Tin Soldier Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 So, as part of my building warrant I require to have onsite storage of water for a fire engine to use in the event of a fire. They fire dept originally requested 23000 litres, but have compromised on 10,000 that's a fair size tank.. Above ground tanks come in at £1100, plus extortionate delivery to where I live (rural Aberdeenshire). The wife thinks they are massive and ugly. Underground tanks are easily double the cost. Any suggestions for cheaper alternatives to storing 10,000 litres, preferably underground. I have land, I have a digger, a willingness to work and a steading roof that could supply the water. 10x IBC Tanks?, some sort of waterproof chamber? any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Swimming pool? Obviously swim in it then use the water in an emergency. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassanclan Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Swimming pool is a good idea actually! Duck pond would be a cheaper alternative, depending on fire requirements for water cleanliness etc Is there a nearby brook/stream which you might be able to divert, or get a wayleave to put some sort of pipe system in place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I've read they do this is Australia quite often due to their bush fires: http://www.aussiepumps.com.au/pumps-cleaning-equipment-news/swimming-pool-fire-pump.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexphd1 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Hi. Two friends been faced with the same problem in the shire, one made a pond then filled it in after the building warrant was passed the other installed a sprinkler system on a diy basis (done a course to become a installer). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oz07 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I'd have said pond too. 4/5m square and deep enough for the 10000. Sure their pumps pumps can handle pond water Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I worked for a while at an office and lab at the top of Portsdown Hill, Portsmouth. The water pressure up there was too low to use for fire fighting, or the main was too small, I'm not sure which, but the solution was to build large ornamental ponds at the front of the building that doubled up as a source of water for fire fighting. Something similar was done at another place I worked at for a time, Abbey Wood, near Bristol. There the large ponds also acted as storm water run off storage, as well as providing water for fire fighting. I think it's a fairly common commercial solution to this problem, so it should work OK for a domestic situation. 10,000 litres isn't massive for a pond, and could be pretty easily created with a digger and pond liner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, Tin Soldier said: So, as part of my building warrant I require to have onsite storage of water for a fire engine to use in the event of a fire. They fire dept originally requested 23000 litres, but have compromised on 10,000 that's a fair size tank.. Above ground tanks come in at £1100, plus extortionate delivery to where I live (rural Aberdeenshire). The wife thinks they are massive and ugly. Underground tanks are easily double the cost. Any suggestions for cheaper alternatives to storing 10,000 litres, preferably underground. I have land, I have a digger, a willingness to work and a steading roof that could supply the water. 10x IBC Tanks?, some sort of waterproof chamber? any ideas? Pond or bathing pond. As a pond you only need it to be half metre by 4m by 5m or similar. If you are worried about kids etc make it shallow or with a grid or raised at waist or chest level. Can you take inspiration from the Tank Court at Folly Farm, the r have a reflecting pool on your best facade? I love ponds which are high enough to sit on a wall top bench at the same height as the water. If you insist on underground then can you combine it with your rainwater storage in some way say under the drive, and even use it for watering the garden as well? Obviously 10 cubic m becomes your standing level. I think a 2m section of 2.5m concrete pipe sunk in the ground with a liner will hold just under your volume. So Large size drainage pipes and inspection chambers might be one place to look. Retailers like Buildbase Civil or the correct suppliers to utilities or a relevant bit of St Gobain may help. I guess that aqua-berms are not permanent enough. But us there anything else made of fabric? Anything along these lines: http://www.molatank.com/china-mola_tank_flexible_and_portable_pvc_plastic_scaffolding_water_tank_700l_10000l-7705981.html Ferdinand Edited July 21, 2017 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Or these people http://www.ecosure.co.uk/storage-tanks/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Park one of these in the garden. Other brands are available: Be honest, how likely's a fire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 3 hours ago, Tin Soldier said: So, as part of my building warrant I require to have onsite storage of water for a fire engine to use in the event of a fire. They fire dept originally requested 23000 litres, but have compromised on 10,000 [...] any ideas? The storage system isn't going to be the problem. It's the long term maintenance cost. Underground, away from light, refresh continuously - rainwater recycle tank? Filter the incoming free water. Two filters, one coarse, one fine. Occasionally (once a year) put some aluminium sulphate (spoonful) in the water : let it settle the rubbish out to the bottom, and then flush the tank out fully and replenish. Maybe think about putting a length of copper pipe on the supply side (copper sulphate helps clean the water) Main thing keep light away from it. Keep it child-safe. Make sure you can drain it completely and have access to clean it out. Dig a deep sump so you can flush it all away: every last drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 Thanks people, great responses been talking over a pond with the wife, looks like a go-er 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexphd1 Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Where abouts in Aberdeenshire are you building? