China21 Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Hi everyone Newbie here with an issue with my diy summerhouse build. I’ve built this at the top of my garden. The ground is very uneven and drops away from right to left and back to front. Even my house floor level is over 3 1/2ft from garden level at one end from my back door. The build is 2.5m high along the back from the ground up but on raised decking to the front, making the overall height at this point 2.8m. We are just under 1m from the side fencing and 2m from the rear. I’ve now received a breach of planning letter from the council as someone has lodged a complaint. I’ve spoken to the planning officer but he wasn’t very clear and just quoted the regulations under Class E. Could someone tell me if I’m too high at the front as what constitutes the ground in the case. Should I have built from 2.5m at all 4 corners? It has a flat roof. It’s a wooden frame construction built with 12mm ply and insulation board. We didn’t dig the ground out to level as my rear neighbour has well established 80ft trees along their fence line. Any advice would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markc Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) Should have been measured from the lowest point of the structure when on sloping ground. I did see one situation where neighbours garden was much lower and planning wanted the height measured from the neighbours level due to close proximity. also is it the structure or the raised deck that has prompted the complaint? Have you build a raised “spying” area that overlooks your neighbour? Edited November 11, 2022 by markc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China21 Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 (edited) I don’t know any details about the complaint. I just want to know what to do for the best. Even if it means taking the whole build down or do just need to lower the roof? Both my immediate neighbours knew about the build and have been fine. Edited November 11, 2022 by China21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russdl Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 @China21 my understanding is the 2.5m highest point should be measured from the highest ground so, in your situation, where the rear right is the highest ground then the front elevation should be no more than 2.5m above that. As the ground falls away back to front your front elevation should be 2.5m plus the amount of fall from the back right corner. if your roof slopes front to back and your back elevation is 2.5m then I suspect you may be a little too high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russdl Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 17 minutes ago, China21 said: I just want to know what to do for the best. If you are too high I would have thought the best solution is a retrospective planning application. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China21 Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 @Russdl thank you for responding. Can you tell me what a retrospective planning application would involve? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundtuit Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 To me, it sounds like you're within permitted development. I assume no one from the planning department has been out to have a look? If not, I'd politely push back until they come out and prove otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China21 Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 @Roundtuit thank you for responding- the PO wants photos rather than a site visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twice round the block Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Photos on here would have been a preferred way of us giving a proper opinion on whether this is a height, square footage, too close to a boundary, or over looking other peoples gardens or properties from your NEW view point. The planning department want photos so they can make an instant assessment as they are a bit behind with trying to get all the self builder's application's processed !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundtuit Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 It's worth checking the height of your raised decking is OK too. I think 300mm is the PD limit. If you're over that, you might want to think about building your ground level up a bit before you send a photo 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan F Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 @China21 Our garden building sounds exactly the same as yours, the back right corner along boundary is about 2.4m, but the front left corner is almost 2.9m. We had a complatin and the planning department visited. I explain that it was no higher than 2.5m at the back corner and they took measurements to confirm this and left. That doesn't mean all planner see it exactly the same way, but that was our experience, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 The general rules are.. – No outbuilding on land forward of a wall forming the principal elevation – Outbuildings and garages to be single storey with maximum eaves height of 2.5 metres and maximum overall height of 4 metres with a dual pitched roof or 3 metres for any other roof – Maximum height of 2.5 metres in the case of a building, enclosure or container within two metres of a boundary of the curtilage of the dwellinghouse – No verandas, balconies or raised platforms on outbuildings or sheds – No more than half the area of land around the “original house” would be covered by additions or other buildings – In National Parks, the Broads, Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty and World Heritage Sites the maximum area to be covered by buildings, enclosures, containers and pools more than 20 metres from house to be limited to 10 square metres – In National Parks, the Broads, Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty, conservation areas and World Heritage Sites, enclosures, containers and pools at the side of properties will require planning permission – Within the curtilage of listed buildings any outbuilding will require planning permission Heights of buildings are generally measured favourably to you. Eg measure from the highest ground adjacent to the building. Is there a raised bit of deck at the front? Can you post a photo? I think you might need to write back to the planning department to ask them to carify what the issue is as it appears to comply with permitted development rules. You can point out it's under 2.5m measured from the highest ground next to the