance provider to the supplier directly, then the goods are protected from point of payment until the goods fully pass to you when settlement has been made. The key here is who makes the transaction. If the supplier defaults then the agreement is then void as the finance provider is partly liable for recovery - it’s how you can get issues resolved on faulty goods by getting the finance house to get involved. 
 

What Martin Lewis was referring to was the voluntary scheme that some banks offer, and that is where issues occur and you’ve taken out a specific loan for goods, and they may assist with chargeback but again it relates to debit card payment chargebacks and not bank transfers.

sadly, bank transfers are the least safest method for consumer protection but becoming the norm.