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 An interesting article: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/11731847/Natural-swimming-ponds-should-you-build-one-in-your-garden.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triassic Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 How about using storm water runoff crates wrapped in pond liner. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=storm+water+runoff+crates&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted July 24, 2017 Author Share Posted July 24, 2017 Alex- I'm building in the cheap side of the shire, Quilquox, Ythanbank in the Bermuda triangle between Auchnagatt, Ellon and Methlick Its a large (~130m2) extension I'm building Onoff, thanks, very interesting. Triassic, I think we're talking the same kind of money for crates as a tank, I'll have a shift though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 I used 20 crates to build our surge storage, that's under the drive. Each crate has a capacity of 196 litres, IIRC, so we have a permeable "tank " that's a bit under 4,000 litres. The total cost, including the excavation, came to around £1k, IIRC, but I bought the heavy duty Aquacell crates very cheaply from a local chap that had loads of surplus ones from a big road job (I think I paid around £20 a crate, delivered) so saved around £1k on the price of the crates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 2 hours ago, Triassic said: How about using storm water runoff crates wrapped in pond liner. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=storm+water+runoff+crates&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari You'd still have to be super careful surely about puncturing that liner and bugger about with EPS up the sides etc. A bitch to find the leak too whereas with a pond..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitpipe Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 1000l IBC tanks are cheap, can be had for £25 each plus delivery. I have a thread here on building a 4000l rainwater storage facilty, tanks are now in-situ and just need to plumb together. They cant be buried direct in ground though, you would need to excavate a chamber and build a box to hold them in, guessing by the time you did that you'd be better getting a dedicated tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) Been worrying at this one. As you say transport of 10,000l tanks is the difficult bit. I can buy one 100 miles from here for £749 for an above ground tank (you put eg trellis round it), but it will cost £200 to get here (never mind Aberdeen), and at 2.7m diameter it is 6 inches over the maximum limit that can be towed. If it was only a few miles cross-country I might chance that were I needing one. There are ones by eg Enduramaxx that are within the 2.55m, but again - you are back up to your £1000 plus carriage. However, so my last divergent thought anything suitable that is used by aquaculture or fish farming, given where you are? They must store the reserve fresh water for the indoor fish etc in *something*. Or any fish farming establishments going bust? Ferdinand Edited July 24, 2017 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 (edited) 10 tanks £350. Found some in Mintlaw: https://www.gumtree.com/p/other-miscellaneous-goods/ibc-containers-for-sale-£35-each/1254379277 Surely they would deliver free for 10? Pretty sure the Brain's Trust on here could fathom (little water related pun there ) a method of branched pipework for filling and rapid draw off. How would you stop them freezing? Edited July 24, 2017 by Onoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 You can bury IBCs but they need to be either concreted in or supported in some way as they can be stacked full up to 4 high. That to me is a 3000kg static load through the bottom one - most likely through the trellis and corners so they can take a fair bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 Thanks guys, some really good suggestions here, which I'll be looking at during my time off next week Mintlaws not far from me, in terms of collection IBC's Pond's still looking like the most likely option at the moment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitpipe Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 On 24/07/2017 at 17:41, Onoff said: Pretty sure the Brain's Trust on here could fathom (little water related pun there ) a method of branched pipework for filling and rapid draw off. @PeterW figured it all out for me in my RWH thread above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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