Sageglass live

[Jeremy Harris]

I'm very seriously thinking of replacing some of our glass with this some time in the next couple of years.  I know it's expensive, but it seems, from @NSS's experience, that it does a very good job indeed.  One thing I really like is that it works both ways, and is so easily controlled.  The reflective film we have fitted works well, but is like a one-way mirror, plus it lacks control.  It reduces solar gain when we could use it, as well as when we don't want it.  The icing on the cake is being able to use it as a privacy screen from outside to some extent - for us that is now a major consideration.

 

I need to explore the practicality of retrofitting this glazing system into some of our windows.  Thanks to @NSS for the review.

[NSS]

1 hour ago, SteamyTea said:

Be interesting to set one up that senses interior temperature as well.  If it is a simple control system it could work well for roof lights.

In theory, I can't see why that wouldn't be possible. Can feed back as a question to my Sageglass contacts if you like?

[SteamyTea]

Yes please.

I am sure Build Hub could cobble something together with a Pi Zero and a 1-wire sensor

Edited November 3, 2017 by SteamyTea

[NSS]

5 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Yes please.

I am Build Hub could cobble something together with a Pi Zero and a 1-wire sensor

LOL. Okay, I'll drop them an email. 

[NSS]

This page may be worth a read - https://www.sageglass.com/en/faqs/switchable-technology - and describes it as switchable glass that can be linked to building control systems, so presumably a range of data types could be used to switch it. It also makes clear (pardon the pun) that it is not 'privacy' glass. That is true as the view outwards is preserved, although the view inward (when tinted) is significantly diminished, so much so that we have no blinds/curtains at any of our Sage equipped windows, including our bedroom. 

[SteamyTea]

As long as I can make it do this:

 

[NSS]

Thought I'd update this thread with our experience to date. So far this month we've had 15 virtually cloudless days (out of 21) including a run of 8 consecutive such days. We've left the Sageglass in auto mode and it has worked extremely well in restricting the solar gain and effectively regulating the indoor temperature. Granted, the sun is relatively high in the sky now and approx 25% of the south-facing glass is shaded by our 50cm soffit overhang, but I'm pretty confident the Sageglass would cope even if we'd had such a run of cloudless days earlier in the year. 

 

So far, to coin an old Honda marketing strapline, it just works!

 

Edit to add: by the way, the privacy element is fine during daytime when the glass tints as it reflects like a black mirror when viewed from outside, but is far less effective at night when light are on inside. Suffice to say we now have blinds at the bedroom windows!

Edited May 21, 2018 by NSS

[Nickfromwales]

Thanks for the update. . 

[Gone West]

13 hours ago, NSS said:

So far, to coin an old Honda marketing strapline, it just works!

 

Sounds excellent, wish we could have afforded it.

[Florence Galan]

@NSS very nice job. It's look great. It's creative done.

[NSS]

15 hours ago, PeterStarck said:

Sounds excellent, wish we could have afforded it.

@PeterStarck, I accept the up front capital cost is high, but I'm beginning to think it's probably a very cost-effective solution in the longer term, and it's such an elegant one also.

 

Reading the latest in a long line of threads on the subject of overheating caused by excessive solar gain (posted by @lizzie ) it's obvious that this is a significant issue. It's also obvious that other solutions, such as solar reflective film, external blinds/shutters and the like, come at variable cost (both in capital and ongoing terms), and at least some form of aesthetic compromise.

 

Reflective film may (reasonably cheaply) cure the issue of too much gain, but it also stops you from benefitting from it when you want it, and that means spending more on heating the property year after year. I'd also question what it may look like after several years of exposure to the elements, window cleaning, etc.

 

External blinds/shutters will I'm sure be equally effective as reflective film (albeit at a significantly higher cost) and will allow the benefit of solar gain when desirable, but at the expense of the view out of the windows when you perhaps most want to enjoy it (and with the aesthetic compromise of the external frame/box of the blinds/shutters). And' of course, for such a solution to be reliably effective it needs to be automated, which I suspect brings this solution close to the extra cost of our Sageglass (bear in mind that whilst electro-chromic glazing is expensive, it replaces the 3G glazing units you'd otherwise be paying for). 