building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyscotland Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 23 hours ago, Russdl said: @China21 my understanding is the 2.5m highest point should be measured from the highest ground Assuming you're in England. Weirdly in Scotland the allowed heights are similar but on sloping ground they're measured from the lowest ground adjacent to the building. No idea why we have the opposite rule to England, seems confusingly inconsistent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 13 minutes ago, andyscotland said: No idea why we have the opposite rule to England, seems confusingly inconsistent Because they want to show they are a separate country. Whatever I did, my sister would do the opposite, just to show her independence. @China21 Following with interest as I want to 'expand' my shed, and welcome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russdl Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 16 minutes ago, andyscotland said: Weirdly in Scotland the allowed heights are similar but on sloping ground they're measured from the lowest ground adjacent to the building. Now that is a significant difference! I had no idea. So @China21 could be absolutely fine/up shit creek looking for a paddle shop depending on which side of the border they reside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyscotland Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Russdl said: Now that is a significant difference! I had no idea. Indeed, I was lucky I found it as of course internet research overwhelmingly throws up guidance for England & Wales. It may be that's why a few of our height limits are slightly taller, to compensate for the difference if the ground is only mildly uneven. My hunch is @China21is in England/Wales as they mentioned Class E and our permitted development classes are numbered rather than lettered. But thought worth highlighting for anyone who might find this thread in the future. Edited November 12, 2022 by andyscotland 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russdl Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 9 minutes ago, andyscotland said: But thought worth highlighting for anyone who might find this thread in the future. Most definitely!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilly Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 I would sit tight and try to clarify the exact problem and see if you can rectify it cheaply first and prove you are or will make it within PD rights. A retrospective planning application just means you put in a planning application but put it in brackets to indicate it has already been built. Look for other examples on your council website or pay heaps for a planning consultant. If you have a visit from an enforcement officer you will get a feel for if it will pass or be refused. This will take many weeks. You can then check the Appeals process. It all depends how much the building cost/is important to you and how much hassle you can tolerate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conor Posted November 13, 2022 Share Posted November 13, 2022 @China21 if you are within 1m of a boundary, the structure must be made out of largely non-combustable materials. Sounds like it's mostly wood, so you've another issue to address. Solution might just b moving the whole thing so you're >1m from the boundary, allowing you to have higher eaves height (depends on your LA) and not fall foul of the non-combustable material issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan F Posted November 13, 2022 Share Posted November 13, 2022 5 hours ago, Conor said: if you are within 1m of a boundary, the structure must be made out of largely non-combustable materials. It's more about reaction to fire which depend more than anything on the surfaces of the construction. We have a wooden-frame garden room <1m from the boundary and what the building inspector asked for was i) fire-rated plasterboad internally ii) a render system with a satisfactory warrington fire certification externally. If it's <15m2 and not used for sleeping building regs don't apply though, still smart to take same precautions though. If @China21is in England my experience is that it's the higest ground level and there won't be an issue, but there is a chance that diffrent councils may interept things difrently given it's not 100% clear in the legislation. In order to exceed 2.5m you need to move the buiding 2+ meters from the boundary but even in this case the eaves are still limited to 2.5m, so this may not help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adsibob Posted November 13, 2022 Share Posted November 13, 2022 On 11/11/2022 at 09:02, Roundtuit said: politely push back until they come out and prove otherwise. No. You want to ignore it to see if they actually follow through with enforcement. Often councils are so short staffed they send the first notice and then don’t do anything else until it’stoo late. Depends how persistent the complainer is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundtuit Posted November 13, 2022 Share Posted November 13, 2022 2 hours ago, Adsibob said: No. You want to ignore it to see if they actually follow through with enforcement. I guess that depends on how you feel about the suggestion that you may be on the wrong side of planning law, and how comfortable you are with it being unresolved. Ignoring it wouldn't really work for me, but I can understand why some might take that route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adsibob Posted November 13, 2022 Share Posted November 13, 2022 41 minutes ago, Roundtuit said: I guess that depends on how you feel about the suggestion that you may be on the wrong side of planning law, and how comfortable you are with it being unresolved. Ignoring it wouldn't really work for me, but I can understand why some might take that route. I can’t remember how long, but after a certain number of years, the Council lose the right to enforce. It’s less than you would think, something like 4 years from the erection of a building. So if you have got evidence from when you put it up, that would be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China21 Posted November 25, 2022 Author Share Posted November 25, 2022 Thank you all for your advice. I’m now waiting for the planning officer to come out to view. So will update here once I’ve got an answer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilly Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 Best to start another thread for this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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