shipping from Spain to UK

[Tom]

We've bought a woodburner from Spain but need to ship it here ourselves, cosmic. We had just about agreed a fee with a pallet haulier when they turned round and said they can't do it for us as we aren't VAT registered. Is this correct? It's for our new build, so at the end of the day we would be reclaiming the VAT anyway (though have paid the Spanish VAT). What options do we have? Has anyone shipped something similar from the EU to the UK recently? Is this going to turn in to another nightmare (to add to the list)?

Thanks all

[ProDave]

But following Brexit, can you just import a Spanish VAT paid item to the UK?  Surely now the Spanish supplier would have to sell it ex VAT as it is leaving the EU and then you pay UK VAT on import (which you later claim back).

 

That is probably why they are looking for a VAT registered agent to handle it?

[Roger440]

Dave is correct. Why are you paying spanish VAT? Either, they are not VAT registered themselves, truly dumb, or taking the p and charging an extra 20 something % because they can.

[dpmiller]

certainly for the GB to NI jaunt, many pallet companies don't have the ability to ship to an address that doesn't have an EORI number. The legislation OTOH allows for private individuals to receive goods *without* said number...

[Tom]

Not too bothered about having to pay the Spanish VAT tbh, just need to get the thing in to the UK.

[Bonner]

Have a look at expat forums. When parents had a place in Spain there were a few ‘men in vans’ shuttling stuff back and forth.

[Iceverge]

1 hour ago, Roger440 said:

Dave is correct. Why are you paying spanish VAT? Either, they are not VAT registered themselves, truly dumb, or taking the p and charging an extra 20 something % because they can.

 

 

It's working, or rather not working the other way around too. Several smaller UK companies I've asked for quotes have been unable to ship to Ireland without UK VAT as the paperwork isn't worth their time . 

 

The resulting double VAT makes items too expensive usually.  

 

@Tom, perhaps contacting a local haulage firm might be the way to go, a neighbour brought several pallets of Spanish slate back here on an empty return trip of a cattle lorry if all things a few years back very reasonably. 

[saveasteading]

I would rather pay the spanish vat and live with it. Not many spanish retailers will know or want the hassle of selling vat free and doing the paperwork.

There are very good spanish fires such as bronpi, half the uk price.

 

But buy for €500, ship for £200, pay uk tax.. barely worth it. 

I thought of putting a "used" one in the car instead of 48 bottles of wine, but they don't have direct air intakes.

 

There is import duty on anything over £300, (?) as well as vat.

From what i read, people are getting taxed on household fixtures and equipment....both directions, and most (under the radar) van services have packed in. 

It was always the case that uk costs were much higher, and crossing the water allowed a mark-up. But now we are abroad, it is on a different level.

 

Other examples. Roca wc set €120, or in uk £170.  Hansgrohe shower mixer €110, uk £160.  Vat included. But you can't claim the vat back in the uk unless it has been paid in uk, for obvious reasons. So, on balance, not worth it.

 

 

[saveasteading]

Taken in Spain, 2 minutes later a man was fixing sale stickers at 1 or 2 € less.

These are good quality too.

Worth filling the car? No.

 

[SteamyTea]

Was this why Sunak was saying that BREXIT is working.

Made it harder and more expensive to import what we actually want must improve the balance of payments.

It may be a mess to import, but at least it is a British mess, and we need to be proud of that.

[Roger440]

23 hours ago, Iceverge said:

 

 

It's working, or rather not working the other way around too. Several smaller UK companies I've asked for quotes have been unable to ship to Ireland without UK VAT as the paperwork isn't worth their time . 

 

The resulting double VAT makes items too expensive usually.  

 

@Tom, perhaps contacting a local haulage firm might be the way to go, a neighbour brought several pallets of Spanish slate back here on an empty return trip of a cattle lorry if all things a few years back very reasonably. 

 

Exporting WITH vat wont reduce the paperwork. If you dont fill in the commodity codes, its going nowhere. If you do, then why are you charging the customer VAT? Its exactly the same process as sending something to any other country. 

 

We do it every day. Its not hard. For export into europe, we use the DPD duty paid service. We collect the full amount with VAT, ship, and DPD pay the duty and VAT on behalf of the customer and back bill to us. We use the 20% extra collected to pay it. Completely seamless for customer, just as it was before.

 

If, as a business, you cant be arsed to do this, you clearly dont need the business. But dont say its hard or difficult, because its not. It only becomes difficult on very low value items.

 

[Iceverge]

3 hours ago, Roger440 said:

We collect the full amount with VAT, ship, and DPD pay the duty and VAT on behalf of the customer and back bill to us.

 

I'm a little lost here. As an EU customer of a UK item that is £1000 inc VAT and shipping how much do I pay as an end user in Ireland. VAT here is 23% 

 

Pre Brexit I could pay the UK seller £1000 and it would arrive at my door. 