 

By contrast, excessive solar gain is controlled automatically but we still get the full benefit of it when desirable (reducing heating costs); the need for active cooling (and the cost thereof) is reduced/eliminated; there's no compromise to the external aesthetic of the building; and (perhaps best of all) we enjoy an uninterrupted view out, regardless of the solar intensity.

 

As I said previously, it just works.

[Gone West]

6 hours ago, NSS said:

Reflective film may (reasonably cheaply) cure the issue of too much gain, but it also stops you from benefitting from it when you want it, and that means spending more on heating the property year after year. I'd also question what it may look like after several years of exposure to the elements, window cleaning, etc.

 

We went for a solar heat gain reducing film because that particular window is large and only sees the sun in the late afternoon/evening for around four months of the year. It doesn't see the sun in the winter so there is no loss in solar gain in the winter. I like the Sageglass solution because it is neat and works automatically.

[NSS]

32 minutes ago, PeterStarck said:

We went for a solar heat gain reducing film because that particular window is large and only sees the sun in the late afternoon/evening for around four months of the year. It doesn't see the sun in the winter so there is no loss in solar gain in the winter. I like the Sageglass solution because it is neat and works automatically.

In that case, the film seems the logical (and most economic) solution for your specific situation ?

[NSS]

One thing I've kept meaning to do is to check the external and internal faces of the SageGlass units on a sunny day when in full tint. Well today's the day.

 

Temperatures as of 1.15pm (Sun direct in line of glazing)

 

External face temp of glass - 49.4C

Internal face temp of glass - 24.6C

External face of frame (Internorm Aluclad RAL 7016) - 50.1C

Internal face of frame (timber) - 26.0C

External wall temp alongside glazing (timber cladding) - 40.6C

Internal wall temp alongside glazing - 24.1C

 

Current room stat temp - 23.9C

 

Seems the heat transfer through the fully tinted glass is no worse (possibly a fraction better) than through the window frame.

 

 

 

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, NSS said:

Well today's the day.

Check it later as well. See if the temperature equalises once the sun goes down.

 

[lizzie]

Very Interesting @NSS. I am considering sage glass for a glass box extension.......(don’t ask folks!).  The heat transfer element of it is particularly interesting. Thank you, keep us updated.

[NSS]

6 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

Check it later as well. See if the temperature equalises once the sun goes down.

 

As requested, at 8.40pm 

 

External face temp of glass - 19.5C

Internal face temp of glass - 23.3C

External face of frame (Internorm Aluclad RAL 7016) - 20.5C

Internal face of frame (timber) - 23.7C

External wall temp alongside glazing (timber cladding) - 19.7C

Internal wall temp alongside glazing - 24.0C

 

Current room stat temp - 24.0C

Edited July 28, 2019 by NSS
Correction on room temp reading

[SteamyTea]

4 minutes ago, NSS said:

As requested, at 8.40pm 

Not dark here yet.

But it seems to heading towards parity considering that there is usually a 2° to 3°C temp difference inside a house.

[NSS]

3 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Not dark here yet.

But it seems to heading towards parity considering that there is usually a 2° to 3°C temp difference inside a house.

No, not dark here either, but sun down. I should have mentioned, we've had no doors or windows open, no active cooling on, and the MVHR has been running on the lowest fan speed on summer bypass. In fairness, it's been less sunny this afternoon than when I took the earlier readings with scattered cloud cover.

[SteamyTea]

@NSS What is your house made of?

[NSS]

7 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

@NSS What is your house made of?

Timber frame.

[SteamyTea]

Thanks.

[NSS]

4 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

Thanks.

No problem. Curious as to why you asked?

[lizzie]

Thanks @NSS that is good info.  I would be really interested to see how it performs over a span of different weather types if you have the time and patience to do it.

[NSS]

30 minutes ago, lizzie said:

Thanks @NSS that is good info.  I would be really interested to see how it performs over a span of different weather types if you have the time and patience to do it.

Hi @lizzie, will endeavour to oblige but in its tinted state I imagine it performs much the same as any 3G glazing.