[Temp]

On 25/11/2022 at 16:55, Tom said:

We've bought a woodburner from Spain but need to ship it here ourselves, cosmic. We had just about agreed a fee with a pallet haulier when they turned round and said they can't do it for us as we aren't VAT registered. Is this correct? It's for our new build, so at the end of the day we would be reclaiming the VAT anyway (though have paid the Spanish VAT). What options do we have? Has anyone shipped something similar from the EU to the UK recently? Is this going to turn in to another nightmare (to add to the list)?

Thanks all

 

Many carriers in Europe expect you to have an EORI number. I don't believe this is required by governments but many carriers have had problems accounting for VAT since Brexit and I've heard its now just their policy to request one. 

 

Quote

EORI number' is short for 'Economic Operators Registration and Identification Number' and is a system of unique identification numbers used by customs authorities throughout the European Union.

 

I believe individuals can apply for a UK EORI number but I dont know anyone that has. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Temp

[Roger440]

22 hours ago, Iceverge said:

 

I'm a little lost here. As an EU customer of a UK item that is £1000 inc VAT and shipping how much do I pay as an end user in Ireland. VAT here is 23% 

 

Pre Brexit I could pay the UK seller £1000 and it would arrive at my door. 

 

If we wanted be be clever, we could cater for the higher vat rate and duty via the website. As it is, i like simple. So effectively, we take the 3% hit on the extra VAt and another 3.5% on the duty in the case of ireland. But we could have a function that as soon as you entered your country, it recalculated the cost to reflect that. The shipping is what it is. Thats not changed. We always charged higher shipping costs to ireland than the UK. Because it costs more.

 

Pre leaving the EU, there were proposals to charge the destinations country VAT rate, in order to avoid those in high rate VAT countries purchasing from low rate ones. Dontr know how far that got, but it was inevitably coming.

 

My point is, if you want to make it an easy transaction for the customer, you can. It only falls over on low value stuff, because DPD charge a smalll fee for managing the payment. Its a flat rate per shipment. Our irish customers see no extra cost post brexit than they did before. Im happy that some of our competitors dont want to do this. All the better for us.

 

Edit to add, i didnt actually answer your question, what you "should" be paying, is £800 + shipping. Then on arrival, duty at the appropiate rate, and VAT on the cumalative total. Anyone charging you VAT on an export is either incomptent or a crook. Theres no complicated paper work. The invoice and the shipping details proving export is all you need to retain to keep HMRC happy that you didnt charge VAT. And your VAT return reflecting the correct numbers. But you have to do all of them anyway.

 

Anyone trying to charge me their VAT on somthing they were "exporting" would be told where to go in short order.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Roger440

[Roger440]

53 minutes ago, Temp said:

 

Many carriers in Europe expect you to have an EORI number. I don't believe this is required by governments but many carriers have had problems accounting for VAT since Brexit and I've heard its now just their policy to request one. 

 

 

I believe individuals can apply for a UK EORI number but I dont know anyone that has. 

 

Some carriers clearly have too much business!

[SteamyTea]

10 hours ago, Roger440 said:

Some carriers clearly have too much business!

Or are unwilling to do business that makes them a loss.  Exporting/Importing is all about marginal profitability, not absolute net profit.

'Turnover is vanity, profitability is sanity'

[billt]

13 hours ago, Temp said:

I believe individuals can apply for a UK EORI number but I dont know anyone that has. 

 

I have. I needed an SMA inverter fixed, SMA offered an exchange at a fair price but it would be sent from Germany. They wanted an EORI number and I got one. All done online; a bit tedious but not impossible. It'll probably never be used again.

[SteamyTea]

20 minutes ago, billt said:

It'll probably never be used again.

Lend it out on here, unless you are liable for the VAT/Import Duties, then don't.

[Tom]

To round this thread off, and in case it's of use to any one in the future, we found it cheaper, quicker and simpler to just use a freight-forwarding agent. We hade to produce an "invoice" with an EORI number on it (easy enough to get online) and various other bits of info, along with an origin of goods statement (stating it comes from the EU). Anyway, stove arrived on a FedEx van today so all good. Just need a house to put the thing in now.

[saveasteading]

Having been shocked at the cost of stove and, especially, flue compared to Spain, i have now reconsidered.

The flue supplied locally is in a different league, re joints, closures, and getting bits required to complete. Eg the plate to the ceiling is white, and vented,  as opposed to black and basic.

Joints seem to be much better, not just push fit and whatever mastic chooses to stay in place. And more.

Part of the difference is that spanish houses do not include timber, so the solutions are relatively primitive.

So we are at least double the cost, which will affect economic viability. But we need a second stove too, and it will also be obtained locally.